Originally posted by mike brown
This kinda thing is ****ed up to me. People want to serve their country and Trump wants to ban them when he would never make that kind of sacrifice himself?
There is a list of things that disqualify you from military service ranging from bone spurs(ha) to asthma.
So mull through that list and see if anything jumps out that might be problematic for someone causing significant changes to their hormones etc.
Endocrine and Metabolic Disorders
The following conditions may disqualify you for military service:
a. Adrenal dysfunction of any degree.
b. Diabetes mellitus of any type.
c. Glycosuria. Persistent, when associated with impaired glucose tolerance or renal tubular defects.
d. Acromegaly. Gigantism or other disorder of pituitary function.
e. Gout.
f. Hyperinsulinism.
g. Hyperparathyroidism and hypoparathyroidism.
h. Thyroid disorders.
(1) Goiter, persistent or untreated.
(2) Hypothyroidism, uncontrolled by medication.
(3) Cretinism.
(4) Hyperthyroidism.
(5) Thyroiditis.
Any number of these things can happened from removing your reproductive organs
As far as I'm aware the military is pretty restrictive about health conditions. One of my friends just got ****ed out of being able to join the coast guard because of acid reflux or some shit.
That being said, I'm not going to pretend to be familiar enough with the surrounding information to cheer or weep about this.
I mainly want to know if the referred to Supreme Court decision is a check on the power of the lower courts who honestly seem like they've been exercising a bit too much power recently.
Originally posted by snowdragon
There is a list of things that disqualify you from military service ranging from bone spurs(ha) to asthma.So mull through that list and see if anything jumps out that might be problematic for someone causing significant changes to their hormones etc.
Even fake bones spurs. Anyhow.
That's approaching the situation from unfair standards, as you're blanketing all trans soldiers and saying they're all not up to par regardless if they are or not.
No one's arguing that a trans soldier should be exempt from from standard military regulations and protocols, if any single trans soldier fails as on their own merits, then remove them as you would any other soldier who failed. There are active trans soldiers now serving; seems at least some came meet the requirements.
edit: Despite her age, Kristin Beck would probably still meet the physical requirements of most military units
Originally posted by Emperordmb
As far as I'm aware the military is pretty restrictive about health conditions. One of my friends just got ****ed out of being able to join the coast guard because of acid reflux or some shit.That being said, I'm not going to pretend to be familiar enough with the surrounding information to cheer or weep about this.
I mainly want to know if the referred to Supreme Court decision is a check on the power of the lower courts who honestly seem like they've been exercising a bit too much power recently.
Okay, as noted, no one is arguing trans soldiers be exempt . If they fail as individuals, then they fail, just like any other.
But it seems so as this Judge said he was abiding to the SC ruling.
Originally posted by BrolyBlack
Endocrine and Metabolic Disorders
The following conditions may disqualify you for military service:a. Adrenal dysfunction of any degree.
b. Diabetes mellitus of any type.
c. Glycosuria. Persistent, when associated with impaired glucose tolerance or renal tubular defects.
d. Acromegaly. Gigantism or other disorder of pituitary function.
e. Gout.
f. Hyperinsulinism.
g. Hyperparathyroidism and hypoparathyroidism.
h. Thyroid disorders.
(1) Goiter, persistent or untreated.
(2) Hypothyroidism, uncontrolled by medication.
(3) Cretinism.
(4) Hyperthyroidism.
(5) Thyroiditis.
Any number of these things can happened from removing your reproductive organs
Originally posted by Robtard
Even fake bones spurs. Anyhow.That's approaching the situation from unfair standards, as you're blanketing all trans soldiers and saying they're all not up to par regardless if they are or not.
No one's arguing that a trans soldier should be exempt from from standard military regulations and protocols, if any single trans soldier fails as on their own merits, then remove them as you would any other soldier who failed. There are active trans soldiers now serving; seems at least some came meet the requirements.
edit: Despite her age, Kristin Beck would probably still meet the physical requirements of most military units
That's not my list of medical conditions that would prevent you from joining the military, it's their list. If they were to undergo transition while they were in service would it prevent them from doing their jobs? Would it create changes that would make them ineligible medically? It seems to me that aside from the male/female aspect the physiological changes and hormonal could be problematic.
If they had made the changes prior to joining would there be problems in their medicals that would show up on that list? I don't know but it seems to me rather then worry about "feelings" it would be wiser to simply review them medically.
Originally posted by Nibedicus
Well, if you think about it, aren't medical conditions all generalized? I mean aren't there ppl with some of the above conditions that can function just as well or even better than some ppl w/o any of the conditions above but this is still a disqualifying factor?
Forgot to edit other half of my post lol.
Originally posted by mike brown
Yes but the question is why does being trans have to be added to the list of disqualifying conditions in and of itself. If the idea is trans people might suffer some of those other conditions then why not just assess them individually to determine that.
Why do things like diabetes disqualify you, I mean it's controllable, are diabetics less lethal when it's controlled, can they not function at some desk job?
It's because there are a host of other concerns that come from that sort of diagnosis, I'm not a transgender specialist which is why I listed the things that can disqualify you. Do folks that go through significant hormone therapy run into any conditions on the list consistently? I'm simply asking the question based on what the military allows from a medical point of view.
Originally posted by snowdragon
Why do things like diabetes disqualify you, I mean it's controllable, are diabetics less lethal when it's controlled, can they not function at some desk job?
Feels like an old-holdout from yesteryear when it was hard to care for a diabetic. In the field, need insulin, you die without it.
But having to run around with a pump that constantly pumps insulin into your body? Not conducive to field operations even a tiny bit.
Also, your rescue and military personnel should be a cut above illnesses that can result in death in less than a day.
If you have type 1 or a severe form or type 2, you have no business being anywhere near military operations.
Also, you can be disqualified for a security clearance because of bad credit. Which is more concerning that a severe diabetic being disqualified from military service.
Originally posted by mike brown
Yes but the question is why does being trans have to be added to the list of disqualifying conditions in and of itself. If the idea is trans people might suffer some of those other conditions then why not just assess them individually to determine that.
Well, training costs.
If we're talking about systemic problems with a sub group, why put them in boot camp if some high percent have to leave?
Originally posted by dadudemon
Feels like an old-holdout from yesteryear when it was hard to care for a diabetic. In the field, need insulin, you die without it.But having to run around with a pump that constantly pumps insulin into your body? Not conducive to field operations even a tiny bit.
Hmm interesting that you focused on the field when I also mentioned desk jobs. I also used diabetes because people are more familiar with it and it specifically is something in the hormonal/endocrine list for disqualification.
Do transgenders suffer from problems related to the list I previously provided regarding medical disqualifications? Does the hormone replacement add additional stresses? What happens if they do not receive their hormones for a period of time in the field?
If transgendered are they required to pass biological sex test for physical requirements or for their new gender?
Just because someone WANTS to serve in the military it doesn't automatically mean they should be able to serve.
Originally posted by mike brown
I understand what you're saying and maybe that was a knee jerk response on my part. But why can't they be assessed as individuals instead of a blanket ban?
Because the ban is not about military readiness, it is about anti-transgender animus. Anything less than a blanket ban on transgender service members will not satisfy the anti-transgender bigotry the ban was designed to appeal to.