Can Dooku ragdoll Vader?

Originally posted by SunRazer
1. That's a very vague quote. Kyle Katarn was a "threat" to Caedus, who could dispose of him remarkably quickly. You'd be surprised at how easily you can threaten someone.

Lmao, how is it a vague quote? If you can dispose of someone with a flick of a wrist anytime, anywhere then he's not a threat. The quote is from Dooku's prespective who refuses to give any credit to anyone beside himself and Sidious. So yeah it's pretty legit.

And I don't care about the Katarn quote (especially not without context) because the NJO is less consistant than Hillary's presidential campaign. If you want to bring shit tier NJO quotes into this then Ben > DE Sidious.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Also, doesn't the quote refer to Obi-Wan coming from Dooku's behind?

No 😕

Originally posted by SunRazer
2. No, it attributes it to Obi-Wan not expecting the attack. There's more reasons than just speed for not expecting the attack.

Quote says otherwise. Besides if you want to roll with Kenobi not expecting it that still leaves the feat as an opportune ragdoll not total domination, as Joker said.

Originally posted by SunRazer
3. Yes, it does.

Glad you agree.

Originally posted by SunRazer
The film and script suggest that Dooku overpowered his defenses. The website and TCSWE also attribute Dooku's ragdolling of Obi-Wan to Dooku being "formidable".

The film suggest nothing, without an explanation a screenplay can't distinguish an opportune ragdoll vs overpowering ragdoll (unless someone chokes another person for a prolonged period, which doesn't happen here).

Quote for the script?

Being formidable is no proof he overpowered his defenses instead of taking the opportunity 😂

I'm too lazy to read through the posts, but what was Nova's rebuttal to Kenobi defending against Dooku's TK in S6, if it was brought up?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I'm too lazy to read through the posts, but what was Nova's rebuttal to Kenobi defending against Dooku's TK in S6, if it was brought up?

Based on what? The visuals don't convey that.

Watching it again makes me inclined to believe they both defended themselves from the attack using Canon's version of Force barrier. What you're suggesting seems like a Force bubble, which I haven't seen used in The Clone Wars and wouldn't make sense because there are aliens right behind Kenobi and Skywalker that were affected.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
But we all must have are delusions, right?

It's "our" you brain dead fugg boi. 🙂

No, he can't.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Based on what? The visuals don't convey that.

Watching it again makes me inclined to believe they both defended themselves from the attack using Canon's version of Force barrier. What you're suggesting seems like a Force bubble, which I haven't seen used in The Clone Wars and wouldn't make sense because there are aliens right behind Kenobi and Skywalker that were affected.

He'd win solidly though not ragdoll

Not even in his dreams.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Lmao, how is it a vague quote? If you can dispose of someone with a flick of a wrist anytime, anywhere then he's not a threat. The quote is from Dooku's prespective who refuses to give any credit to anyone beside himself and Sidious. So yeah it's pretty legit.

And I don't care about the Katarn quote (especially not without context) because the NJO is less consistant than Hillary's presidential campaign. If you want to bring shit tier NJO quotes into this then Ben > DE Sidious.

You're referring to the novel? What's the quote in question? I Ctrl+F'd "threat" on my PDF version and didn't find anything. I am aware of a sourcebook claiming that Obi-Wan was a threat.

There wasn't any context. It was just Katarn's better than the other three and he's a threat.

Quote says otherwise. Besides if you want to roll with Kenobi not expecting it that still leaves the feat as an opportune ragdoll not total domination, as Joker said.

"Too sudden" does not necessarily mean speed. What was Joker's actual argument in that other thread? He's just trolling in this one.

The film suggest nothing, without an explanation a screenplay can't distinguish an opportune ragdoll vs overpowering ragdoll (unless someone chokes another person for a prolonged period, which doesn't happen here).

Well, the movie has Dooku and Obi-Wan clashing blades, and then the Choke, as opposed to Dooku turning around and just Choking Obi-Wan before he could even get to him in the junior novel.

If Obi-Wan is still surprised by a Force attack right after he's clashing blades with Dooku, then frankly, we should start arguing that characters can ragdoll Obi-Wan on the basis of speed as opposed to power. 🙂

Although I'm not seeing how Dooku's ragdoll was different from most other ragdolls, anyway. Obi-Wan trying to counter the technique might be him trying to use the anti-Choke technique (the one that Ant brought up a few months ago) as opposed to his Force defenses being lowered for no reason. So as far as actually ragdolling on the basis of bypassing somebody's Force defenses go, then Dooku's doing just that.

Quote for the script?

It's just this:

OBI-WAN reaches the top of the stairs, destroying TWO SUPER BATTLE DROIDS. COUNT DOOKU holds OBI-WAN in the air using the Force as he turns and kicks ANAKIN out of frame. OBI-WAN is choking.

-- http://www.imsdb.com/scripts/Star-Wars-Revenge-of-the-Sith.html

There's no mention of surprise, at least. You can say it's ambiguous, but then there's always Occam's Razor.

Being formidable is no proof he overpowered his defenses instead of taking the opportunity 😂

Well, if you want to play the definition game like you always do, there's a definition for formidable relating to being "impressively powerful".

if we're going by the source book that says kenobi wa a threat, ragdolling kenobi did drain him, but he still ragdolled kenobi

Originally posted by SunRazer
If Obi-Wan is still surprised by a Force attack right after he's clashing blades with Dooku, then frankly, we should start arguing that characters can ragdoll Obi-Wan on the basis of speed as opposed to power. 🙂

Could be the other way round lmfao

@ zoltan defending kenobi at very opportunity

He probably can, yeah.

One thing is clear:

ANH Vader cannot ragdoll ANH Kenobi.

Shit; I just realized that means ANH Kenobi >> starved, exhausted Starkiller.

Not in his wildest, most glorious fantasies.

Originally posted by Geistalt
Shit; I just realized that means ANH Kenobi >> starved, exhausted Starkiller.

Yes he was so exhausted, not like drawing off love and rage could have restored him to peak levels when it already happened earlier in the novel under conditions less likely to provide that emotion boost and after thirteen days of torture. But continue to live in fantasy world I guess.