Originally posted by SquallXthose people have pretty consistently been wrong. A weaker alternate reality Mark has knocked out Pitt (who has explicitly been shown to be a peer of Savage Hulk). Now that I think about it, in his crossover with Superman, Savage dragon was tossing around the Female Furies and even helped knock out Kalibak. Meanwhile Dragon is consistently shown to be much weaker than Invincible. Invincible also shrugged of punches from Solarman (who according to Larsen, was made to be a peer of Superman).
We are just taking the Supreme and running with it as the standard now?How many times have people say one fight like that is not the norm, but the minority? And since it happens just once, it has to be an outlier?
Originally posted by deathslash
those people have pretty consistently been wrong. A weaker alternate reality Mark has knocked out Pitt (who has explicitly been shown to be a peer of Savage Hulk). Now that I think about it, in his crossover with Superman, Savage dragon was tossing around the Female Furies and even helped knock out Kalibak. Meanwhile Dragon is consistently shown to be much weaker than Invincible. Invincible also shrugged of punches from Solarman (who according to Larsen, was made to be a peer of Superman).
Venom also hanged with Superman in that crossover for a few seconds.
When Batman was body slammed by Diana in Endgame I believe the title was, we don’t say Bruce durability went up, but it was pis scene.
Originally posted by SquallXvenom has also hung with Colossus, the Hulk, Juggernaut, Ghost Rider, and the Thing. There's precedent for his crazy feats and a good reason to back them up.
Venom also hanged with Superman in that crossover for a few seconds.When Batman was body slammed by Diana in Endgame I believe the title was, we don’t say Bruce durability went up, but it was pis scene.
The difference is that when Batman goes back to his solo titles, there's a massive gap in power between that version and his team book versions. One second, he gets destroyed by Bronze Tiger or bane or deathstroke and the next, he's evenly fighting Karate Kid, Zoom, and walking off punched from Darkseid. Bit of a gap in power don't you think?
Originally posted by deathslash
venom has also hung with Colossus, the Hulk, Juggernaut, Ghost Rider, and the Thing. There's precedent for his crazy feats and a good reason to back them up.The difference is that when Batman goes back to his solo titles, there's a massive gap in power between that version and his team book versions. One second, he gets destroyed by Bronze Tiger or bane or deathstroke and the next, he's evenly fighting Karate Kid, Zoom, and walking off punched from Darkseid. Bit of a gap in power don't you think?
The Batman was me going balls to the wall in exaggeration.
I remember a year or so ago in a JL title, the heroes were being attacked by mechanical dogs, Flash was not only unable to beat one, but he was way slower. Then Batman showed up and one punch one the creatures casually.
We don’t take that as Batman’s standard, so we wouldn’t take the Supreme as the Invincible standard as well.
Originally posted by SquallXand why, pray tell would we not take it as their standard? There's a huge difference between a person that's directly stated to only be a peak level human and a character that is directly stated to be the most powerful creature on a planet with numerous superhumans. This is without even bringing up how Kirkman himself directly references it. I've cited multiple instances in which Mark and those that are his peers are shown to be comparable to characters like Superman, Hulk, Supreme, and Gladiator. Without a single bit of rudeness, I'm honestly wondering what your response will be other than 'it doesn't count because I say so'.
The Batman was me going balls to the wall in exaggeration.I remember a year or so ago in a JL title, the heroes were being attacked by mechanical dogs, Flash was not only unable to beat one, but he was way slower. Then Batman showed up and one punch one the creatures casually.
We don’t take that as Batman’s standard, so we wouldn’t take the Supreme as the Invincible standard as well.
Originally posted by deathslash
and why, pray tell would we not take it as their standard? There's a huge difference between a person that's directly stated to only be a peak level human and a character that is directly stated to be the most powerful creature on a planet with numerous superhumans. This is without even bringing up how Kirkman himself directly references it. I've cited multiple instances in which Mark and those that are his peers are shown to be comparable to characters like Superman, Hulk, Supreme, and Gladiator. Without a single bit of rudeness, I'm honestly wondering what your response will be other than 'it doesn't count because I say so'.
Because they don’t have the feats to prove it.
Flash struggling to catch and beating those dogs are pis/cis, and Batman catching and damaging said dogs are pis as well. Why? Because it’s we’ve seen them operated for Flash, at far higher levels. Where as Batman struggles fighting Bane.
Originally posted by SquallXand battle feats aren't feats? We've never seen Kurse bench press 2-3 planets at the same time, but it's never been in doubt that he's like four times stronger than Thor. I can't recall Zod having benchpressed the weight of earth for multiple days, but his fights against Clark have always portrayed him as being a peer. Odd how that works, isn't it?
Because they don’t have the feats to prove it.Flash struggling to catch and beating those dogs are pis/cis, and Batman catching and damaging said dogs are pis as well. Why? Because it’s we’ve seen them operated for Flash, at far higher levels. Where as Batman struggles fighting Bane.
The problem with your example is that we have feats to put Invincible and Thragg in this sort of power bracket. Mark has tanked a nuke to the face, flown multiple times faster than lightspeed, flown through a planet, and shrugged off a planetary explosion.
Originally posted by SquallX
We are just taking the Supreme and running with it as the standard now?How many times have people say one fight like that is not the norm, but the minority? And since it happens just once, it has to be an outlier?
Supreme wasn't anything special anyways. At least Liefeld "Mean Supreme" was not. I read through the entire Image run, and he spent the majority of it depowered and relying on Thor's hammer, losing fights left and right. And had very few actual feats when he had his powers.
Allen Moore's pre crisis Superman ripoff may be a different story. But that isn't who Omni-Man or Gladiator fought.
Originally posted by SquallXIt's a high-end feat for Nolan, but I wouldn't call it an outlier.
We are just taking the Supreme and running with it as the standard now?How many times have people say one fight like that is not the norm, but the minority? And since it happens just once, it has to be an outlier?