Originally posted by eaebiakuya
We can assume this Hercules can punch as hard as a...7 megaton bomb (small nuclear bomb) from those images. Idk if it is even a low herald feat.
Right...
Next thread, Captain Atom vs Thor...he stomps Thor 10/10
Originally posted by eaebiakuya
We can assume this Hercules can punch as hard as a...7 megaton bomb (small nuclear bomb) from those images. Idk if it is even a low herald feat.
Right...
Next thread, Captain Atom vs Thor...he stomps Thor 10/10
Re: Marvel's Hercules vs Injustice Hercules
Originally posted by phil
That's...not true. Superman was healed beforehand:
and that....is disingenuous. he snapped it back in place and said he could speed up the process. what percentage it was 'healed' is impossible to say. weakened for sure imo as whatever healing was done def didn't repair the rest of him as evidenced by his face--and he'd taken a bad beating. healed? somewhat. less than 100%? assuredly imo.
Also not true.
he laid her out before she and superman attacked. she was still on the ground when hal stepped in and got wrecked. how long did the fight with hal take? 1 minute? 2? that's pretty much just before the double team took place in my book.....
He sucker Diana, then went on to fight Hal. But before the feat in question, it was Diana who sucker shot him as he was engaging Superman.
sure. and? are you saying he was in as bad shape as they were? your prerogative i guess. /shrug
It's so weird how you're applying double standards. On one hand, you're arguing that Supes/Diana were weakened from their fight... but on the other hand, you're ignoring the fact that just before Captain Marvel, Hercules had tanked Hal's attacks, walked through his blast, got simultaneously hit by both Diana and Superman after the former sucker-shot him, and Billy ALSO started the fight with a sucker shot, while Hercules was choking Wonder Woman.
the degrees of difference were obvious in the fights. hal seemingly had no effect at all on herc. again, if you wanna go ahead and say hercules was in as bad shape as superman and diana were...well, good on ya. pretty clear just looking at them how wrong that is, but okay. we're MILES apart on this, so this is obviously pointless anyway. there's nowhere near enough info here imo to fairly decide, especially with characters who were portrayed as erradically as the injustice characters were. we're also left wondering if canon ww can do this to canon herc:
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175314
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175315
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175316
how accurate is that injustice fight. we know canon ww is stated to be faster stronger and more savage even then canon herc. so that leaves us to ask--is injustice herc>>stronger than canon herc? pretty sure i wouldn't say that.... or is injustice ww<<canon ww? seems more likely... or are the injustice characters so inconsistently portrayed that we really can't make a fair determination? that seems likeliest of all to me. even more so given that tiny sampling size. on the point of canon vs injustice--etrigan punched supes to the MOON and he walked it off like nothing. here one shot to orbit and he's a vegetable. this herc is WAY stronger? this supes and the others are much less? to inconsistent to say for sure?
Injustice Superman would wipe the floor with Marvel Hercules. A good showing by Shazam [who explicitly has Hercules strength + more] doesn't demean him in any way. [/B]
not going by what happened in this scene he wouldn't. using some of superman's other feats? probably. i also find it odd that you want to take away a portion of what is already a tiny sample size and chalk herc's beaten down in a few hits to a 'good showing' for cm while i'm saying it was a terrible showing for ww and superman, both of whom appeared to be in rough shape from the start and both of whom have far better feats throughout the series. based on some of supes' other showings this showing vs herc is....awful. he matched adam pretty easily for example, and adam should be as strong as cm or herc. imo the showing against shazam absolutely does demean herc. is cm beating superman as easily as he beat herc? a healthy superman? judging off the adam showing, no chance. given that herc one-shot superman, seems likely he would though--seems he might beat superman MORE easily than he beat herc. again, if you want to use that tiny sample size, you don't get to cut out the part where he gets the sh!t kicked out of him then say shazam had a 'good showing'. at least not while back-handedly criticizing me for saying it was a terrible showing for superman and ww, both of whom have FAR better feats in that series.
we're aren't meeting on this issue, so i'll leave things at that. too inconsistent, too little info. based solely on my impressions of what happened here, though, if forced to choose, i'd take marvel's herc.
If Immortal Hercules was dropped into Injustice, he'd be running a train through the entire regime. Not that it matters, the entire line is inconsistent AF and not the mainstream DC. If you apply all canon DC feats to those incarnations, that's a different story but that's not how alternate realities work.
Marvel Hercules wins.
If Immortal Hercules was dropped into Injustice, he'd be running a train through the entire regime. Not that it matters, the entire line is inconsistent AF and not the mainstream DC. If you apply all canon DC feats to those incarnations, that's a different story but that's not how alternate realities work.
Marvel Hercules wins.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
If Immortal Hercules was dropped into Injustice, he'd be running a train through the entire regime. Not that it matters, the entire line is inconsistent AF and not the mainstream DC. If you apply all canon DC feats to those incarnations, that's a different story but that's not how alternate realities work.Marvel Hercules wins.
Originally posted by deathslash
Marvel hercules destroys injustice herc.Saying that Injustice Herc wins because he beat up an injured Superman and wonder woman is rediculous. Marvel Hercules has the weapons, skill, durability, and showings that suggest that he takes this fight in a rather casual manner.
Do tell us about these awesome showings about Hercules. Superman just throwing punches with Darkseid would've destroyed the planet and kill Darkseid.
Superman would have survived that too.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5mNhkwXAIa8/VgqyraSj-jI/AAAAAAAQkoQ/1ibHtNy0AfM/s1600/4_01.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-T4Bgqyjq8L0/VgqysA9YDLI/AAAAAAAQkoY/LR2ln4RO-58/s1600/4_02.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-y-ZS8yAYxsM/VgqysVXIdSI/AAAAAAAQkog/3drqopOiavs/s1600/4_03.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VTlKa_e3ovU/Vgqys7BCLlI/AAAAAAAQkoo/aHzPbQiKz0U/s1600/4_05.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-mee73gB296w/VgqytAnadQI/AAAAAAAQko0/7p1o4X5SSrE/s1600/4_06.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-7Dg_rFgxsW8/VgqytivOSKI/AAAAAAAQko8/vzHsJImoMNg/s1600/4_07.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-NR0DN83I6pQ/Vgqyt5gd3mI/AAAAAAAQkpE/a-MSnc-O9S8/s1600/4_08.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-NkfAq43fF4o/VgqyueW7AbI/AAAAAAAQkpM/7xiVguPo5yI/s1600/4_10.jpg
That's not something Hercules can do.
Originally posted by Damborgson
Injustice Superman isn't his mainstream counterpart anyway. They're similar but aside from a few crazy feats he really wasn't that crazy impressive. Got beat up a lot.And I dont think Yellow Lantern Hal Jordan did anything impressive whatsoever.
Re: Re: Marvel's Hercules vs Injustice Hercules
Originally posted by leonidasIs it so hard to admit that you're wrong about the arm, that we're now talking in "how big of a percentage of the arm was healed"? And you're talking to me about disingenuous? Leo, be serious. The arm was fully healed - he was walking around as if nothing happened, comparing to limping/holding it beforehand. The same arm was used to block Hercules' punch:
and that....is disingenuous. he snapped it back in place and said he could speed up the process. what percentage it was 'healed' is impossible to say. weakened for sure imo as whatever healing was done def didn't repair the rest of him as evidenced by his face--and he'd taken a bad beating. healed? somewhat. less than 100%? assuredly imo.
Originally posted by leonidasYou said he sucker punched her just before he KOd Superman - that is not only not true, it was she who did the sucker punching while he was engaged with Clark. The fact that you neglected to mention the fact that BOTH Diana and Billy also sucker punched him, while being 'disingenuous' enough [hey, you brought it up] to only mention him sucker punching her, is the point.
he laid her out before she and superman attacked. she was still on the ground when hal stepped in and got wrecked. how long did the fight with hal take? 1 minute? 2? that's pretty much just before the double team took place in my book.....
Originally posted by leonidas
sure. and? are you saying he was in as bad shape as they were? your prerogative i guess. /shrug
This is gold.
Leo, you do realize that you're completely shooting yourself in the foot here by saying that Hercules is so powerful, that Hal and Superman + Diana simultaneously did less damage on him than just Supes/Diana did to eachother? And it doesn't matter if he was in better/worse shape than they were - the fact that he was not 100% against Billy [having withstood hal + diana + supes] is EXACTLY the same argument you're using to dismiss Diana+Supes beating on him, so that showing is thrown out. You really don't see the hilarious double standards here?
Originally posted by leonidas
there's nowhere near enough info here imo to fairly decide, especially with characters who were portrayed as erradically as the injustice characters were. we're also left wondering if canon ww can do this to canon herc:https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175314
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175315
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5175316
how accurate is that injustice fight. we know canon ww is stated to be faster stronger and more savage even then canon herc. so that leaves us to ask--is injustice herc>>stronger than canon herc? pretty sure i wouldn't say that.... or is injustice ww<<canon ww? seems more likely... or are the injustice characters so inconsistently portrayed that we really can't make a fair determination? that seems likeliest of all to me. even more so given that tiny sampling size. on the point of canon vs injustice--etrigan punched supes to the MOON and he walked it off like nothing. here one shot to orbit and he's a vegetable. this herc is WAY stronger? this supes and the others are much less? to inconsistent to say for sure?
Nobody is saying that the Injustice Characters are equal to their mainstream counterparts - but the general standings are the same, with a few exceptions. In a series with dozens of dozens of characters appearing all over the place, of course not everybody gets mainstream-level high-end showings - but let's not pretend that Hal is now suddenly Havok-level. Or that Diana isn't a high-herald. Or that Superman isn't the most powerful being on the planet, and Hercules one-shot KO'd him.
Originally posted by leonidas
not going by what happened in this scene he wouldn't. using some of superman's other feats? probably. i also find it odd that you want to take away a portion of what is already a tiny sample size and chalk herc's beaten down in a few hits to a 'good showing' for cm while i'm saying it was a terrible showing for ww and superman, both of whom appeared to be in rough shape from the start and both of whom have far better feats throughout the series. based on some of supes' other showings this showing vs herc is....awful. he matched adam pretty easily for example, and adam should be as strong as cm or herc. imo the showing against shazam absolutely does demean herc. is cm beating superman as easily as he beat herc? a healthy superman? judging off the adam showing, no chance. given that herc one-shot superman, seems likely he would though--seems he might beat superman MORE easily than he beat herc. again, if you want to use that tiny sample size, you don't get to cut out the part where he gets the sh!t kicked out of him then say shazam had a 'good showing'. at least not while back-handedly criticizing me for saying it was a terrible showing for superman and ww, both of whom have FAR better feats in that series.we're aren't meeting on this issue, so i'll leave things at that. too inconsistent, too little info. based solely on my impressions of what happened here, though, if forced to choose, i'd take marvel's herc.
The Superman in this scene, is the same Superman from throughout the series, who would wipe the floor with Marvel Hercules, and who got one-shot by Injustice Herc. Getting beaten by Captain Marvel after, by your logic, having fights that made him <100% against Hal, Supes+Diana, is not a low showing, since Captain Marvel is, by definition, Hercules strength + much more. In what world is Captain Marvel used as a low showing, when the opponent is Marvel Hercules?
You're using the fact that Hercules lost a no-rest gauntlet of Hal Jordan, Superman + Wonder Woman [combined] and Billy, to say that Marvel Hercules beats him.
How f*cking insane does this sound to you?
@phil: quoting you is less than ideal and we're a billion miles apart, but ok:
1. i've been wrong...more times than i can count on this forum so it's not hard for me to admit anything. did i forget the healing scene? 👆 but borg said he'd speed things up, that's all. some solar juice in the arm healed him fully? maybe the arm. the rest of him? it didn't heal his face. what else wasn't healed? beats me. how close to full WAS he? neither of us know. but given his performance vs herc compared to some of his other feats against similar opponents, not very...
but if you're willing to concede that herc was able to one-shot a full strength superman WHILE fighting ww simultaneously, well, as a herc fan in general, i'm kinda ok with that. 👆
2. you do realize the reasoning you're using for cm beating herc is the same reasoning anyone can use to say cm should beat the holy f*** out of supes every time, right? i mean supes gets one-shotted by the power of a SINGLE god. cm murders superman every time, right? adam murders superman too since he has multiple god power?
but i'm the one who sounds insane. or is it more rational to say supes and diana obviously weren't at their best when they faced herc? no real decision to be made there imo.
3. speaking of insanity:
vs
😐
this indeed is gold. the amount of punishment diana/superman took from each other and others....literally dwarfed what herc took. diana appeared to be damn near ko'd twice. and she sure as sh!t wasn't "healed". i mean seriously. neither was close to their best when herc stepped up. anyone who compares the scans can see that. it's like we're on bizarro world or something--i'm making a case for why supes was slaughtered here, and you're undermining it. 😑
4. was herc at his "best" when he fought cm? maybe not, but he certainly didn't appear too taxed to me as was clearly shown in the scans. i mean he literally laughed jordan off. and if the few shots he did take from a grossly weakened diana and superman were enough to weaken him to the point cm could cave him in as easily as he did? well....that doesn't exactly add to his prestige.... 😬
i plan on redoing the marvel herc respect thread this summer, but i'll post one fight here because it has a bearing on durability. this is where MORTAL herc took on the hulk. remember, no immortality here, his durability and invulnerability were dramatically cut and he was about a 50-75 tonner, maybe.
i'll absolutely not get into an 'injustice superman/wonder woman vs hulk' comparison here, but mortal herc (though he got his a$$ kicked in the end, rightfully so given how weakened he was in that era) showed some real balls here. a lot more than this injustice herc did. least imo.
i'll take marvel's herc here every time if forced to go off this tiny sample from injustice herc.
Originally posted by leonidasGood - the arm part was the one in contention that I said you were wrong about. Was Superman fresh? No. Did he have any clear damage [broken arm, bleeding eyes]? Also no. Did some scratches left on his face affect his ability to punch hard? Of course not. Given the fact that he wasn't without a scratch/messy you can argue that his durability would not be 100% (how much? we don't know, but even if under normal circumstances it would take Hercules 2-3 punches to KO him, it wouldn't change the fact that it's ridiculous), but the force of his punches isn't significantly diminished, just because he has scratch marks on his face. And it was both his AND Diana's punches, simultaneous, consecutive ones, that Hercules shrugged without damage.
1. i've been wrong...more times than i can count on this forum so it's not hard for me to admit anything. did i forget the healing scene? 👆 but borg said he'd speed things up, that's all. some solar juice in the arm healed him fully? maybe the arm. the rest of him? it didn't heal his face. what else wasn't healed? beats me. how close to full WAS he? neither of us know. but given his performance vs herc compared to some of his other feats against similar opponents, not very...
Originally posted by leonidasThe fight didn't portray Hercules as stronger than Superman - I already posted the scan where Superman catches his punch, which generally in comics denotes >= strength. But what it does show is that whatever strength level Hercules is place, he has the ability to KO Superman in one hit. Does that show that he will one-shot KO Superman in each and every fight? Of course not. But the fact that he has a single long showing, and that's his average, favors him in this thread.
2. you do realize the reasoning you're using for cm beating herc is the same reasoning anyone can use to say cm should beat the holy f*** out of supes every time, right? i mean supes gets one-shotted by the power of a SINGLE god. cm murders superman every time, right? adam murders superman too since he has multiple god power?
And also, you know..
https://gfycat.com/RegalPleasantAbalone
Originally posted by leonidas
3. speaking of insanity:vs
😐
this indeed is gold. the amount of punishment diana/superman took from each other and others....literally dwarfed what herc took. diana appeared to be damn near ko'd twice. and she sure as sh!t wasn't "healed". i mean seriously. neither was close to their best when herc stepped up. anyone who compares the scans can see that. it's like we're on bizarro world or something--i'm making a case for why supes was slaughtered here, and you're undermining it. 😑
I still, for the life of me, can't understand how you think that showing Hercules:
a). Taking Hal's all out attack
b). Taking Superman and Wonder Woman, combined, punching him in the face.
c). One-shotting Superman in orbit and choking Wonder Woman with one hand
d). Taking Captain Marvel sucker punching and then beating him.
...one after another WITHOUT DAMAGE, compared to just Superman/Diana alone giving visible damage to each other, is something that you hope to prove helps your case.
You've set yourself for this trap, but you only have your logic to blame.
If you go by you, and say that prior attacks [and sucker punches] taken diminish a combatant's performance thus should be thrown out, fresh Captain Marvel beating gauntlet-style Hercules is eliminated. In fact, in this case, all of Hercules feats are muddy, since everybody is weakened, including him, in every fight. So we can just...leave the thread, since discussion is non-existent.
If you go the opposite of your logic, and say that prior attacks did nothing to Hercules - you're only reinforcing how far above marvel Hercules he is, that he can withstand the strength of Diana+Superman combined and Hal without a scratch.
---
The problem with your position in this thread is that you were selective in your arguuments [Hercules sucker punching Diana happened, but somehow Diana and Billy sucker punching him were omitted], selective in your memory [we went from Superman's arm was broken, to yes it was healed but how much? ok maybe it was fully healed but what about the scratches?], and thus the discussion is either A or B, thus the logic corner I posted above.
You've made it binary, one extreme or the other.
How about this: Diana and Superman, fresh, probably would've been able to take his attacks better, but that doesn't mean we dismiss the showing entirely. The durability showing, for one, can't be dismissed for the simple fact that some scratches on Diana/Superman's face doesn't mean that their punches were suddenly significantly weaker - and it was clear that Hercules durability was high just from how he no-sold Hal Jordan. And even if Superman wasn't fully healed, to be able to do that to him in one-punch is something that I can't see Hercules replicating, especially as he is simultaneously punched in the face by both Superman and Wonder Woman. For me, given these, Injustice Hercules is definitely more durable and different degrees, depending on how weakened you see Superman was, stronger.
Can you make an interpretation that is not 'Superman and Wonder Woman were damaged, so f*ck that part entirely. Hal is weak so f*ck that part, too. Shazam? Oh that definitely shows exactly how powerful Hercules is!".
Originally posted by leonidas
https://imgur.com/a/xP7JKi'll absolutely not get into an 'injustice superman/wonder woman vs hulk' comparison here, but mortal herc (though he got his a$$ kicked in the end, rightfully so given how weakened he was in that era) showed some real balls here. a lot more than this injustice herc did. least imo.
i'll take marvel's herc here every time if forced to go off this tiny sample from injustice herc.
That's quite an awesome showing of skill and resilience, I agree.
I'll change it to Injustice Hercules two-shots him, just for that 👆 😛
