Comic Book Questions & Discussion

Started by abhilegend1,926 pages
abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans
Originally posted by Astner
Your scan specifically refers to the split.

The splitting of Spectre and Jim Corrigan refers to the fact that Corrigan was alive for decades.

In fact Corrigan turns into Spectre right after that.

I'm not sure what you're getting at here, but it looks like you have a lot to sort out here because the scan you provided has nothing to do with what you're now referring to.

You really do have comprehension problems. Here's Spectre merging with Jim Corrigan in Spectre 2, 1987.

Corrigan always thought that Spectre was a part of him and when Spectre left his body, he gets weakened. This is the retcon of the idea.

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Originally posted by Astner
That said, I'm not even sure how this power scale chain is supposed to make sense, because the Brothers (who were more powerful than the Spectre and Living Tribunal) were dwarfed by the Living Tribunal in the subsequent retcon.

- DC Vesus Marvel #4

- Adventures of the X-Men #12

Originally posted by abhilegend
So much mental gymnastics that its not even funny.

And Ron Marz had Access come to Kyle in DCU in Jun 1997.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Green_Lantern_Vol_3_87

And Access pretty much reiterated DC vs Marvel in Unlimited Access 1 which happened in Dec, 1997.

http://marvel.wikia.com/Unlimited_Access_Vol_1_1

Anybody can read it here.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Unlimited-Access/Issue-1?id=76650

While Adventures of X-men occurred in March 1997.

http://marvel.wikia.com/The_Adventures_of_the_X-Men_Vol_1_12

Adventures of X men is entirely non canon to DC. Unlimited Access is and that reiterated DC vs Marvel where LT was a gnat to Brothers.

Shut up troll.

Originally posted by Galan007
I get what abhi is saying.

During Unlimited Access(which was indeed published months after Adventures of the X-Men, which technically makes it the more authoritative source), Access recalls the events of the DC vs. Marvel crossover exactly as they took place, and even describes the Brothers:
https://i.imgur.com/XxLJdhV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/PTDm9Rt.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/pakpiYT.jpg
"The two "Brothers" fill our vision. I think they somehow symbolize the two universes, or something like that... They're overpowering...Infinite...Incomprehensible."

And considering that Access still had full working knowledge of LT and Spectre, given that he literally watched them try(and fail miserably) to and stop the Brothers during the crossover:
https://i.imgur.com/gGpFSWx.jpg

...I'd say describing the Brothers the way he did is pretty telling.

That being said, I see two possibilities here:
a.) The Brothers were retconned to sub-LT-level in Adventures of the X-Men, and then retconned back to their superior DC vs. Marvel levels a few months later in Unlimited Access.

-OR-

b.) The 'twin entities' LT was holding in Adventures of the X-Men weren't the same Brothers from DC vs. Marvel in the first place.

...That's my take, at least. Really not interested in arguing about it, though. srug

In short, Adventures of X-men 12 got retconned six months later in Unlimited Access.

Astner The Ghost Who Walks

Originally posted by abhilegend
The splitting of Spectre and Jim Corrigan refers to the fact that Corrigan was alive for decades.

That's not the split. The split occurred at the end of volume three in 1998. Prior to that Corrigan had full access to the Spectre Force.

DC Versus Marvel (1996) -> Corrigan-Spectre Force split (1998) -> Martian Manhunter #23 (2000)

DC Versus Marvel predates this whole thing.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You really do have comprehension problems. Here's Spectre merging with Jim Corrigan in Spectre 2, 1987.

Corrigan always thought that Spectre was a part of him and when Spectre left his body, he gets weakened. This is the retcon of the idea.


That's not the split being referred to.

This is just damage control on your part after your head-canon collapsed.

Originally posted by abhilegend
In short, Adventures of X-men 12 got retconned six months later in Unlimited Access.

I'm at work, so I can't check this out. So I'll take your word for it, for now.

MrMind Senior Member

Originally posted by Astner
Marvel vs DC, released 1996, canon.

the only thing correct about that crossover is spectre and living tribunal being equal

they both suck

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Also from Spectre 4, 1987.

Corrigan believed that if Spectre remained 48 hours away from him, he will cease to exist.

MrMind Senior Member

hawt

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Originally posted by Astner
That's not the split. The split occurred at the end of volume three in 1998. Prior to that Corrigan had full access to the Spectre Force.

DC Versus Marvel (1996) -> Corrigan-Spectre Force split (1998) -> Martian Manhunter #23 (2000)

DC Versus Marvel predates this whole thing.

That's not the split being referred to.

This is just damage control on your part after your head-canon collapsed.

I'm at work, so I can't check this out. So I'll take your word for it, for now.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Also from Spectre 4, 1987.

Corrigan believed that if Spectre remained 48 hours away from him, he will cease to exist.

In fact the story takes place ten years in the past before Justice League even formed.

Its narrated by Hal Jordan as spectre in present day.

So obviously it doesn't refer to the split in Vol 3

Astner The Ghost Who Walks

Originally posted by MrMind
the only thing correct about that crossover is spectre and living tribunal being equal

This was another point I was going to get to. It never says that they're equal. They fight together, and they command sufficient power of their respective universes to where they seem equally useful against the Brothers.

Originally posted by MrMind
they both suck

The cross-overs were terrible, and I'm not sure how it found its place into DC's new Omniverse, along with stupid one-off alternate realities featuring worlds overrun by zombies, vampires, and werewolves, meanwhile popular titles from Vertigo and Wildstorm are nowhere to be found.

Originally posted by abhilegend
So obviously it doesn't refer to the split in Vol 3

I'm not going to start shit now, because I have a meeting at in half an hour. But you're wrong here.

The scene in Martian Manhunter #23 (2000) is very clearly a reference to the split in Spectre vol 3 #62 (1998). I get that you don't want to concede to this now, because that'd mean having to concede the entire argument, and that would be far too uncharacteristic of you, so I'll just leave it at that.

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Originally posted by Astner
This was another point I was going to get to. It never says that they're equal. They fight together, and they command sufficient power of their respective universes to where they seem equally useful against the Brothers.

Obviously Spectre was more powerful considering he was only at half power.

MrMind Senior Member

Originally posted by Astner
This was another point I was going to get to. It never says that they're equal. They fight together, and they command sufficient power of their respective universes to where they seem equally useful against the Brothers.

The cross-overs were terrible, and I'm not sure how it found its place into DC's new Omniverse, along with stupid one-off alternate realities featuring worlds overrun by zombies, vampires, and werewolves, meanwhile popular titles from Vertigo and Wildstorm are nowhere to be found.

consider the quality of writers dc is using these days im glad they are not touching vertigo and wildstorm

Astner The Ghost Who Walks

Originally posted by MrMind
consider the quality of writers dc is using these days im glad they are not touching vertigo and wildstorm

The fact that the original Watchmen universe isn't on the list is what surprised me the most, considering the Doomsday Clock event.

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Wildstorm is still merged with proper dc universe.

DarkSaint85 Bonified abstract

Originally posted by Astner
Four months seem like an awfully short period of time to turn a one-eighty and celebrate that the Spectre has now "officially" become the Living Tribunal's equal.

It's more likely that he didn't believe in his own bullshit, but still felt that he needed to stand up for DC.

DC Versus Marvel ended in May 1996. The split between the Corrigan and the Spectre-Force occurred at the end of volume three, released in February, 1998.

So DC Versus Marvel had to have taken place before the split.

OR he's referring to the Spectre and LT being equal.....in those scans.

Which came out in the 90s.

At THIS POINT, (I..e the roaring 20s), Spectre is blah blah teabags LT whatever.

Don't really care, Batman would drop kick all four chins.

MrMind Senior Member
Originally posted by abhilegend
Wildstorm is still merged with proper dc universe.

yep, the wildstorm 30 year anniversary this week confirmed that

30 years...time is a *****

and it's not a good thing, dc needs to make wildstorm a seperate universe again. they don't blend well with mainstream dc characters at all.

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

Barry punches Anti Monitor through universeS at near infinite mass.

They still need to BFR Anti Monitor.

qwertyuiop1998 The Vampire

Originally posted by abhilegend
In fact the story takes place ten years in the past before Justice League even formed.

Its narrated by Hal Jordan as spectre in present day.

So obviously it doesn't refer to the split in Vol 3


The Secret Files & Origins Guide to the DC Universe 2000 also mentions that Corrigan was freed from the spectre and Superman was transformed to pure energy being(Blue Superman who was presented in The Spectre 62) and Hal became Spectre all happened in the same year

https://ibb.co/mznwLDL
https://ibb.co/pn0tznz

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

abhilegend Prince of All Saiyans

DarkSaint is Mark Waid in disguise

DarkSaint85 Bonified abstract
Originally posted by abhilegend
DarkSaint is Mark Waid in disguise
Astner The Ghost Who Walks

Originally posted by abhilegend
Wildstorm is still merged with proper dc universe.

You mean Earth 0? I doubt we'll ever see any of the Wildstorm characters featured in the main-continuity.

That said, Wildstorm wasn't a universe, it was a publisher. There were plenty of completely unrelated stories, some for licences they didn't own.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
OR he's referring to the Spectre and LT being equal.....in those scans.

Which came out in the 90s.

At THIS POINT, (I..e the roaring 20s), Spectre is blah blah teabags LT whatever.


Then what's the point of even bringing it up? Even if we disregard the retcon, we've gone through a slew of different Living Tribunals since then. Adam Walock even alluded to being more powerful than his predecessor.

Originally posted by MrMind
and it's not a good thing, dc needs to make wildstorm a seperate universe again. they don't blend well with mainstream dc characters at all.

If they ever plan to do anything with the characters then they'll probably do it. The issue, as I understand it, is that Wildstorm was rather generous with the creator-rights, so DC would have to pay those creators to feature their characters.

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
The Secret Files & Origins Guide to the DC Universe 2000 also mentions that Corrigan was freed from the spectre and Superman was transformed to pure energy being(Blue Superman who was presented in The Spectre 62) and Hal became Spectre all happened in the same year

https://ibb.co/mznwLDL
https://ibb.co/pn0tznz


Yes. Thank you.