Originally posted by beatboks
I'm simply trying to do what darksaint suggested and wityle the list down to identify the weakest that can win.
👆 This moves the thread along much quicker. Kudos.
And tbh, you're probably the premier magic DC expert these days. Of course, we can all name Mxy, Odin, Zeus etc, but that's not the weakest.
^^^Yeah thats about the opposite of weakest.
Goes right back to
Originally posted by JBL
I'm asking you to name the weakest out of all of them. Then when you try, other posters will name a weaker one. There is no end to this. Some will name very powerful characters( superman fans) some will name weaker characters. Get it now?
So it looks like we've established "could win" as an amateur puncher's chance in a pro bout.
We've also got a reasonable "Who's who" of magic users in both the DC and the Marvel Universes.
We've yet to qualify how we're defining "weakest" now.
Is strength being measured by how strong the spell?
Or by how physically strong the person casting or protected by the magic is?
If the latter, my vote is for Gepetto, from DC "Fables".
Far from the kindly old man we know from Disney's "Pinocchio" fame, Gepetto in fables is THE number one adversary of the series, a ruler who has taken on armies and supernatural beings, and come out on top even after the passage of decades of people trying to topple him from power.
Yet except for extraordinary longevity, Gepetto is, ultimately, an old man. Likely comparable to an 80 year old. It is layered magic that protects him, not great physical strength. Only one I can think of who might be weaker is/was Agatha Harkness, and I didn't include her 'cause I'm not sure what her level of magic power was and I also think she's dead.
In fact my list of best contenders, at least as I type this in the wee hours of the morning, is as follows:
1. Gepetto, DC Comics Fables
2. Scarlet Witch, Marvel Comics Avengers
3. June Munro, DC Comics
4. Doctor Strange, Marvel Comics
5. Clea, Marvel Comics, other dimensional love interest of Doctor Strange
Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Yeah thats about the opposite of weakest.
Goes right back to
Except we will then hit a limit whereby someone names a character, and we realise that THAT person is TOO weak.
So the person above them is....the weakest magic user who can defeat Supes.
But saying that the entire thread is useless because of what Superfans say is...weak.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
👆 This moves the thread along much quicker. Kudos.And tbh, you're probably the premier magic DC expert these days. Of course, we can all name Mxy, Odin, Zeus etc, but that's not the weakest.
I'll have a look at the Marvel list tomorrow.
Not quite as versed in Marvel magic as DC but as an old Defenders and Alpha Flight fan plus Hellstrom fanboy I do know quite a few.
Originally posted by cdtm
Varies by era.Superman's "magic weakness" isn't what it uses to be in the pre crisis era. He's outright tanked magic attacks from hell lords and such..
I am semi-interested in seeing this; generally in such cases, however, the trick is that the spells involve a "morality" clause of sorts. For instance, in League of One, there is a dragon whose flame burns anyone regardless of their level of superpower. Burns away at deceptions and lies and liars, if memory serves. But a campaigner who fights with a weapon that reveals the truth, tries to keep herself pure ...?
From what I understand Ghost Rider's highest level flames work like that, and there the clause is innocence or guilt. Goku has a "spirit bomb" or some such, and there "goodness" is the key.
(So Wonder Woman survives the dragon, Hulk survives Ghost Rider's hellfire, and I presume Gohan is the one who saw "Spirit Bomb" safely flow over him, in case anyone is wondering.)
That'd be a little different than the physics this thread is presuming.
So too would Apollo trying to incinerate Superman even with his most powerful standard blast. For under the pen of Azarello and whoever did the Superman/Wonder Woman comic of 2 or 3 years back, Apollo is in some literal way Earth's yellow sun, even as some contend Lucifer himself is/was the Sun God, the true brightest morning star, Helios, etcetera.
(How well do you think THAT turned out ...?)
Ok where the Marvel list is concerned
Ancient One
Black Knight (Dane Whitman)
Black Raazer
Brother Voodoo
Calypso (comics)
Clea
Doctor Strange
Doctor Doom
Dormammu
Doctor Druid
Enchantress (Marvel Comics)
Agatha Harkness (maybe)
Hela (comics)
Daimon Hellstrom
Lilith (Marvel Comics)
Llan the Sorcerer
Loki (comics)
Magik (comics)
Merlin (Marvel Comics)
Nico Minoru
Modred the Mystic
Baron Mordo
Morgan le Fay (Marvel Comics)
N'Kantu, the Living Mummy
Naga (Marvel Comics)
Necrom
Nekra
Nemesis (Alpha Flight)
Pestilence (comics)
Satana (Marvel Comics)
Scarlet Witch
Selene (comics)
Shaman (comics)
Sise-Neg
Talisman (Alpha Flight)
Umar (Marvel Comics)
Wiccan (comics)
Witchfire (Marvel Comics)
Zeus (Marvel Comics)
Are the 42 characters I see capable of taking a win (or wins).
The problem here is 13 of the names I took off i really sont know that well
I think Bluewaterrider's argument about Gepetto from Fables is a very good one, and fits the thread question well. Gepetto really was a doddery old dude living in a log cabin in the woods, but he had so many layers of magic and enchantments cast over him he was horrendously powerful in the Fables realm, almost omnipotent really. Even the Vorpal sword couldn't touch him, and that's the Fables equivalent of The Ultimate Nullifier.
^^^I took note of that one.
Its one i can use later on down the road i'm sure, which is why i occasionally make threads like this.
Once i sift through the BS replies, fanboys protecting their character replies, trying to be funny replies, cant let shit go from thread to thread replies, its surprising how much useful info i walk away with!
Originally posted by beatboksNo, it actually wasn't directed at your post, instead it was directed at the whole thread. "Can" isn't "will" in my opinion. If it has, who can beat him for a majority and I missed it, concession given freely.
If this is directed at my last post and how I said some listed are at or above Clark's level, that's not what I'm saying.
Those I listed are the ones I'm saying take majority most of the time. There are plenty there are others on a list that would definitely be below Clark who can take wins (a minority)and that's what the threat is asking.
Doctor Occult for example is nowhere near Superman in power, he is vastly below. He can easily be beaten by Batman or any street level character, but he has the potential to take 2 or 3 wins out of 10 against Superman. When it comes to fighting magical threats while being only a few rungs from the bottom he can and has fight/fought those at the top (purely because of the hax of his disk). Arion is also based on his broad history of feats a fee tiers below Superman. He jas feats on Superman's level but they involve either outside power or giving 120% and leaving nothing in the tank. He should (based on his higher feats ) take a few wins vs Superman but the actuality of it is he has had the opportunities and failed every time (he's made abiut 10 appearances in superman comics and failed to win every time. Superman has even succedded in breaking thru his magical shield around Atlantis)
Originally posted by Steve Zodiac
No, it actually wasn't directed at your post, instead it was directed at the whole thread. "Can" isn't "will" in my opinion. If it has, who can beat him for a majority and I missed it, concession given freely.
The fact that it said can is why I had aleays assumed it wasnt meant to be for a majority, but simply asking who the weakest magic user capable of taking a win or two out of ten from him. I haven't seem a simgle post on the thread that is talkimg a majority.
^^^you've gotten the gist of it since you started giving examples.
Originally posted by beatboks
Black Knight is probabaly the weakest (in magic) from marvel. Sort of fits like Occult from DC. Not hugely poeerful but one hax weapon that takes a win where one wouldn't be possible.If your talling physically weakest then not sure