Originally posted by SurturSaid the guy who doesn't want to listen to anyone else, but instead condescends down his nose to his own countrymen with a smugness that pushes people further way, instead of trying to genuinely convince them that their fears for the future are misplaced and reassure them that they're all in this together as Americans.
I think it's more like if the 47.79% of American voters actually listened to anyone but themselves..they wouldn't have had to worry about the other side getting 47.3% of votes.This is indeed a lesson about listening. I will grant you, a majority on that side don't seem to want to hear that particular lesson, but meh.
Better to divide and mock, even in victory.
Originally posted by Silent MasterYou're hardly worth the effort.
That didn't answer my question.
Well back to the topic, Trump isn't in office yet and it's hard to tell at this point what truly will happen. He seems like he is willing to compromise, perhaps too much for some on the Republican side.
On the other hand people have called him a con man, and this could just be another con: try to alleviate post election tension by making people think you might go easy on certain issues.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Said the guy who doesn't want to listen to anyone else, but instead condescends down his nose to his own countrymen with a smugness that pushes people further way, instead of trying to genuinely convince them that their fears for the future are misplaced and reassure them that they're all in this together as Americans.Better to divide and mock, even in victory.
Lol oh please dude. It hasn't even been a week yet. There will be plenty of time to listen to other people. I'm just saying some listening does need to happen though. You can talk about me all you want, but I'm not important.
Right now yep, I'm just going to enjoy some of the more extreme reactions.
Even before Trump won I'd said before I didn't think he would do what some people think he would. Some thought Civil War, nukes, etc.
I can't tell what his angle is, but I feel that if a person truly did want to try to bring this country together..he would probably be willing to compromise on some stuff.
Originally posted by SurturYou won't stop. You'll put on the high-horse appeal of pretending to listen, but it will all be a veneer for at least 4 years of smugness and mockery. Even if (or when) his popularity plummets and he makes terrible decisions, you'll still behave the same. Maybe even reverse positions and retroactively edit your stance. Probably double down the efforts of trying to look understanding and empathetic, while truthfully just boosting your ego with a sense of undeserved superiority. But the constant barrage of insults and holier-than-though remarks will continue indefinitely.
Lol oh please dude. It hasn't even been a week yet. There will be plenty of time to listen to other people. I'm just saying some listening does need to happen though. You can talk about me all you want, but I'm not important.Right now yep, I'm just going to enjoy some of the more extreme reactions.
I should know, I'm doing it right now.
Originally posted by SurturYou are one of millions of points that matter. No politician or national leader will "learn" if the people who vote them in to office don't tell them what they should be "learning" or how they should be running anything. Efficacy of methods notwithstanding, voicing your opinion of these people---these leaders---is the only incentive they have to listen to how you (we) want things done. Those protests and sit-ins may seem childish (the playdoh thing certainly is) but they're doing far more to voice their opinion of the establishment that the armchair whiners who take to message boards and make glib snipes.
But yeah so anyways, whether or not I Surtur shall listen is not the point.Those in power are the people where it matters if they choose not to listen.
If they don't learn to do that, one day we might all be responding to a topic called "How good will Trump's 2nd term actually be?"
The governmental leaders should know, and see, and hear the people who don't like them. Who don't trust them. Who don't support them. Those leaders should FEAR for their power and position. Staying silent just makes the bolder, and encourages them to carry on the status quo that got them into power.
Originally posted by SurturAnd it worked, at least in part. The appeal of a man who wasn't part of the Washington elite meant the shake up of the status quo. That's wonderful! That Trump isn't a career politician is good---all the lifers he beat should rightly be afraid for their power. But Trump is a very rich businessman, and part of the monetary elite. He's still essentially a part of the system. So he needs to be reminded--all the time--that his power and his legacy can be undermined and shattered. He SHOULD fear that. But only the people can induce that fear.
People tried all election to tell them man.
I don't think it did work though. We weren't trying to tell Trump these things, it was the other side. It's because that didn't work that Trump won.
One key thing to realize is that, all joking aside, I think it's not just a small percentage of Trump voters that would be better described as Anti-Clinton than Pro Trump. I don't want to give Trump all the credit, since was just as much about who the opposition was and the type of people that are in power and have been in power a while. I worry people will make the mistake of just chalking this all up to "people are really racist and hateful".
That's what I was saying---you the Trump voters sent a message not just to the Clinton camp, but to all career politicians. Twice! When Trump was nominated and then when he won. The lifers in the GOP and Dems should be rattled by this entire election campaign. This is great, this is fantastic. A huge blow to a bloated, corrupt, over-confident network of rulers and lawmakers. For whatever the personal motivations of individuals, the ultimate message was clear--f*ck the status quo.
Trump should be protested and criticized ALL the time. Until the end of his presidency. Made to answer for his choices, forced to explain himself. Made to feel that his power and position is not everlasting. He (they) should fear US. We should not worship them. Or put much stock in them. Faith in our political leaders--especially the top dogs--to "do right by us" is f*cking dangerous.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien👆
You are one of millions of points that matter. No politician or national leader will "learn" if the people who vote them in to office don't tell them what they should be "learning" or how they should be running anything. Efficacy of methods notwithstanding, voicing your opinion of these people---these leaders---is the only incentive they have to listen to how you (we) want things done. Those protests and sit-ins may seem childish (the playdoh thing certainly is) but they're doing far more to voice their opinion of the establishment that the armchair whiners who take to message boards and make glib snipes.The governmental leaders should know, and see, and hear the people who don't like them. Who don't trust them. Who don't support them. Those leaders should FEAR for their power and position. Staying silent just makes the bolder, and encourages them to carry on the status quo that got them into power.
Originally posted by SurturThey're not done. They're not really snapped out of anything. Trump is an elite, like them. All that's different is his source of wealth (which doesn't come from donations and lobbyists---a mixed blessing in a way). He's still, in more ways than not, one of them. "Rattled" is what they are, but a rattled saber will settle down if it's not struck often. Strike it hard enough and it will bend, crack, and break. He broke with traditional politicking and found an audience who appreciated it.
I feel like unfortunately the only thing that could truly snap them out of it is..well, Trump winning.It sucks it had to take *that* for it to happen though.
But politics is different from policy. He may not "play by the rules" of the old political order, so to say, but his policies are what will make or break a country. Many countries. If he feels no pressure from his constituents, from the American people at large, he'll feel free to do what he can however wants. Give him nothing. Make him earn the right to every decision he makes. Make him feel the sting of every failure. And every success too.
These governmental and corporate elites are not our friends. They don't deserve your trust, your faith, your loyalty, or your silent consent. Support his policies or don't, but either way, make him listen to you.
I guess when it comes down to it, people know Trump is rich. One reason he knows the system was rigged is because he was probably one of the people helping keep it that way for so long.
I feel like Trump was the best option we had if we wanted real change. This doesn't mean I think he is guaranteed to do that, I just have always felt, and still feel..we have a better chance with him.
First immigrant First Lady is not Mrs. Trump, however...factually incorrect.
If you're not a Latino illegally entering or has already illegally entered the country, you have nothing to fear.
If you're not a young, single, male, Muslim, you also have nothing to fear. Trump has been clear about enforcing the laws that are already there.