Captain America vs Havok

- PIS/CIS is off.
- Both characters are bloodlusted.
- Captain America has his shield.
- Opponents start 50 feet apart.
- Fight takes place in the Colosseum.

Can Steve use his superior stats, skill and shield to take down the mutant, or will Alex's sheer destructive output win the day?

I thought this would be an interesting match, as Cap is pretty well-balanced across the board (good physical stats, highly skilled, and the shield can be used for defense, melee, and range), whereas Alex has a ton of raw power, and can fire 3 different beams at once, but is basically the quintessential example of a glass cannon character.

This is basically a who gets hit first match.

Cap's Shield does well against energy blasts. They don't send Cap flying back the way a rocket does. As for Havok firing 3 beams at once, only one of those beams will hit Cap presumably.

I mean technically IM can shoot from his chest and 2 hands as well. Yet Cap can fight IM.

So yeah I think Cap for a solid majority.

I don't think Iron Man is the best example to use, as I don't recall him ever firing three continuous beams at once onscreen, especially not at Cap. In contrast, Alex maintained three continuous beams for several seconds while he was destroying Cerebro.

I actually think Cap's best shot is to try a shield toss off the bat, and see if he can beat Alex to the punch, because Alex doesn't have the durability to take a bloodlusted shield throw from Steve. Because if Alex has any sense (and he did fight in Vietnam for several years), he will do what the likes of Winter Soldier and Spiderman have done before, and aim one blast low and one blast high, and one at the middle for good measure, because Steve can't cover everything while also moving forward.

If Alex gets lucky and shoots the shield out of the air, Cap is screwed.

Iron Man did fire three beams at once, against Thor in Avengers. It was his first move after the lighting charge up

Originally posted by HulkIsHulk
If Alex gets lucky and shoots the shield out of the air, Cap is screwed.

Iron Man did fire three beams at once, against Thor in Avengers. It was his first move after the lighting charge up

Those weren't three continuous beams like Havok did though. It was a quick blast. And that sent friggin' Thor sailing through the air. So, it wasn't against Cap either. Havok showed that he can sweep his beams in arcs while maintaining them.

Also, he would need to get really lucky to shoot the shield out of the air IMO. Closest I can recall to him tagging a flying object moving that fast was when he took Angel's wing off in First Class.

Three breams fired in close proximity would easily block the shied since Cap's main method is hurling it at you discus style.

In a Colosseum setting it'd take waaaaay too long for him to ricochet it off anything if they're near the middle.

Has Havok ever gone up against and hit someone as fast moving and agile as Cap?

Well, he did shoot Angel out of the air during First Class, and she was fairly nimble. Plus, he can just spam beams and move them in wide arcs.

As for blocking the shield with his beams, Cap isn't stupid. The moment that shield leaves his grip, he is likely going to charge Alex and try to close the distance while the latter is focused on the shield. So, there is a good chance that by the time he has avoided/blocked the shield (if he can), Cap will be right on him. And in a close up confrontation, I would give Steve a decisive edge.

I know Cap is normally a more defensive fighter, but this is a scenario where I think taking a page from Winter Soldier, and going with overwhelming offense, gives him a much better shot at a win.

Cap takes care of business..

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Well, he did shoot Angel out of the air during First Class, and she was fairly nimble. Plus, he can just spam beams and move them in wide arcs.

As for blocking the shield with his beams, Cap isn't stupid. The moment that shield leaves his grip, he is likely going to charge Alex and try to close the distance while the latter is focused on the shield. So, there is a good chance that by the time he has avoided/blocked the shield (if he can), Cap will be right on him. And in a close up confrontation, I would give Steve a decisive edge.

I know Cap is normally a more defensive fighter, but this is a scenario where I think taking a page from Winter Soldier, and going with overwhelming offense, gives him a much better shot at a win.

He did move right up to IM while blocking his beams.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He did move right up to IM while blocking his beams.

Because IM was firing all his shots at the same spot, like a dumbass (especially considering he was the one who gave Spidey the advice to go for Steve's legs), and the distance was far less than 50 feet. And, again, it was not a triple beam. Also, Tony tagged him with an individual repulsor shot earlier in the fight, while Steve had his shield. And as I already pointed out earlier, both Spiderman and Winter Soldier have managed to tag Cap, while he had his shield, by targeting two areas at once.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Because IM was firing all his shots at the same spot, like a dumbass (especially considering he was the one who gave Spidey the advice to go for Steve's legs), and the distance was far less than 50 feet. And, again, it was not a triple beam. Also, Tony tagged him with an individual repulsor shot earlier in the fight, while Steve had his shield. And as I already pointed out earlier, both Spiderman and Winter Soldier have managed to tag Cap, while he had his shield, by targeting two areas at once.

Can Havok target all 3 beams to hit the same person though?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Can Havok target all 3 beams to hit the same person though?

Why not? One beam comes directly from his chest and the other two are aimed with his arms. Instead of pointing them out to the sides, like he did when he destroyed Cerebro (because he was trying to maximise damage), he just needs to point one low and one high in front of him. He doesn't even need to use three. Just one high and one low. He can leave the chest beam.

I think Cap wins but, as I said, I think overwhelming offense is his best bet. He can probably fling his shield with comparable speed to Alex firing off a blast, but he has more XP doing that kind of thing against other superpowered opponents, which is why I feel he'd win in a quick draw. And, as I said, even if Havok stops/avoids it, by the time he gets his bearings, Steve would probably have closed in on him. And then it just takes a single punch to end things.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Why not? One beam comes directly from his chest and the other two are aimed with his arms. Instead of pointing them out to the sides, like he did when he destroyed Cerebro (because he was trying to maximise damage), he just needs to point one low and one high in front of him. He doesn't even need to use three. Just one high and one low. He can leave the chest beam.

What I mean is if there's no actual feats of him aiming all 3 beams at a target the size of a single person, then that's problematic for arguing he can and will do that.

My memory is a bit fuzzy on what happened when he was firing at Apocalypse.

There's this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkzmCA9EpJY

Here when he destroys Cerebro, he starts his chest beam, and that beam still doesn't seem like it's the best at targeting, given how it's unstable waving all over the place. Then his 2 hand beams are shot in completely different directions:

Originally posted by Darth Thor
What I mean is if there's no actual feats of him aiming all 3 beams at a target the size of a single person, then that's problematic for arguing he can and will do that.

My memory is a bit fuzzy on what happened when he was firing at Apocalypse.

I don't see the problem. It's not like he suddenly loses control of his motor functions when he fires. What you are suggesting is that he would be unable to simply sweep his arms horizontally while doing the following:

YouTube video

He fired a single beam at the Apocalypse crew, but the beam was powerful enough that it pretty much vaporised a thick metal blast door that 2 people could easily walk through side-by-side, so that beam could have hit multiple people if they hadn't teleported out.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
There's this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkzmCA9EpJY

Here when he destroys Cerebro, he starts his chest beam, and that beam still doesn't seem like it's the best at targeting, given how it's unstable waving all over the place. Then his 2 hand beams are shot in completely different directions:

That is because his aim was to destroy as much of it as possible as quickly as possible. He's shown before that he can fire very accurately if necessary. Just after the 40 second mark:

YouTube video

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
I don't see the problem. It's not like he suddenly loses control of his motor functions when he fires. What you are suggesting is that he would be unable to simply sweep his arms horizontally while doing the following:

Well they don't seem steady tbh. So I can't imagine one beam aimed at Cap's head, one at his chest and one at his legs.

Still I can see the unsteadiness of 3 beams in itself giving Cap room to maneuver, and he'll have a really hard time keeping an eye on all 3 beams, plus dealing with the destruction the other 2 beams are causing ride besides or on top of him. So he probably wouldn't want to be in that position anyway.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
He fired a single beam at the Apocalypse crew, but the beam was powerful enough that it pretty much vaporised a thick metal blast door that 2 people could easily walk through side-by-side, so that beam could have hit multiple people if they hadn't teleported out.

Yeah I admit all that destructive power all around Cap would make things pretty difficult for him.