Originally posted by Unbowed
I'm not saying Plagueis' ritual didn't contribute to it, but the bulk of it was the Clone Wars. Maul knew the Force status quo at the time of TPM yet he immediately felt the difference when Talzin healed him.
Well, I'm pretty sure Maul "died" before Sidious's ascension at the end of TPM. In either case there's enough evidence that the unbalance was enormous long before any shots were fired on Geonosis (which makes sense given that Yoda and Windu were noticing the effects pre-clone wars).
No, there isn't. IIRC Mace and Yoda have that conversation about their ability to use the Force being diminished after they find out they were unable to perceive the Clone Army being built.
But what's so special about that? The Jedi never see the Sith coming, in any era.
I suspect we're going to go round and round in circles since the details about the Chosen One prophecy were never clearly defined, nor was the "balance" it was supposed to bring about. Nor the involvement of the Ones.
If the prophecy is ancient then the "unbalance" in the Force is clearly not referring to Palpatine's machinations, since the Force waxed and waned throughout recorded history - and after Palpatine was killed. And if even the Father was aware of and interested in the prophecy, then it's clearly not about the Palpatine/ the Banite Sith, but something inherent to the nature of the Force.
On the other hand if we're to believe the Plagueis novel, then Anakin's birth was a direct consequence of Plagueis meddling with the midichlorians. It's the classic "mortal messes with the natural order out of hubris/divine retribution follows" motif.
Either way Sheev doesn't have jack shit to do with it.
Originally posted by Unbowed
No, there isn't. IIRC Mace and Yoda have that conversation about their ability to use the Force being diminished after they find out they were unable to perceive the Clone Army being built.
Nah, if you watch the scene again it's clear they've been thinking about it for some time ("I think it's time we inform the senate our ability to use the force has diminished", "only the dark lord of the sith knows of our weakness..."😉
But what's so special about that? The Jedi never see the Sith coming, in any era.
But they never make it a major plot point that they're long-term foresight is impaired.
I suspect we're going to go round and round in circles since the details about the Chosen One prophecy were never clearly defined, nor was the "balance" it was supposed to bring about. Nor the involvement of the Ones.
The prophecy was originally to replace the Father and stop Plagueis's midichlorian manipulation (the second being the most immediate trigger). When the latter died and the former didn't work out, it still served the purpose of re-balancing the Force through the defeat of Palpatine, given that sources have confirmed that Anakin did indeed fulfill it.
If the prophecy is ancient then the "unbalance" in the Force is clearly not referring to Palpatine's machinations, since the Force waxed and waned throughout recorded history - and after Palpatine was killed.
But not to the extent that Sidious was a threat in RotJ.
And if even the Father was aware of and interested in the prophecy, then it's clearly not about the Palpatine/ the Banite Sith, but something inherent to the nature of the Force.
Why?
Either way Sheev doesn't have jack shit to do with it.
Except that he does. It's been confirmed that the death of Sidious fulfilled the prophecy, a fact clearly corroborated by Sidious's unbalancing of it by EoTPM.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Think the Chosen One prophecy has a lot more with the destruction of the Sith than necessarily killing Palpatine.
Perhaps that was the original intent, but it doesn't seem to be the case in Legends given that it was created in direct response to Plagueis, and given that the Sith survived RotJ.
The Father, much like the Jedi of old, foresaw the creation of the Chosen One. To what end they could only speculate; the Jedi believed he would bring balance to the Force, and the Father took that to mean he would replace him as the ruler of Mortis, preventing his children from tearing apart the fabric of the universe.
However, in Legends it's very much the case that Anakin was birthed by Plagueis' actions, either directly or indirectly. In Canon, nowhere is it said to my knowledge that Anakin's purpose is necessarily to replace the Father. It just so happens that Anakin, a being of pure Force energy, is strong enough to replace the Father, because while the Ones are godlike, they appear to just be extremely powerful Force users.
He doesn't necessarily have a set purpose, only one that people prescribe for him. And it does seem like killing Sidious is what returned balance to the Force. Whether that's because Sidious personally was upsetting the balance or because he was carrying on the Sith, I'm not sure. It's more likely because the far-reaching consequences of his actions, all the death and suffering he caused, was knocking the Force out of whack.
Given that it was stated Sidious' first "death" aboard the Death Star allowed Anakin to fulfill it's prophecy, it's seems pretty clear to me that it was more than just Palpatine's power that caused the imbalance.
Or else, the balance would have been immediattely throw out of the wack the minute he returned, and only got stronger as he further increased his power in the events leading to DE.
I'd say his grip on the galaxy, in conjunction with his Force abilities is what caused the imbalance to be as profound as it was. Hence, why his first Death restored it because his political grip of the galaxy had gone and the Jedi Order was to begin anew.
Firstly, Plagueis himself corroborates it:
“The Jedi await the coming of a savior, a prophesied Chosen One who will destroy the Sith and bring balance to the Force. The Jedi tell of Mortis, a place of impossible geography inside the angles of a gargantuan monolith. The three all-powerful beings of Mortis can assume strange shapes and exemplify the dark side, the light side, and the principle of balance.“Compelling? It is debatable, but at the very least it is an adequate way to illustrate an allegorical point. Day coexists with night, for example and construction is always followed by ruin. Yet many of the Jedi treat the legend of Mortis as literal truth. They believe that the Chosen One will prevent these gods and demons from tearing the universe asunder—that their champion will be a vessel of pure Force energy.”
--Darth Plagueis
Then the Father himself outright states it:
"Do you feel your destiny? You must see it now. I am dying, and you must replace me."
"Replace you? I can't stay here."
"But this is yours. It has been foretold. The Chosen One will remain to keep my children in balance."
"No."
"I cannot force you to do this. The choice must be yours. But leave and your selfishness shall haunt you and the galaxy."
- The Father and Anakin Skywalker, Altar of Mortis, Star Wars The Clone Wars
Then there's the Databank:
In the mysterious realm of Mortis there exists a trio of beings able to wield the Force in ways no known mortals of the galaxy can. The Father maintained balance between his Daughter and his Son, who expressed affinity to the light and dark side of the Force, respectively. The Father knew his days were numbered -- facing his impending demise, he needed to find another to keep the balance. His goal was the same described in an ancient Jedi prophecy -- the rise of a Chosen One who will bring balance to the Force.
- Star Wars Databank