Originally posted by MythLord
The Codex Entry would've been made before the battle of Ilum, though, and there isn't a big gap inbetween Malgus' "death", Jadus' death and that battle so it's likely the Codex is taking Malgus and Jadus into account as well.I'm not talking about before the game was released, you cretin. I'm talking about the fact that the Codex Entry would have been made for the Battle of Ilum so the player could find it during the battle of Ilum. That's how time works. Marr's accolade also isn't valid for several reasons:
1. It could be interpreted in other ways, and should be since it's talking about his political power and administrative abilities
2. The Codex Entries are still in-universe, so they are hardly objective
3. It completely contradicts the Jadus accolade you're trying to throw aroundJadus' statement of being > Marr is a character statement from Valkorion, who quite frankly was just trying to goad the player, and Watcher Two who has no idea what Marr is capable of. Marr himself isn't that impressive other than a vague quote. In fact, these quotes you're giving me are all actually less valid than the Plagueis blurb.
So we're back to square one. You have no basis other than character statements and conjecture, yet you deny more valid and objective statements since it doesn't suit your arbitrary hierarchy.
Fair enough, I think what the codex means could be interpreted either way though.
The codex entry likely isn't referring to his political power, and by "abilities" I would assume it means his abilities in the Force and in combat. I don't see any other reason to believe otherwise than the purpose of lowballing TOR characters, like most of this forum does. And no, it doesn't contradict the Jadus accolade, you yourself said Marr's quote there was made for the Battle of Ilum, which means it took into account the fact that Jadus was gone. And Darth Mortis stating that Nox could give Malgus a hell of a fight, and still being inferior to Marr, keeps Marr right where I want him.
How are these less valid than a non-canon novel blurb? And I"M the one picking and choosing? There's no reason to believe the quotes I've provided aren't valid, again, aside from the purpose of lowballing TOR characters.
About Novel Blurbs being canon:
"...continuity "C" canon which is pretty much everything else." By everything else I mean EVERYthing else. Novels, comics, junior novels, videogames, trading card games, roleplaying games, toys, websites, television. As I've mentioned earlier, any contradictions that arise are dealt on a case-by-case.This has been our general approach to continuity since we began using the Holocron database to track it."
Originally posted by UrsumelesI can't remember where it is, Syndi shared it in a comment in my Facebook group the other day, so I asked him for it again. I'll share the quote as soon as he gets back to me with it.
Quote? Chee himself more or less made Canon, so his opinion is basically the holy gral.
Anyway, Plagueis being relative close to RotS Sidious, being the second-last of the Banite line, shifting the balance of the force, manipulating midichlorians, influencing the climate of Naboo so extreme that it was the coldest winter the inhabitant's ever seen and being significantly above Tenebrous sh!t's all-over Jadus, lmao.
Originally posted by UrsumelesC-canon, or Continuity canon: The majority of Expanded Universe stories, including novels, comics, video games, and other content originating from other authors. C-canon material could be elevated to G-canon if a subject appeared in a Lucas project.
Anyway, Plagueis being relative close to RotS Sidious, being the second-last of the Banite line, shifting the balance of the force, manipulating midichlorians, influencing the climate of Naboo so extreme that it was the coldest winter the inhabitant's ever seen and being significantly above Tenebrous sh!t's all-over Jadus, lmao.
Note that it says "other content originating from other authors" meaning the content needs to come from an author to be C-Canon. Considering the blurb is not from an author, it's S-Canon which can "be ignored as desired by authors" and other authors, specifically Bioware in this case, obviously either ignored or were ignorant of the Plagueis blurb when they created Vitiate/Valkorion.
I didn't say Jadus is Plagueis' equal, I said he's between prime Vader and Jadus. Do you need a reading lesson?
Originally posted by darthbane77
The codex entry likely isn't referring to his political power, and by "abilities" I would assume it means his abilities in the Force and in combat. I don't see any other reason to believe otherwise than the purpose of lowballing TOR characters, like most of this forum does.
Anyways, yeah it's likely political power. The entire Codex Entry explains Marr's sway over the Empire, and his role as a leader primarily. Sure it mentions he's a terrifying warrior, but other than that the entire Codex is Marr's leadership skills.
Originally posted by darthbane77
And no, it doesn't contradict the Jadus accolade, you yourself said Marr's quote there was made for the Battle of Ilum, which means it took into account the fact that Jadus was gone. And Darth Mortis stating that Nox could give Malgus a hell of a fight, and still being inferior to Marr, keeps Marr right where I want him.How are these less valid than a non-canon novel blurb? And I"M the one picking and choosing? There's no reason to believe the quotes I've provided aren't valid, again, aside from the purpose of lowballing TOR characters.
Nove blurbs are canon unless contradicted by something directly within the universe. Nothing contradicts Plagueis being the most powerful besides the "heerr derr" feats only approach which is retarded.
Anyways, the Codex Entry was made so you can find it on Makeb, thus it was made before the player journies to Makeb. It could have very well been made before the Battle of Ilum and before Jadus' death. Additionally, Darth Mortis' opinion is irrelevant since it's just his opinion. You have the strange habit of taking character statements as if they are canon fact when they're not.
And to top it all off, Valkorion himself believes the protagonist is superior to Marr, so Marr being better than the protag opens up another big ol' can of contradicitions for you. So lets run it down:
Marr ~ Malgus >/ ~ Nox > Jadus > Marr, based on taking everything you said fully into account. There's no way around this; your comparison is just quite frankly sh!t and hinges on character statements that are, either purposefully or accidentally, inaccurate and a Codex Entry that can be interpreted in so many ways. You choose on personal whim to when and how these statements apply and that's just cherry picking.
Originally posted by darthbane77Who said this? And. Still, the feats that I listed for Plagueis >>> Jadus.
C-canon, or Continuity canon: The majority of Expanded Universe stories, including novels, comics, video games, and other content originating from other authors. C-canon material could be elevated to G-canon if a subject appeared in a Lucas project.Note that it says "other content originating from other authors" meaning the content needs to come from an author to be C-Canon. Considering the blurb is not from an author, it's S-Canon which can "be ignored as desired by authors" and other authors, specifically Bioware in this case, obviously either ignored or were ignorant of the Plagueis blurb when they created Vitiate/Valkorion.
I didn't say Jadus is Plagueis' equal, I said he's between prime Vader and Jadus. Do you need a reading lesson?
1. Jadus > Vader is bad enough.
2. I didn't said that you said Plagueis = Jadus, but that you have him approaching Plagueis level, which is true.
Originally posted by darthbane77
Jadus. I hold Jadus as approaching Plagueis level.
Originally posted by MythLordThe Marr codex can obviously be interpreted in different ways, which means no one interpretation is correct.
> most of the forum
> most of the forum is TOR wankers
> kekAnyways, yeah it's likely political power. The entire Codex Entry explains Marr's sway over the Empire, and his role as a leader primarily. Sure it mentions he's a terrifying warrior, but other than that the entire Codex is Marr's leadership skills.
Nove blurbs are canon unless contradicted by something directly within the universe. Nothing contradicts Plagueis being the most powerful besides the "heerr derr" feats only approach which is retarded.
Anyways, the Codex Entry was made so you can find it on Makeb, thus it was made before the player journies to Makeb. It could have very well been made before the Battle of Ilum and before Jadus' death. Additionally, Darth Mortis' opinion is irrelevant since it's just his opinion. You have the strange habit of taking character statements as if they are canon fact when they're not.
And to top it all off, Valkorion himself believes the protagonist is superior to Marr, so Marr being better than the protag opens up another big ol' can of contradicitions for you. So lets run it down:
Marr ~ Malgus >/ ~ Nox > Jadus > Marr, based on taking everything you said fully into account. There's no way around this; your comparison is just quite frankly sh!t and hinges on character statements that are, either purposefully or accidentally, inaccurate and a Codex Entry that can be interpreted in so many ways. You choose on personal whim to when and how these statements apply and that's just cherry picking.
This quote could potentially contradict Plagueis' non-canon blurb.
"Revan travels to a very iconic Yavin IV to go to battle and release the actual Emperor, one we thought who was defeated not long ago. The player is pulled into this struggle of two of the most powerful Force users, like ever, in the history of the Old Republic, if not beyond - Revan and the Emperor."
―Michael Backus (Star Wars: The Old Republic Head Writer)
Vitiate is stated as the most powerful character in the Old Republic, alongside Revan. The quote then says they're potentially the most powerful characters even beyond the TOR era. The only Sith Lord who's accolades might actually contradict this, are Sidious'.
You discount Mortis' opinion and then use Valkorion's as evidence? You can't discount one opinion and then use another one for your argument, that shit is hypocritical.
Originally posted by UrsumelesIt's listed on wookiepedia as the definition for c-canon. Considering everything on wookiepedia is verified, I assume it to be true, and Syndi used it as a source, which makes it good enough for me.
Who said this? And. Still, the feats that I listed for Plagueis >>> Jadus.1. Jadus > Vader is bad enough.
2. I didn't said that you said Plagueis = Jadus, but that you have him approaching Plagueis level, which is true.Do you need reading lessons 🙄
Jadus>Vader has evidence, and Jadus APPROACHING Plagueis, is not Plagueis level.
Yes, I know what I said, approaching somebody's level isn't the same as being on that level.
Originally posted by darthbane77
This quote could potentially contradict Plagueis' non-canon blurb."Revan travels to a very iconic Yavin IV to go to battle and release the actual Emperor, one we thought who was defeated not long ago. The player is pulled into this struggle of two of the most powerful Force users, like ever, in the history of the Old Republic, if not beyond - Revan and the Emperor."
―Michael Backus (Star Wars: The Old Republic Head Writer)
Originally posted by darthbane77
It's listed on wookiepedia as the definition for c-canon. Considering everything on wookiepedia is verified, I assume it to be true, and Syndi used it as a source, which makes it good enough for me.Jadus>Vader has evidence, and Jadus APPROACHING Plagueis, is not Plagueis level.
Yes, I know what I said, approaching somebody's level isn't the same as being on that level.
2. I am still waiting for evidence that Jadus > Vader.
3. I never said otherwise. But Jadus doesn't comes close to approaching Plagueis, unless your definition of "approaching" is getting stomped, or flat-out dominated.
Originally posted by UrsumelesBeing second only to Vitiate and above every other member of the DC (some of whom I have approaching Vader level, as previously said) the ability to hold his ship together in space is something above most anything Vader has achieved.
1. Are you kidding me? At least I want to know who said that.
Syn can be tricked as well.2. I am still waiting for evidence that Jadus > Vader.
3. I never said otherwise. But Jadus doesn't comes close to approaching Plagueis, unless your definition of "approaching" is getting stomped, or flat-out dominated.