omega: you need to specify your gender from now on in your signature. that's about the third or fourth time someone has done that. 🙂
hodgie: omega stresses the link between buddha and neo because there IS a strong link between buddha and neo, one that seems to often go overshadowed. not being a big buddha scholar myself, i also tend to focus mainly on the christian parallels.
and i defended her point because her point was right. if you're suggesting that i should ask your permission next time, you're overstepping your limits a bit.
Verity the truth is there are very obvious connections. The biggest on being Smith license plate:
"Agent Smith drives up in an Audi with the license plate "IS 5416". This appears to be yet another Bible reference -- Isaiah Chapter 54, Verse 16 reads as follows: "Behold, I have created the SMITH that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy." (Capitals are for emphasis).
Yeah,yeah,yeah!....I get all that!....I 've read the bible! I t just seems to me that sometimes that's all ppl. relate it to...religion! Religion=limitation and boundaries, to me! Call me crazy...just a personal opinion, and I just feel this movie has many more qualities about it and things to dig out of it than just chapters or quotes, from a man (incorrectly translated, several times) made book! Sorry...just heard the bible references ONE too many times! 😬
well, we're only talking about the movie's religious connection because . . . that's the thread's topic. why would you enter this thread if you didn't wanna see people talk about the bible and the matrix?
and while i grant it's got more connections than just religious, religion is what we're talking about here. and it's clearly there, especially since the w.bros have acknowledged it.
and, IMO, i disagree that religion is limiting.
nick. im not askin you to get my permission. i said that omega could fend for HERSELF. and yes, i agree with you on there is a a very firm connection with buddah. but the thing is.. i really don't know anything about what I'm not interested in. therefore, i do not know much about buddah. All i'm sayin is Neo has a connection with any religious aspect you can throw at him, if indeed you have the evidence to support it.
P.S. I didn't mean to offend anyone.
In Ren II 1 & 2 the machines are paralled to the jewish nation.
At the start of Ren II you see the machine slaves building the cities just like the Hebrew Israelites supposedly built the Egyptian Pyramids.
Plus the location of Zero One was in the heart of current day Israel.
Also the humans live in a place called Zion.
Zi·on:
1. A. The historic land of Israel as a symbol of the Jewish people.
B. The Jewish people; Israel.
2. A place or religious community regarded as sacredly devoted to God.
3. An idealized, harmonious community; utopia.
If their home is called Zion that would make the inhabitants zionist.
Zi·on·ism:
Jewish movement that arose in the late 19th century in response to growing anti-Semitism and sought to reestablish a Jewish homeland in Palestine. Modern Zionism is concerned with the support and development of the state of Israel.
Damn, I forgot this thread. 🙂
Why am I reminded of this conversation.
Neo: “I… just thought you were a guy.”
Trinity: “Most guys do.”
Hey, I have trin as my picture. Not that many guys would use a her, or… ?
Verity> The Matrix movies have a lot MORE than religious interpretations, like “Alice in Wonderland”, references to countless books, myths and legends. My two scents (or ores, as I’m Danish) on Buddhism and Greek mythology, was just to loosen up on the pure Christian interpretations, which I thought were narrow-minded.
“Neo is a Messiah, so…” Without stopping and looking for the countless other interpretations.
Hodgie> What should I fend off? I must’ve missed something somewhere.
Urot> I wouldn’t call the Matrix Zion a utopia. And Zionism is also concerned with the view, that Israelites are Gods’ Chosen, his favoured people, above all else. You don’t see the Matrix Zionites claim to be BETTER than the machines, nor do they believe in God.
Originally posted by The Omega
Urot> I wouldn’t call the Matrix Zion a utopia. And Zionism is also concerned with the view, that Israelites are Gods’ Chosen, his favoured people, above all else. You don’t see the Matrix Zionites claim to be BETTER than the machines, nor do they believe in God.
I agree Omega. I just put of the multiple definitions for the terms.
I tried to leave out my views on Zionism because this in not the place for that type of talk.
Lets just say I dont agree with the Zionist way of thinking, and how they treat people around the world. 😉
[QUOTE]Originally posted by The Omega
[B]
Verity> The Matrix movies have a lot MORE than religious interpretations, like “Alice in Wonderland”, references to countless books, myths and legends. My two scents (or ores, as I’m Danish) on Buddhism and Greek mythology, was just to loosen up on the pure Christian interpretations, which I thought were narrow-minded.
“Neo is a Messiah, so…” Without stopping and looking for the countless other interpretations.
___________________________________________________________
I wasn't criticizing the fact that u were!...on the contrary!!!....I'm glad someone else has input on the movie other than limited Christian points of view...Hope i'm not offending anyone by saying that!....The reason I put it that way is.....sometimes that's all I seem to hear! 😖
Originally posted by The Omega
Verity> No worries. This is the I-net, even if we have a gigazillion smilies, people still can (and do) misunderstand each other. I was just trying to mention some of the OTHER connections in the “I agree with you” way.
You’re not offending me, but hey, I’m an atheist! 😉
😆
Originally posted by The Omega
You’re not offending me, but hey, I’m an atheist!
Smart move. 🙂
A free gift is not a free gift, if it has string and conditions attached.
I find it funny that in the Matrix its all about choice, but in reality we really dont have a fair choice.
According to the bible(but not limiting to that book), its either:
Heaven or Hell
God or the Devil
Salvation or Damnation
Right or wrong
This does not take into account that Real Life is filled with Heavy Shades Of Grey. Things are not so cut and dry.
Thus it seems this is God's way of saying Its my way or the highway. Do what I say, or I will Kill you. Take it or leave it. Theres no other choices in your life.
I feel that this type of doctrine/thinking is flawed, and it paints God with a nasty brush of mistrust and contempt. It seems God is only nice to us when we are doing what he wants. Not taking into account that we do have feelings and desires of our own, and should not be judged for having them.
IMO: Religion is one of the biggest scams on the planet. We have to many Morpheus types walking around trying to tell everyone else how to live their lives based on some out dated or unproven texts. Alot of worldly issues are not covered in these holy books. And without considering that the doctrine may be wrong, hardcore disciples will put forth this info with unquestioning faith. 🙁
They love to make world events fit into their way of thinking. Once that is done they state that is was predicted thousands of years before it happened inorder to give their doctrine credibility.
Isaiah 45:7 "I make peace and create evil. I the Lord do all these things."
Lamentations 3:38 "Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?"
Originally posted by -=Urot=-
Thus it seems this is God's way of saying Its my way or the highway. Do what I say, or I will Kill you. Take it or leave it. Theres no other choices in your life.
i fear that you have a misconception on christian faiths. while it's true that many bible-belters like the baptists take a far too literal adherence to the bible, i am not a baptist and so therefore i don't feel that i could properly defend them. and personally, i disagree with them too.
i don't mean to stray from the original topic, but i think i ought to defend catholicism (my own religion), and religion in general. i tried to do this once to an atheist i knew. it was tough. it reminded me (quite appropriately considering the forum we're in) of morpheus' line -- the one about not being about to tell you what the matrix is; you simply have to see it for yourself. to be happy with catholicism, you really have to get into pretty deep and see what's under there.
but first, back to your misconception: god has never killed anyone for not doing it his way. god would certainly like everyone to follow his will -- but not because it's his will, but because it's just good. loving your neighbor, upholding decent values, making the world a better place -- it's a good life if you can do it. people go to hell because they have a free will. if they don't want to live a good life, they don't have to. but certainly don't blame god.
and as for organized religion in general, it's all good. faith is a very good thing, IMO. as for your comment on "telling us how to live our lives" . . . it's difficult for me to explain. no one's telling you what to do. well, no one should. catholicism presents the way we think it ought to be; again, free will and choice comes into play on whether you take it or leave it. the inquisition came at a time when the church was run by corrupt men. a dark page in our history, but history nonetheless.
"It seems God is only nice to us when we are doing what he wants."
in all reality, urot, that couldn't be farther from the truth. it's all about love. but i don't want to preach to you. if you want answers, i think any book by c.s. lewis is a good place to start. but i especially recommend his book, "the screwtape letters." a good, short read.