Originally posted by Smurph
So, just to be clear, it’s your position that Bats without gloves can’t hurt Slade, but that Bats with gloves can scale his punches from Slade to Superman?
Ehhhh, it's more that Batman can't do enough damage with his bare hands.
And that he was severely pulling his punches with the gloves. If they can hurt Superman, they should be able to splatter Slade.
Smurph, did you read the story?
Batman actually did a lot in the final showdown. He cut into Slades back with a sword, for one. He got him with those blue lasers that Slade kept claiming are meant to hurt Superman.
Priest had Batman use those things for a reason, he isn't the type of writer to do something just because.
Same man gave us Iron Man vs Black Panther, his stories I'd take over a million Snyders or Bendis's or Tom Kings..
Originally posted by cdtmThat doesn’t make sense but it doesn’t matter.
Ehhhh, it's more that Batman can't do enough damage with his bare hands.And that he was severely pulling his punches with the gloves. If they can hurt Superman, they should be able to splatter Slade.
My point is just that evidence that Batman can hurt Slade with power gloves isn’t evidence that Batman needs power gloves to hurt Slade.
Sufficient condition vs necessary condition
Originally posted by Smurph
That doesn’t make sense but it doesn’t matter.My point is just that evidence that Batman can hurt Slade with power gloves isn’t evidence that Batman needs power gloves to hurt Slade.
Sufficient condition vs necessary condition
There's also the fact he failed to do any real damage without the gloves. Issue 30 I believe, V4 Deathstroke.
And like I said, why did Priest have him use the gloves? Because they look cool? This isn't Brian Michael Bends we're taking about, Christopher Priest is one of the masters of the art. He wouldn't have Bruce use a thing, unless he needed a thing.
Originally posted by cdtmThat’s a better version of your argument.
There's also the fact he failed to do any real damage without the gloves. Issue 30 I believe, V4 Deathstroke.And like I said, why did Priest have him use the gloves? Because they look cool? This isn't Brian Michael Bends we're taking about, Christopher Priest is one of the masters of the art. He wouldn't have Bruce use a thing, unless he needed a thing.
Now you have to link it back to whether or not Batman can use pressure points on Luke.
Originally posted by Smurph
Honestly I went back and looked because you said “fair enough”
Yeah, my bad.
Now the thread is derailed and filled with nonsense. And Todd ain't gonna stop, unless we cease feeding him.
And we won't do that, because...
Originally posted by Smurph
😂This is a forum to debate the most pointless shit you can think of, and the forum is dead. The people still here will keep having stupid arguments until they die. It’s a disorder.
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Originally posted by cdtm
There's also the fact he failed to do any real damage without the gloves. Issue 30 I believe, V4 Deathstroke.
How is the chain scene relevant to anything you're trying to say?
Originally posted by Smurph
That’s a better version of your argument.Now you have to link it back to whether or not Batman can use pressure points on Luke.
I didn't forget.
I DID forget Stiltman is the same person who thinks a Flash on the forum is the same Flash who struggles with Captain Boomerang, and Val Armorr is a Z lister against streets. 😛
Basically I suck at picking battles.
Originally posted by Smurph
That’s a better version of your argument.Now you have to link it back to whether or not Batman can use pressure points on Luke.
Originally posted by cdtm
I didn't forget.I DID forget Stiltman is the same person who thinks a Flash on the forum is the same Flash who struggles with Captain Boomerang, and Val Armorr is a Z lister against streets. 😛
Basically I suck at picking battles.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, my bad.Now the thread is derailed and filled with nonsense. And Todd ain't gonna stop, unless we cease feeding him.
And we won't do that, because...
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How is the chain scene relevant to anything you're trying to say?
You don't see how Batman trying like hell to break Slades neck with a chain, and failing to break his neck with a chain, is relevent to a conversation about whether he can do serious damage to Slade unamped?
The entire point is to link whether Batman can hurt Luke with his bare hands. He can't even break Slades neck with a CHAIN, how on earth do you expect him to hurt Cage with his bare hands?
Originally posted by cdtm
You don't see how Batman trying like hell to break Slades neck with a chain, and failing to break his neck with a chain, is relevent to a conversation about whether he can do serious damage to Slade unamped?The entire point is to link whether Batman can hurt Luke with his bare hands. He can't even break Slades neck with a CHAIN, how on earth do you expect him to hurt Cage with his bare hands?
Not only Slade is resisting and fighting back, he also calls Bruce's bluff.
This is what happens when you never read, Todd.
Originally posted by cdtm
Smurph, did you read the story?Batman actually did a lot in the final showdown. He cut into Slades back with a sword, for one. He got him with those blue lasers that Slade kept claiming are meant to hurt Superman.
Priest had Batman use those things for a reason, he isn't the type of writer to do something just because.
Same man gave us Iron Man vs Black Panther, his stories I'd take over a million Snyders or Bendis's or Tom Kings..
Hmmm....Tom king is a good writer actually
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The argument is also all over the place.
That's down to having to "prove" Slade is too durable for Batman to take in straight h2h.
Which he totally IS. Deathstroke regularly took attacks from Cyborg and such since the start of his career.
The Batman fluff on the other hand is a result of years of PIS, in proportion to all the times Batman shows attack and defense in proportion to the street leveled he is.
In other words, in straight hand to hand, Batman hits Slade all day, fails to do any real damage, and beats him down.
Lacking even this very obvious and generally accepted ANYWHERE ELSE frame of reference makes building a coherent narrative impossible.
I guess Christopher Priest had Bruce use power gauntlets designed to fight Superman because they look cool. Priest is known for his bad writing, amiright? He probably reasoned "Pfft, Batman COULD win this in a kick, but lets break out the 'ol justice buster, just because."
I have literally used your "gold standard" of how Bats and Stroke "measure up" against you.
Deathstroke has a low metahuman durability, inferior to the likes of Spider-Man (and Parker tends to get hurt by humans a lot of times, too)... it's the mix of his armor, damage soak and regen that allows him to keep going.... and even that often is not enough.
You'd have a point if he was wearing his Nth metal armor or had the Ikon forcefield protecting him.
Slade has been fighting and getting hurt by human-level streets his whole career --- even in his solo series. You ain't gonna change that now.