quasar has auto shields. /shrug
from what i've heard i'm still not sure how pirate doesn't solo....? zoom is always a pain but ww took the best shots we've ever seen him throw. looking at his best in-book offense he's likely to smash them and send them flying then they can get back in the fight although i suppose there are ways around that if we go full on forum zoom. i prefer book zoom otherwise the debates just get stupid and he beats galactus and other cosmic beings. /shrug
Lol. The ENTIRE point of teleportation is that the distance is reduced.
So your post about speed being distance travelled etc is incredibly wrong.
It's like saying I'm faster than the world's fastest marathon runners, because I travelled from the start point to the end point in 30 mins, while they took over two hours.....
Because I used a shortcut.
The whole point of teleportation and the Q jump is that it's a shortcut.
Yeah, warping space also reduces the distance, Space gets longer behind and shorter in front of a warp bubble. As does entering the speed force which is similar. But I get it, you want a double standard. No problem, it doesn't change the fact the distance between A-B has been traversed in a specified time. But you know, changing the goalposts and all that because you don't want to be wrong. Sadly you can't change physics and Speed is distanced covered (in this dimension) over time (in this dimension). It doesn't matter if you've gone extradimensional or warped space/time to do it. You've still covered X distance in relativistic space. Faster than relativistic Physics allows for.
Originally posted by Steve Zodiac
Yeah, warping space also reduces the distance, Space gets longer behind and shorter in front of a warp bubble. As does entering the speed force which is similar. But I get it, you want a double standard. No problem, it doesn't change the fact the distance between A-B has been traversed in a specified time. But you know, changing the goalposts and all that because you don't want to be wrong. Sadly you can't change physics and Speed is distanced covered (in this dimension) over time (it this dimension). It doesn't matter if you've gone extradimensional or warped space/time to do it.
Lol teleportation changes the rules of physics. No double standard. THAT'S THE POINT OF TELEPORTATION, lol.
Like I said. It's like going from the start to the finish line at a marathon - but I used a shortcut through the back alleys. Does that make me the fastest marathon runner alive, if I start at the same time as all the others but arrive at the end point 1 hour before anyone else?
Zoom isn't faster, as noted by WW and Flash. His powers work by time manipulation.
Doesn't mean that he can't react and punch people faster than they can react and punch back, though.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Lol teleportation changes the rules of physics. No double standard. THAT'S THE POINT OF TELEPORTATION, lol.Like I said. It's like going from the start to the finish line at a marathon - but I used a shortcut through the back alleys. Does that make me the fastest marathon runner alive, if I start at the same time as all the others but arrive at the end point 1 hour before anyone else?
Zoom isn't faster, as noted by WW and Flash. His powers work by time manipulation.
Doesn't mean that he can't react and punch people faster than they can react and punch back, though.
Time manipulation is also altering the laws of physics-your whole argument is a strawman, because you are not taking a shortcut in relativistic space. You are travelling a distance in relativistic space. Warping is the same the distance has been changed in relation to the time variable. Going into the speed force is a shortcut, just like the Q zone, altering the time variable is a shortcut, warping space is a shortcut. By changing the timeline it's as much a shortcut as anything else. In fact more so.
Originally posted by Steve Zodiac
Time manipulation is also altering the laws of physics-your whole argument is a strawman, because you are not taking a shortcut in relativistic space. You are travelling a distance in relativistic space. Warping is the same the distance has been changed in relation to the time variable.
I know.
I never argued that Zoom didn't break the laws of physics, lol.
It's the exact same argument. You're just throwing random words in there - but the fact remains:
The race starts at 10am
By 11am, whilst everyone else is still running, I show up at the finish line. Did I travel there by shortcuts, by teleportation, or by running really fast? Doesn't matter, I still took 1 hour to go from Point A to Point B.
You're arguing that teleportation is the same as running really fast (travelling is travelling). The end result IS the same, I 100% agree - but the implications are completely different.
With Zoom (back to the thread) he exists in a constant time stop.
So from his perspective, EVERYONE is frozen in time. Quasar may have great teleportation feats - but that means nothing in this thread - just like Lois Lane using the JLA teleporters to instantly travel from Metropolis to the Moon doesn't mean she can fight Zoom, lol.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I know.I never argued that Zoom didn't break the laws of physics, lol.
It's the exact same argument. You're just throwing random words in there - but the fact remains:
The race starts at 10am
By 11am, whilst everyone else is still running, I show up at the finish line. Did I travel there by shortcuts, by teleportation, or by running really fast? Doesn't matter, I still took 1 hour to go from Point A to Point B.
You're arguing that teleportation is the same as running really fast (travelling is travelling). The end result IS the same, I 100% agree - but the implications are completely different.
With Zoom (back to the thread) he exists in a constant time stop.
So from his perspective, EVERYONE is frozen in time. Quasar may have great teleportation feats - but that means nothing in this thread - just like Lois Lane using the JLA teleporters to instantly travel from Metropolis to the Moon doesn't mean she can fight Zoom, lol.
I'm not throwing random words in at all. I'm using definitions from High-School level Physics, I could go beyond that if you like. I haven't argued Quasar is a match for Zoom's Speed. I have argued if given a nano second which he would get in this Scenario, he can teleport everyone into the heart of a sun and the A team deal with whatever Secret Society members are left alive.
Originally posted by Steve Zodiac
I'm not throwing random words in at all. I'm using definitions from High-School level Physics, I could go beyond that if you like. I haven't argued Quasar is a match for Zoom's Speed. I have argued if given a nano second which he would get in this Scenario, he can teleport everyone into the heart of a sun and the A team deal with whatever Secret Society members are left alive.
Wally has entire fights in a single picosecond, lol:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111130781/3837355-2105687924-profz.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/11113/111130781/3837356-2286837633-profz.jpg
That's PROFESSOR Zoom, btw. Eobard Thawne, NOT Zoom, Hunter Zolomon in this thread.
1 nanosecond = 1000picoseconds. IOW, Wally West is capable of doing all of the above - running, IMPs, gloating, vibrating death touch - 1000 times in the time it would take Quasar to do this teleport.
That's Wally.
ZOLOMON was casually batting away picosecond level Wally with one hand whilst talking to him:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111140449/4681449-6373013903-35254.jpg
When Wally was amped, with the speed of both Bart and Jay, Zolomon was still able to run thousands of miles away to visit Linda in Keystone City - MID-FIGHT, without even amped Wally noticing:
Hell, it wasn't even a quick visit. He had time to go through her medical records, lol.
So in summary: Wally is capable of having 1000 fights in the nanosecond it takes for Quasar to teleport someone (this ignores the point that his travel speed =/= reflex speed, but whatever). Despite this speed, Zolomon treated an amped version like a red-headed stepchild - whilst holding back on Wally.
IOW, in this thread, a nanosecond to teleport people is a lifetime for Zoom. He could punch, run and check the latest football scores, read some books, cook dinner, run back and punch them all again etc etc.
Or just do this with the good old Psycho Pirate:
https://s8.postimg.org/o9j9vfzs5/crisis-08-death-of-flash-005.jpg
https://s8.postimg.org/omao1n579/crisis-08-death-of-flash-007.jpg
There, Barry is grabbing the Pirate, and showing his face to every single Thunderer, making them all attack the AM.
Originally posted by Steve Zodiac
Yeah, read all the comics there... and I'm well aware of what Wally, Barry, Zoom can do. Do you really see Zoom soloing the Annihilators?
Not soloing.
Tying them up and distracting them enough for the others to get their licks in.
Psycho Pirate is physically the weakest - but if given the time to operate, could solo the field.
Time which the speedsters can buy him.
Then there's Bizarro. When Superman was in control (i.e. Bizarro's CIS was no longer in effect) he said this:
Originally posted by DarkSaint85I'm not getting into Psycho Pirate the mask is magic... It's quite likely it will affect most people or everyone on the field, but Ronan has some defence to the mystical (The Kree actually know magic what would you expect of an ancient star spanning empire.) as does Beta Ray Bill. Quasar may or may not be resistant, he has resisted Overmind and Moondragon, but that's TP not magic. Quasar doesn't like Magic.
Not soloing.Tying them up and distracting them enough for the others to get their licks in.
Psycho Pirate is physically the weakest - but if given the time to operate, could solo the field.
Time which the speedsters can buy him.
Then there's Bizarro. When Superman was in control (i.e. Bizarro's CIS was no longer in effect) he said this:
Bizarro is not stronger than Superman because of as Superman says the way his brain works.
Back to Zoom he is either able to defeat them all at once due to his speed or... He isn't.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wally has entire fights in a single picosecond, lol:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111130781/3837355-2105687924-profz.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/11113/111130781/3837356-2286837633-profz.jpgThat's PROFESSOR Zoom, btw. Eobard Thawne, NOT Zoom, Hunter Zolomon in this thread.
1 nanosecond = 1000picoseconds. IOW, Wally West is capable of doing all of the above - running, IMPs, gloating, vibrating death touch - 1000 times in the time it would take Quasar to do this teleport.
That's Wally.
ZOLOMON was casually batting away picosecond level Wally with one hand whilst talking to him:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111140449/4681449-6373013903-35254.jpgWhen Wally was amped, with the speed of both Bart and Jay, Zolomon was still able to run thousands of miles away to visit Linda in Keystone City - MID-FIGHT, without even amped Wally noticing:
Hell, it wasn't even a quick visit. He had time to go through her medical records, lol.
So in summary: Wally is capable of having 1000 fights in the nanosecond it takes for Quasar to teleport someone (this ignores the point that his travel speed =/= reflex speed, but whatever). Despite this speed, Zolomon treated an amped version like a red-headed stepchild - whilst holding back on Wally.
IOW, in this thread, a nanosecond to teleport people is a lifetime for Zoom. He could punch, run and check the latest football scores, read some books, cook dinner, run back and punch them all again etc etc.
Or just do this with the good old Psycho Pirate:
https://s8.postimg.org/o9j9vfzs5/crisis-08-death-of-flash-005.jpghttps://s8.postimg.org/omao1n579/crisis-08-death-of-flash-007.jpg
There, Barry is grabbing the Pirate, and showing his face to every single Thunderer, making them all attack the AM.
Damn! 👆
