Originally posted by leonidas
yeah but both wally and savitar were limited to light speed BECAUSE of the speed force being there, not because they couldn't go faster than light. i mean he entered the sf, so clearly he was capable of ftl travel.superman would need to shift his own senses, like flash did, and like superman himself was forced to do to speak with flash in that restaurant. savitar was also able to generate a momentum robbing force field. not sure supes could get around it. but he did def steal the speed of non-sf users. cassiopeia in fact died in that arc iirc because savitar stole his speed from what was....100s or 1000s of miles away? he doesn't have to gain speed from it. all he needs to do is steal all of superman's speed and it's over.
superman isn't blitzing savitar by any means, and that would give him tons of time to steal superman's speed, in exactly the same way wally would be able to. it's one ability superman has no defense against. /shrug
No.
And Savitar only got to that point twice because of Max and Flash. Flash had to actually throw him into the speed force. They even called it the edge of light multiple times, and Wally spoke of nearing lightspeed earlier.
Savitar specifically can't go lightspeed, or at least he couldn't in that series. Not sure if they retconned it since.
Flash at the start of that series was about the speed of sound, then about a quarter of the way through to Savitar he was about 4 times as fast. He only entered the Speed Force one time before iirc. This was not the Flash you are used to. Darksaint Flash.
Wally was specifically having dinner at normal human speeds when they came out of nowhere and shifted his senses automatically. It's really no big deal.
Cass's death was blamed specifically on Wally mainlining the speed force. Which means his origin was retconned to rely on the speedforce. I know Savitar did it, but it's pretty telling that they first blamed Wally's speed force shenanigans for messing with it. And this was before everyone knew he could steal speed.
Furthermore, Cass' max speed was around 700 mph, and he still fell to his death. As did all those SF users still have the ability to move around. Which indicates it was targetting the SF itself as opposed to just momentum.
As well as his null field being the reason things couldn't touch him. Not him stealing speed from thrown objects, but a field he keeps around himself. A field only used against shitty little objects, not Superman punching him in the face.
As I said before, Max (I said Quick for some reason) was able to retain his speed because it was within him, and he wasn't tapping into it like the other users. Because Sav was messing with that, but he didn't show the ability to steal away innate speed like Max, Flash, thrown objects, or Superman. If Superman were tapping into the speed force, sure Sav could steal it. But as it stands now, I see no reason why he should. He's a speed force manipulator, not a kinetic energy manipulator. There was a difference back then.
And I also see no reason why his null field would completely stop a Superman level punch.
