Originally posted by tkitna
😆I've double and triple checked and the math checks out right.
Answer = H1 duplicating anything in any movie or film regardless of superhuman strength or normal human abilities is FALSE
H1 has literally no understanding of human biomechanics. He doesn't understand how strength or anything related to athleticism works. He was probably one of those kids that were permanently benched in PE.
Originally posted by h1a8
In Batman's first fight against Bane, he lands multiple haymakers, yet they cause no damage or even a slight stun effect.Honestly, even if Batroc can cause some pause in Bane, Bane's insane damage soak will still allow him to overwhelm and dominate Batroc.
Batman was weak after 8 years of being a shut in and having zero practice.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Batman was weak after 8 years of being a shut in and having zero practice.
This is fiction - the only thing that exists is what the writer wants us to believe.
That said, I can still throw a haymaker just as hard as I did when I practiced martial arts and boxing years ago. If there's any difference, it's negligible.
Originally posted by PsychotronGo ahead, teach me a lesson since you know so much about it.
H1 has literally no understanding of human biomechanics. He doesn't understand how strength or anything related to athleticism works. He was probably one of those kids that were permanently benched in PE.
And while you're at it, explain how anything Batroc did surpasses busting a stone column with fists or punching Batman in his bulletproof cowl and flash koing him.
Originally posted by h1a8
Proof that he's physically weaker in striking? And to what extent?This is fiction - the only thing that exists is what the writer wants us to believe.
That said, I can still throw a haymaker just as hard as I did when I practiced martial arts and boxing years ago. If there's any difference, it's negligible.
Bane himself said: peace has made you weak, directly after catching his fist in his hand
Writer intent from the script showed Bruce as being gaunt and grey haired.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Edit: the quote is 'Peace has cost you your strength, Victory has defeated you' whilst he's holding Batman's fists.
I honestly don't hear him say the first sentence. I watched the clip multiple times, trying my best. I'll assume you’re right since my hearing isn't what it used to be.
But then Batman turned it up a notch, and Bane acknowledged it, saying he fights like a younger man with nothing held back.
I see Batman's punching power in that fight as comparable to an average middleweight professional boxer - nothing superhuman.
The intent is to highlight Bane's physical strength and durability. He flask koes Batman with a single strike to the cowl, lifts him into the air with one hand while casually walking and talking (including Batman’s weight plus his gear). Under the suspension of disbelief, it makes sense that he should absorb punches from mere humans without any damage or stun effect.
Originally posted by h1a8
I honestly don't hear him say the first sentence. I watched the clip multiple times, trying my best. I'll assume you’re right since my hearing isn't what it used to be.But then Batman turned it up a notch, and Bane acknowledged it, saying he fights like a younger man with nothing held back.
I see Batman's punching power in that fight as comparable to an average middleweight professional boxer - nothing superhuman.
The intent is to highlight Bane's physical strength and durability. He flask koes Batman with a single strike to the cowl, lifts him into the air with one hand while casually walking and talking (including Batman’s weight plus his gear). Under the suspension of disbelief, it makes sense that he should absorb punches from mere humans without any damage or stun effect.
with subtitles.
The fighting like a younger man part, is due to him running in and whaling away, no tactics or finesse. Bane even says this is a mistake.
Without any proof, we cannot attribute special attributes if not shown. The first fight with Batman isn't a showcase for Bane's durability, as Batman is weak through years of neglect (which is a central theme in the Dark Knight Rises).
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
YouTube videowith subtitles.
The fighting like a younger man part, is due to him running in and whaling away, no tactics or finesse. Bane even says this is a mistake.
Without any proof, we cannot attribute special attributes if not shown. The first fight with Batman isn't a showcase for Bane's durability, as Batman is weak through years of neglect (which is a central theme in the Dark Knight Rises).
Prime Batman, however, is superhuman, which qualifies as a special attribute. I never argued that Batman in that scene was superhuman.
Batman's punching power in that fight is comparable to an average middleweight professional boxer - that's the baseline, not a special attribute.
And if you don't buy that (which is highly unreasonable) then even a normal professional middleweight boxer retired for 10 years can knock out an average adult male with a single haymaker.
Downplay the feat all you want - it's still a superhuman durability feat - withstanding multiple haymakers from someone of that caliber without any damage or even being stunned.
I haven't trained in martial arts or boxing in over a decade, yet I've knocked someone out cold (that was heavier than me) while working on the job.
Originally posted by h1a8
Prime Batman, however, is superhuman, which qualifies as a special attribute. I never argued that Batman in that scene was superhuman.Batman's punching power in that fight is comparable to an average middleweight professional boxer - that's the baseline, not a special attribute.
And if you don't buy that (which is highly unreasonable) then even a normal professional middleweight boxer retired for 10 years can knock out an average adult male with a single haymaker.
Downplay the feat all you want - it's still a superhuman durability feat - withstanding multiple haymakers from someone of that caliber without any damage or even being stunned.
I haven't trained in martial arts or boxing in over a decade, yet I've knocked someone out cold (that was heavier than me) while working on the job.
I call BS on you being able to KO anyone whilst moving and wearing all that gear, having not trained for a decade, after taking out random mooks and sneaking about. Batman would have been gassed, nowhere near his prime. Of course, being a trianed martial artist, you know the importance of cardio and pacing yourself - which Batman had just gone through multiple rounds by that time.
His haymakers would have been ineffective. As shown. It is not unreasonable for me to say that a gaunt, grey Batman who has not been training/fighting for 8 years, who hadn't even put on the suit (which would be heavy) for 8 years, having just gone through multiple mooks, would be in any shape to deliver 'average middleweight pro boxer' level punches.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I call BS on you being able to KO anyone whilst moving and wearing all that gear, having not trained for a decade, after taking out random mooks and sneaking about. Batman would have been gassed, nowhere near his prime. Of course, being a trianed martial artist, you know the importance of cardio and pacing yourself - which Batman had just gone through multiple rounds by that time.His haymakers would have been ineffective. As shown. It is not unreasonable for me to say that a gaunt, grey Batman who has not been training/fighting for 8 years, who hadn't even put on the suit (which would be heavy) for 8 years, having just gone through multiple mooks, would be in any shape to deliver 'average middleweight pro boxer' level punches.
The suit doesn't significantly reduce the force of a haymaker.
Plus, he lasted a while, threw numerous attacks, and absorbed a lot of punishment. His cardio was clearly above the average adult male, especially while wearing the suit as you mentioned. And cardio or pacing has nothing to do with the first few haymakers.
You'd lose a lot of money betting that if I wore the Batsuit and got a free haymaker on someone, I wouldn't be able to knock them out.
Again, I never quantified the feat. So what exactly are you arguing? I'm saying it's a superhuman durability feat.
I don't know about the catsuit but I have been laden down with armor and weapons before and moving fast or being super agile is just not happening.
I couldn't even imagine trying to fight someone in that thing. You would pass out within minutes lol.
At 27 in the Marines I ran a 17:30 3 mile and maxed out at 28 pull-ups and 184 crunches in 2 minutes.
After 4 years out of no training and trying it again both my pull-ups and crunches got cut in half and I ran like a 28:10
8 years of nothing at that age is simply gonna put your body at a huge disadvantage that would take years to come back from. And at that age you might never be able to get back in that shape.
Originally posted by h1a8
The suit doesn't significantly reduce the force of a haymaker.Plus, he lasted a while, threw numerous attacks, and absorbed a lot of punishment. His cardio was clearly above the average adult male, especially while wearing the suit as you mentioned. And cardio or pacing has nothing to do with the first few haymakers.
You'd lose a lot of money betting that if I wore the Batsuit and got a free haymaker on someone, I wouldn't be able to knock them out.
Again, I never quantified the feat. So what exactly are you arguing? I'm saying it's a superhuman durability feat.
Those haymakers came AFTER he had been trekking through the sewers, taking care of random mooks. You're saying you can do all that, in a Batsuit with weapons etc, and still be able to throw KOing haymakers? Yeah, I call BS.
I'm saying it's NOT a superhuman durability feat. As Batman was way past his prime.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Those haymakers came AFTER he had been trekking through the sewers, taking care of random mooks. You're saying you can do all that, in a Batsuit with weapons etc, and still be able to throw KOing haymakers? Yeah, I call BS.I'm saying it's NOT a superhuman durability feat. As Batman was way past his prime.
1. This is fiction - everything that exists is what the writer chooses to show us. There’s no evidence that Batman was tired before facing Bane.
2. Batman rested longer than a standard boxing round.
3. His haymakers were fully powered, with some even thrown while jumping.
Your theory contradicts how long Batman engaged with Bane. You're now making things up just to avoid losing. This isn't a court of law.
We apply common sense along with the writer's intent. No human can take multiple haymakers from a professional fighter without showing any damage or stun effect. If you disagree, prove otherwise.
Originally posted by h1a8
1. This is fiction - everything that exists is what the writer chooses to show us. There’s no evidence that Batman was tired before facing Bane.2. Batman rested longer than a standard boxing round.
3. His haymakers were fully powered, with some even thrown while jumping.
Your theory contradicts how long Batman engaged with Bane. You're now making things up just to avoid losing. This isn't a court of law.
We apply common sense along with the writer's intent. No human can take multiple haymakers from a professional fighter without showing any damage or stun effect. If you disagree, prove otherwise.
Common sense dictates that noone can - after 8 years of zero practice - wear a fully armoured suit laden with a cape and weaponry, sneak through a sewer, take out random mooks, and then fight at full capacity.
The writer chose to show us that Batman was weaker. Hence the written words in the script, 'Peace has cost you your strength'.
Common sense and writers intent show that tanking Batman's haymakers isn't as impressive as it was when Batman was in his prime.