Originally posted by The MerchantForce-wise, Vader obviously has a lot more feats to pull from, but I could see an argument for Kylo approaching his level, given some of his feats(even without the Dyad being in effect.)
I have him at least around Vader level.
Saber skill is another matter, though. No clue where to put Kylo in that regard.
Didn't know where else to put this (?), but the Legacy of Vader series has been a bit weird for Kylo...
For example, a running gag seems to be that whenever Kylo first encounters a new Force-user, they use TK to snatch his lightsaber as though he's some talentless feeb.
Happened in issue #2 (against Gardulla's unidentified bodyguard):
Just happened again in issue #6 (against "Grandea", a Jedi survivor of Order 66):
...And of course it happened against Rey in TFA(and sorta/kinda in TLJ) as well.
Yeah in this series Kylo has been very impressive against non force users, way less so against other force users. That Hutt Jedi easily took his lightsaber off his hand while his guard was up and Kylo couldn’t do shit. He is lucky all these guys don’t have killing intent otherwise he’d be dead.
BTW next issue We’re gonna find out how that other Jedi, Grandea, survived Order 66, hope we get something cool… and also I hope it isn’t the last we see of that Hutt Jedi, he is the first of his kind we see in canon (and like the second ever adding Legends, besides Beldorion) and it would be lame if he just died off panel in that orbital bombardment
Btw in this last issue Kylo says “I didn’t think there were any Jedi left, I know Vader killed them all” and Vaneè kinda confirms it “Yes, Lord Vader hunted them all and by the last years of the empire there were only rumors, mostly fake, of Jedi Survivors”.
But this is plain wrong, there are Jedi and Force Users who survived well past the Empire:
Ahsoka Tano
Baylan Skoll
Ezra Bridger
Sabin Wren
Grogu
Nedriss Narr
Mill Alibeth and Vivert Stagg
And I bet my ass the likes of Cal Kestis, Barriss Offee and those Jedi the Path relocated to Tanalor won’t just be killed.
It’s impossible Kylo wasn’t aware of at least 1 or 2 of these Jedi. And this also begs me another question… why didn’t anyone of these Jedi, besides Ahsoka, pop up after the empire fell and actively helped Luke rebuild the order? Baylan I can understand, but what about this Grandea? Or Alibeth and Stagg? Or Cal Kestis btw.. why are they absent, I’m sure Disney won’t have the balls to finish them off by 4 ABY
Ahsoka Tano: We don't know what happened to her between Rebels Season 2 and Return of the Jedi, or how long it took her to get off Malachor. We know she eventually met Luke post-RotJ, but honestly by then, Luke had already completed his training. He probably knew more about being a Jedi than she did (between the sacred Jedi texts and Jocasta Nu's library).
Baylan Skoll: Obviously wouldn't help the son of Skywalker. He had left the Jedi path and appears more interested in personal power.
Ezra Bridger: Was not in the Galaxy during the time of the OT, couldn't help Luke.
Sabin Wren: Wasn't a Jedi during the time of the OT, couldn't help Luke.
Grogu: Was one of the children captured and experimented on by the Empire through Project Harvester, couldn't help Luke.
Nedriss Narr: Literally might not even be canon. Only existed in a now-defunct theme park attraction. We don't even know when that attraction took place on the timeline, due to continuity issues.
Mill Alibeth and Vivert Stagg: I'll lump Gungi in here too. They were younglings at the time of Order 66. Barely had enough training to protect themselves, and were probably actively hiding out from the Empire. By the time Luke rolled around, they'd spent most of their lives NOT being Jedi, so it's very likely they weren't eager to rejoin the Order.
As for Cal Kestis, we see him falling to the dark side in Jedi Survivor. We'll just have to wait and see what happens with him in the next game. But the Path, at least, we know was actively targeted by Vader and the Inquisitors. I seriously doubt many Jedi who were funneled through the Path survived. (Still hoping we see a Vader vs Quinlan story one day).
And of course, a lot of the post-RotJ timeline just hasn't been properly explored yet. Ezra and Sabine might eventually join Luke's Order. Or maybe they'll be dead by the end of the Thrawn storyline. For so much of this, we still just have to wait and see.
Originally posted by Underachiever59
Ahsoka Tano: We don't know what happened to her between Rebels Season 2 and Return of the Jedi, or how long it took her to get off Malachor. We know she eventually met Luke post-RotJ, but honestly by then, Luke had already completed his training. He probably knew more about being a Jedi than she did (between the sacred Jedi texts and Jocasta Nu's library).Baylan Skoll: Obviously wouldn't help the son of Skywalker. He had left the Jedi path and appears more interested in personal power.
Ezra Bridger: Was not in the Galaxy during the time of the OT, couldn't help Luke.
Sabin Wren: Wasn't a Jedi during the time of the OT, couldn't help Luke.
Grogu: Was one of the children captured and experimented on by the Empire through Project Harvester, couldn't help Luke.
Nedriss Narr: Literally might not even be canon. Only existed in a now-defunct theme park attraction. We don't even know when that attraction took place on the timeline, due to continuity issues.
Mill Alibeth and Vivert Stagg: I'll lump Gungi in here too. They were younglings at the time of Order 66. Barely had enough training to protect themselves, and were probably actively hiding out from the Empire. By the time Luke rolled around, they'd spent most of their lives NOT being Jedi, so it's very likely they weren't eager to rejoin the Order.
As for Cal Kestis, we see him falling to the dark side in Jedi Survivor. We'll just have to wait and see what happens with him in the next game. But the Path, at least, we know was actively targeted by Vader and the Inquisitors. I seriously doubt many Jedi who were funneled through the Path survived. (Still hoping we see a Vader vs Quinlan story one day).
And of course, a lot of the post-RotJ timeline just hasn't been properly explored yet. Ezra and Sabine might eventually join Luke's Order. Or maybe they'll be dead by the end of the Thrawn storyline. For so much of this, we still just have to wait and see.
Yeah I do hope we get Vos vs Vader.
Dunno, maybe in the sequel to Jedi Survivor or in the rumored "The Path" series featuring him and Ventress which should air after the new Maul series we may get Vos fight the Empire
I'm more curious why these factions of Jedi survivors didn't come out of hiding after RotJ, and team-up with Luke in some lasting way to help rebuild the Order or somesuch? The Empire was gone(so they were no longer being actively hunted), and the Republic/democracy was being reformed -- seems like the perfect time to step back into the spotlight, imo. Aside from that, any nuggets of information from any former Jedi would have been invaluable to Luke at the time... So logically speaking, either:
a.) All other remaining Jedi were dead by RotJ(which we know is factually untrue.)
b.) Any former Jedi were keeping their abilities suppressed and just living normal lives as to not draw unwanted attention(we've seen this happen several times in canon now.)
c.) The survivors were off training at some NJO-esque academy, in some distant galaxy, and thus could not be sensed(not entirely out of the question, given the events of the Ahsoka series.)
d.) The survivors were simply disillusioned, and wanted nothing to do with potentially reestablishing the Order as it was before(for obvious reasons.)
e.) It'll be retconned to where there actually were Jedi all over the place during the ST, and Palpatine/Snoke/Kylo just couldn't sense them for some inexplicable reason(the least likely option, but still an unfortunate possibility.)
...Or maybe a few of those rolled up in one? srug
Because by the time of TFA, Snoke(and by extension, Palpatine) hadn't sensed an awakening/uprising in the Force for a long time(at least since Luke went into exile.) So it's unlikely that any other 'active duty' Jedi were running around during the ST-era, preforming these grandiose displays of heroism or w/e -- if there had been, they surely would have been sensed beforehand. No, until Rey emerged in the Force, the overt implication from Snoke/Palpatine was: Luke = the last Jedi, period. Therefore, killing Luke = killing the Jedi Order entirely = killing all remaining hope in the galaxy = First/Final Order, ftw!!! So that begs the question: if Luke wasn't actually the last Jedi in the [prime] galaxy by TFA... Where was everyone else hiding? Because not even Palpatine seemed to know of their existence.
mmm
...But perhaps Kylo's upcoming encounter with Grandea will shed some light on that. /shrug
Originally posted by Galan007\
I'm more curious why these factions of Jedi survivors didn't come out of hiding after RotJ, and team-up with Luke in some lasting way to help rebuild the Order or somesuch? The Empire was gone(so they were no longer being actively hunted), and the Republic/democracy was being reformed -- seems like the perfect time to step back into the spotlight, imo. Aside from that, any nuggets of information from any former Jedi would have been invaluable to Luke at the time... So logically speaking, either:
a.) All other remaining Jedi were dead by RotJ(which we know is factually untrue.)
b.) Any former Jedi were keeping their abilities suppressed and just living normal lives as to not draw unwanted attention(we've seen this happen several times in canon now.)
c.) The survivors were off training at some NJO-esque academy, in some distant galaxy, and thus could not be sensed(not entirely out of the question, given the events of the Ahsoka series.)
d.) The survivors were simply disillusioned, and wanted nothing to do with potentially reestablishing the Order as it was before(for obvious reasons.)
e.) It'll be retconned to where there actually were Jedi all over the place during the ST, and Palpatine/Snoke/Kylo just couldn't sense them for some inexplicable reason(the least likely option, but still an unfortunate possibility.)...Or maybe a few of those rolled up in one? srug
Because by the time of TFA, Snoke(and by extension, Palpatine) hadn't sensed an awakening/uprising in the Force for a long time(at least since Luke went into exile.) So it's unlikely that any other 'active duty' Jedi were running around during the ST-era, preforming these grandiose displays of heroism or w/e -- if there had been, they surely would have been sensed beforehand. No, until Rey emerged in the Force, the overt implication from Snoke/Palpatine was: Luke = the last Jedi, period. Therefore, killing Luke = killing the Jedi Order entirely = killing all remaining hope in the galaxy = First/Final Order, ftw!!! So that begs the question: if Luke wasn't actually the last Jedi in the [prime] galaxy by TFA... Where was everyone else hiding? Because not even Palpatine seemed to know of their existence.
mmm...But perhaps Kylo's upcoming encounter with Grandea will shed some light on that. /shrug
Let's do a recap here.
There is zero point speculating about Cal Kestis, since we know he is getting another video game. Odds are, he won't survive through that one, as I believe it's been confirmed this game is supposed to wrap up his story. He almost certainly isn't making it to A New Hope, much less post-RotJ. I'd be happy to be wrong here, would be awesome to have Luke meet Cal. But I just don't think that's in the cards.
Similarly, Ahsoka, Sabine, and Ezra are all in a currently ongoing story. There's no reason to speculate about any of them. We know Ahsoka at least knows about Luke's attempt to rebuild the Jedi, and by extension Sabine probably does as well. There's a very real possibility that we'll see Ezra and Luke meet in the upcoming live action Thrawn stuff.
Grogu has absolutely nothing to teach Luke. In fact, it's the other way around. We saw Luke teaching Grogu. Besides, Grogu officially left the Jedi to join the Mandalorians. The Mandalorians might work alongside Luke and his Jedi in some upcoming stories, but Grogu just is not a Jedi.
For Quinlan Vos, we've gotten breadcrumbs about his survival and connection to the Path. He's a prominent enough Jedi that we'll probably see a resolution to his story at some point. But I just don't see him surviving past the age of the Empire. Odds are he'll face off against some Inquisitors one of these days, ultimately drawing the attention of Darth Vader, and then he'll get crushed. Would be nice to see it play out in an animated series, but it could happen in a comic, in the final Cal Kestis game, or maybe he'll get another novel as a follow-up to Dark Disciple. Regardless, we see no indication of him still being around post-10BBY, so there's no reason to think he lived to the time of Luke's order.
For Grandea, we are literally about to get her story in under a month, so there's zero point speculating.
For Gungi, Mill, and Vivert, they were all younglings at the time the Order fell, with less training than even Cal or Kanan. And when we were first introduced to Cal and Kanan, they'd basically given up being Jedi and were living ordinary lives, with their Jedi abilities having heavily atrophied from just a few years of disuse. Gungi, Mill, and Vivert had even less Jedi training to lose, and many more years of not calling upon those Jedi skills. For all intents and purposes, they are basically just ordinary citizens who happen to know a little about how to use the Force. Mill and Vivert we're told became bounty hunters. Odds are, their Force sensitivity helps them in that profession, and they've known being bounty hunters for many decades longer than they've known what it is to be Jedi. There's just no reason to believe they'd give up successful bounty hunting careers to go rejoin an order that they'd only been a part of for a few years in their early childhoods.
The only real remaining wildcard is Barriss Offee. She seemed to be aging herself quite a bit by using the Force as a healer. Mirialans are supposed to live for centuries, but she appeared to age significantly in just a few years after she left the Inquisitorius. Between her role as a healer and the Inquisitorius likely still actively hunting her for her desertion, I doubt she'd have lived to see the fall of the Empire. But hey, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe she'll meet Ahsoka again in Ahsoka Season 2, or maybe she'll join up with Luke's Jedi Order. Her showing up in relatively recent storytelling leaves me hopeful that they might choose to do more with her in the future. She's the only Jedi aside from Ahsoka, Ezra, and Sabine who I could envision actually maybe helping Luke to rebuild the Order.
That said, basically none of these characters are making it to the time of the Sequels in my opinion. Aside from Mill and Vivert, who we know were still bounty hunters and not Jedi during that time period. Mill and Vivert obviously weren't going to draw the attention of Snoke/Palpatine, since there are countless laypersons throughout the Galaxy who are minorly Force sensitive. They aren't a threat the same way an actively practicing Jedi would be.
As far as I'm concerned, with everything we've been shown, Luke was almost certainly the last openly practicing Jedi left in the galaxy after Ben Solo destroyed his temple and killed his students. Mill and Vivert are bounty hunters, not Jedi. Grogu was a Mandalorian, not a Jedi. And Grandea certainly doesn't seem like she's been out there trying to be a guardian of peace and justice. Ahsoka's Force ghost spoke to Rey in The Rise of Skywalker, and showed up in the comic adaptation of the scene. I seriously doubt any characters like Sabine, Ezra, Barriss, Cal Kestis, or Quinlan Vos were around and actively being Jedi during the time of the Sequel trilogy.
I, on the other hand, think the lack of Prequel Jedi in Luke’s order is just bad planning and it will gradually be retconned over the course of the years. Grandea being a survivor and alive by 34 ABY may be the first step. Anyway, I don’t think Disney has the balls to kill some of these characters. I could see Vos die, or Ahsoka, maybe Barriss, but Sabine or Cal… dunno.
In JS Cal found a hidden planet called Tanalor, it can be reached only if you the coordinates, which are kept in a device called the compass. The whole Path, which includes like of Vos and other Jedi, will relocate there, as the other hideout have been raided by the Empire as of 9BBY. I could see these Jedi rebuild a new order in this remote planet while being completely ignored by the first order. I think Cal will just eventually surface, maybe after the war with the first order, and tell Rey “Oh yeah sorry we were kinda minding our business in that nebula, but we may cooperate”. I think that’s what will happen more or less.
Sabin and Ezra may leave for the other galaxy we found in Ahsoka and be gone for a while
Originally posted by Total WarriorI think this is extremely likely.
Sabin and Ezra may leave for the other galaxy we found in Ahsoka and be gone for a while
Remember, aside from the whole post-RotJ Thrawn fiasco they have to deal with now, there's also Baylan(who has been recast, so we know he'll still be a major player moving forward) currently in the Peridea galaxy, presumably trying to unlock powers/secrets from The Mortis Gods -- so he'll also have to be dealt with at some point as well(which would be a prime opportunity to "relocate" a few Jedi into this adjacent galaxy before the time of the ST.)
On top of that, there's also the Grysk threat in the Unknown Regions that was detailed in the Thrawn novels -- they were still a major threat(moreso than the Empire itself) during the PT/OT-eras, so Disney could easily make a post-RotJ arc detailing "The Grysk War". Would be similar to the Vong invasion from Legends, but I'd take it. Zahn made the Grysk very compelling enemies(to both Jedi and "normal folk" alike.)
Absolutely. The Grysk War is a story that needs a conclusion either way... The path towards a full-scale invasion has already been paved. 👆
Hmm, interesting. Well if Abeloth does appear in S02, then she might be "The Mother", given the obvious connection to The Ones that was drawn in S01. Regardless, the Jedi will have to deal with that at some point... So by the time of the ST, a few(or perhaps several) Jedi could still be in the Peridea galaxy, which would explain their seeming absence in the prime galaxy by TFA... Is what I'm saying. /shrug
Originally posted by Galan007Good point. There clearly USED TO be heavy Jedi activity in Peridea anyway. Maybe some of the ST Jedi will migrate there to continue their training in peace.
Absolutely. The Grysk War is a story that needs a conclusion either way... The path towards a full-scale invasion has already been paved. 👆Hmm, interesting. Well if Abeloth does appear in S02, then she might be "The Mother", given the obvious connection to The Ones that was drawn in S01. Regardless, the Jedi will have to deal with that at some point... So by the time of the ST, a few(or perhaps several) Jedi could still be in the Peridea galaxy, which would explain their seeming absence in the prime galaxy by TFA... Is what I'm saying. /shrug
Like when Luke went to the most unfindable place in the galaxy (Ahch-To). No one knew where he was, even though he was still IN the main galaxy. Just imagine if he would have been in Peridea instead. 😂