Originally posted by Nibedicus
Of course I’m writing a book, that’s ‘cuz I’m schooling you. Seriously, I should be charging you tuition.You, of course, can only keep it short because there is only so much you can do with nothing.
1. This has already been debunked. Until you can provide a logical argument, then you are repeating yourself now. I have never argued that JJ has bulletproof hands. You’ve gone from red herring to false equivalence to strawmanning now. Good job.
Lol. You saying something is fact does not make it so. You need to provide evidence and a logical argument other than “nuh-uh” and “izz stoopid”.
I will repeat, my explanation is logically consistent with the evidence. My explanation is a direct consequence of the evidence. You need strength and durability to successfully crush something. Strength isn’t enough. Logic is simple and stands on itself.
That is all I need. Until you can show where the logical inconsistency is, you have nothing.
3. Wrong. Outliers are evidence and are still usable in many cases. Such as this. Since this compares directly apples-to-apples (durability vs. durability) to the evidence and is applicable by virtue of transitive property (Hela Hand>Mjolnir, Mjolnir>DBeam thus Hand > DBeam). If Supergirl lifted a key weighing 50 million tons, we cannot argue that she would get crushed because she would be unable to push a 20 million ton weight off her.
4. Well, good then since you provided no evidence that it would hurt her, one cannot argue that it would hurt her.
5. It is not rocket science. It literally took Thor less than a minute to figure it out. Hela has been shown to palm an attack and use that to disable/disarm an opponent (Thor by crushing Mjolnir) or one interpret that as “palming an attack and destroying an opponent’s primary weapon”. Which would still be applicable to crushing the Destroyer’s beam projector face. She has the showings indicating that she could think of this and is in line with how she’s been shown to fight and you have not provided one SHRED of counterevidence or even a coherent argument other than your usual “nuh-uh”.
6. The Destroyer doesn’t need to stand still. She can simply close in (easily) by dodging/evading or by stunning it with necroblades and then as soon as the Destroyer opens its face (literally telegraphing its attack, may as well hang a sign there) to shoot, like here:
(0:38) and (0:59)
Where it takes at least a few seconds for it to even get a shot off, Hela jumps on, crumples its face like tinfoil, palms the beam and shoves its blast back into its head. Easy peezy Destroyerface squeezy.
The Destroyer has zero evasion game. It’s a slow moving lumbering machine. It doesn’t have to stand still. Because with the way it moves, it may as well be standing still. Pathetic argument, btw.
7. Except you are forgetting one critical detail: She caught a full Mjolnir throw with her hand without budging an inch. If a Mjolnir throw couldn’t budge her, the concussive force from a Destroyer beam would do nothing. You know, the same Mjolnir that plowed thru the Destroyer beam, concussive force and all like it was nothing?
Which is exactly what your argument is. Nothing. You. Got. Nothing.
And seeing as you seem to have no rebuttal for the several other methods I have outlined where Hela pwns the Destroyer, I’m assuming that you have conceded this insanity?
1. The logic you are applying for Hela applies to Jessica Jones.
P1: Hela has been stabbed through her torso = Jessica Jones being stabbed or injured through her torso.
P2: Hela crushed Mjolnir = Jessica Jones crushed large steel padlocks.
Conclusion: Hela's hands are significantly different in durability than her torso AND Hela's hands is more durable than Mjolnir = Jessica Jones hands are significantly more durable than her torso AND Jessica Jones hands are more durable than a large steel padlock.
Therefore, Jessica Jones hands are bulletproof as your universal rule suggests.
Outliers are not usuable, unless you want to argue that Supergirl can CASUALLY (no effort) lift a million tons in a forum fight.
Palming the beam and thinking about shoving it in its mouth are not related.
That's why we have fiction inconsistency. Mjolnir not pushing her back (actually it can be because she still has power over it) and D beams pushing others back.
Originally posted by h1a8You’re a phucking nut case 😂
1. The logic you are applying for Hela applies to Jessica Jones.
P1: Hela has been stabbed through her torso = Jessica Jones being stabbed or injured through her torso.
P2: Hela crushed Mjolnir = Jessica Jones crushed large steel padlocks.Conclusion: Hela's hands are significantly different in durability than her torso AND Hela's hands is more durable than Mjolnir = Jessica Jones hands are significantly more durable than her torso AND Jessica Jones hands are more durable than a large steel padlock.
Therefore, Jessica Jones hands are bulletproof as your universal rule suggests.
Outliers are not usuable, unless you want to argue that Supergirl can CASUALLY (no effort) lift a million tons in a forum fight.
Palming the beam and thinking about shoving it in its mouth are not related.
That's why we have fiction inconsistency. Mjolnir not pushing her back (actually it can be because she still has power over it) and D beams pushing others back.
Originally posted by h1a8
1. The logic you are applying for Hela applies to Jessica Jones.
P1: Hela has been stabbed through her torso = Jessica Jones being stabbed or injured through her torso.
P2: Hela crushed Mjolnir = Jessica Jones crushed large steel padlocks.Conclusion: Hela's hands are significantly different in durability than her torso AND Hela's hands is more durable than Mjolnir = Jessica Jones hands are significantly more durable than her torso AND Jessica Jones hands are more durable than a large steel padlock.
Therefore, Jessica Jones hands are bulletproof as your universal rule suggests.
Outliers are not usuable, unless you want to argue that Supergirl can CASUALLY (no effort) lift a million tons in a forum fight.
Palming the beam and thinking about shoving it in its mouth are not related.
That's why we have fiction inconsistency. Mjolnir not pushing her back (actually it can be because she still has power over it) and D beams pushing others back.
I was about to type up a long-ass reply ready but then I realized that that would be a waste of time. Your entire reply has no substance.
Obviously, you got nothing and now you’re just trying to extend the debate with: irrelevant red herrings that I don’t even need to address (the JJ red herring strawman), arguments I’ve already addressed many times (the outliers can never be used “nuh uh” argument and the Hela can’t figure out crushing BS) and more unsubstantiated claims that I 100% would be in the right to ignore (the Mjolnir link speculation).
You refuted nothing, provided no evidence supporting your assertions and basically hand-waved the multiple ways Hela could PWN the Destroyer while providing zero ways for the Destroyer to actually win.
You have nothing. You continue to have nothing.
Come back when you’ve grown some backbone and actually address the points I made. Start with the multiple ways I pointed out on how Hela could win then after that, provide even one way the Destroyer could win (that I already haven’t destroyed).
Get back to me when you actually have an argument.
Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Where are you getting she has control over it H1? Mjolnir was actively trying to return to Thor but could not because HeLa was holding it by pure strength and then crushed it with her ✋👋✋👋✋👋✋Easy Peezy Destroyer face squeezy? Lol
Maybe. But remember, Mjolnir was once hers.
I’m fine with her using only strength.
@nibedicus
You haven’t proven that Hela can block the beams with her hands without getting damaged. The crushing Mjolnir feat doesn’t prove it. And How would she crumple the Destroyer?
Originally posted by h1a8
Maybe. But remember, Mjolnir was once hers.
I’m fine with her using only strength.@nibedicus
You haven’t proven that Hela can block the beams with her hands without getting damaged. The crushing Mjolnir feat doesn’t prove it. And How would she crumple the Destroyer?
I do not have to prove a negative.
I have already provided proof. Mjolnir>DBeam, Hand>Mjolnir, Hand>DBeam. You going nuh uh doesn’t disprove this.
The same way she crushed Mjolnir, with her hands. This is obvious AF. Have you been off your meds or something?
Originally posted by Nibedicus
I do not have to prove a negative.I have already provided proof. Mjolnir>DBeam, Hand>Mjolnir, Hand>DBeam. You going nuh uh doesn’t disprove this.
The same way she crushed Mjolnir, with her hands. This is obvious AF. Have you been off your meds or something?
That proof does not fly. Otherwise Jessica Jones hands would be bulletproof.
1. She didn't necessarily crush Mjolnir in the manner you are thinking.
Mjolnir was applying a force too.
Also it was energy pressure inside of Mjolnir that did work.
2. If purely strength then Its an outlier. All other showings contradict it.
3. Destroyer can reform.
Originally posted by h1a8
That proof does not fly. Otherwise Jessica Jones hands would be bulletproof.1. She didn't necessarily crush Mjolnir in the manner you are thinking.
Mjolnir was applying a force too.
Also it was energy pressure inside of Mjolnir that did work.2. If purely strength then Its an outlier. All other showings contradict it.
3. Destroyer can reform.
If she didn't crush Mjolnir with strength, provide proof of how she crushed it.
Originally posted by h1a8
That proof does not fly. Otherwise Jessica Jones hands would be bulletproof.1. She didn't necessarily crush Mjolnir in the manner you are thinking.
2. Mjolnir was applying a force too.
3.Also it was energy pressure inside of Mjolnir that did work.4. If purely strength then Its an outlier. All other showings contradict it.
5, Destroyer can reform.
Lol. Red herring. Apply proof relative to the characters in thread or gtfo.
You haven’t presented any proof that the Destroyer beam would damage her. Much less her hand. Til then, proof available shows that she would palm the Destroyer by default due to absence of proof it could even hurt her.
1. She used her hand’s physical strength and her durabity to crush Mjolnir. That is taking evidence at face value. Anything beyond that is speculatory. Thus ignored.
2. Mjolnir was applying force from the front. She crushed it from the sides. Pls take your meds first before debating.
3. LOL. Speculative. Ignored. Again, meds pls.
4. Ok then. What Hela strength showing directly contradicts this? Post proof.
5. Lol. No it can’t. Post proof of Destroyer reforming after taking something that actually damaged its armor. Not just getting pierced thru one of its slits. Stop making shit up. Meds. Pls.
Originally posted by Nibedicus
Lol. Red herring. Apply proof relative to the characters in thread or gtfo.You haven’t presented any proof that the Destroyer beam would damage her. Much less her hand. Til then, proof available shows that she would palm the Destroyer by default due to absence of proof it could even hurt her.
1. She used her hand’s physical strength and her durabity to crush Mjolnir. That is taking evidence at face value. Anything beyond that is speculatory. Thus ignored.
2. Mjolnir was applying force from the front. She crushed it from the sides. Pls take your meds first before debating.
3. LOL. Speculative. Ignored. Again, meds pls.
4. Ok then. What Hela strength showing directly contradicts this? Post proof.
5. Lol. No it can’t. Post proof of Destroyer reforming after taking something that actually damaged its armor. Not just getting pierced thru one of its slits. Stop making shit up. Meds. Pls.
1. If a character can crush something with their hand then their hand is more durable than that object. This is the rule you gave us as if it is always true. I gave a counter example showing why the rule is false.
2. Im referring to the outward pressure the energy inside was creating before the explosion.
4. Every single showing. Her striking characters and not killing or koing them instantly, the distance she was hitting characters away, etc. If there is at least one other showing that is close to the Mjolnir feat then it wouldn't be an outlier.
5. So u belive that when Destroyer showed us that it was able to reform its armor at will doesnt mean it can do the same if someone bends its armor?
Originally posted by h1a8
1. If a character can crush something with their hand then their hand is more durable than that object. This is the rule you gave us as if it is always true. I gave a counter example showing why the rule is false.2. Im referring to the outward pressure the energy inside was creating before the explosion.
4. Every single showing. Her striking characters and not killing or koing them instantly, the distance she was hitting characters away, etc. If there is at least one other showing that is close to the Mjolnir feat then it wouldn't be an outlier.
5. So u belive that when Destroyer showed us that it was able to reform its armor at will doesnt mean it can do the same if someone bends its armor?
1. That rule is true. The counterexample proved nothing and is irrelevant. The rule is logically consistent until “feats” and evidence prove otherwise. That is how debating fiction works.
And you are going from “hand is as durable to body” to “hand is more durable than object” with your counterexample BS. You seem unsure w/c angle you’re trying to disprove. Even though, you’ve failed to disprove either. You seem confused.
2. Baseless speculation. Ignored.
4. None of those directly contradict the showing. You need to learn what “directly contradict” means. None of those show her straining or applying full strength or anything, all those times she was nonchalantly doing everything. Absence of evidence is not evidence of contradiction.
Til you show me a showing where she was unable to do something she set out to do because she wasn’t strong enough, you have nothing.
5. When did it reform its armor? If you’re talking about the Sif stab. All it did was wake back up after being shut down. Otherwise, provide video. Stop making shit up.
Originally posted by Nibedicus
1. That rule is true. The counterexample proved nothing and is irrelevant. The rule is logically consistent until “feats” and evidence prove otherwise. That is how debating fiction works.And you are going from “hand is as durable to body” to “hand is more durable than object” with your counterexample BS. You seem unsure w/c angle you’re trying to disprove. Even though, you’ve failed to disprove either. You seem confused.
2. Baseless speculation. Ignored.
4. None of those directly contradict the showing. You need to learn what “directly contradict” means. None of those show her straining or applying full strength or anything, all those times she was nonchalantly doing everything. Absence of evidence is not evidence of contradiction.
Til you show me a showing where she was unable to do something she set out to do because she wasn’t strong enough, you have nothing.
5. When did it reform its armor? If you’re talking about the Sif stab. All it did was wake back up after being shut down. Otherwise, provide video. Stop making shit up.
1. If the rule is always true then it would be true in Jessica Jones case too. But it’s not.
2. Mjolnir was cracking. After a certain extent, all the energy inside was released in an explosion. This contributed to the rest of the destruction of Mjolnir. The explosion proves that the energy inside was exerting an outward pressure inside the hammer.
Anyway Mjolnir cracked as if it was brittle and not malleable. Once something is cracked then its structural integrity is compromised, making it vastly easier to damage it further (think of an egg). So the feat is really about the strength needed to compress Mjolnir less than 1 cm on each side in order to get it to crack.
3. Hela isn’t worthy and thus lifted Mjolnir. This means that she had some manipulation ability over it. This makes sense because Mjolnir was once hers.
4. That’s not how fiction works. Hela was automatically applying the majority of her strength when she was trying to kill or stop someone. It makes no sense for Hela to hit someone with a tiny fraction of her strength to not even ko them when she is murdering everyone else.
5. It rearranged its whole structure at will.
Originally posted by h1a8
3. Hela isn’t worthy and thus lifted Mjolnir. This means that she had some manipulation ability over it. This makes sense because Mjolnir was once hers.
No, it means she was strong enough to overcome the enchantment. You're just making things up in an effort to downplay the feat.