Homosexuality: Chosen or Genetic?

Originally posted by sithsaber408
So since it's not necessary for pro-creation(i.e... there are enough straight people) heterosexuality is now not "normal" ?

Humanity has moved sex into being about free-will, expression, love, etc...

Sex is still what it always has been.

( Or as my rather hilarious, and graphically descriptive, grandmother used to put it: 'Every generation thinks they invented the wheel when it comes to sex'😉

Homosexuality has been around for thousands of years. It didn't just now turn into a way that people express sexuality.

So your statement that things may have been that way before, but aren't now doesn't change anything.

People are heterosexual, not by nature, but by NECESSITY of nature.

We would not survive if everybody was a homosexual.

Those who choose homosexuality are no more "normal" now than they would have been in the Dark Ages, when people lived to 30-50, and needed to procreate.

Homosexuality, as I said in my earlier post, is something that comes from enviornment, conditioning, and (in this day and age of Will and Grace, Queer Eye, Brokeback Mountain, watched by 2 gay parents with kids)...grooming.

According to the American Psychological Association, "[Homosexuality] is found in about ten percent of the population, a figure which is surprisingly constant across cultures, irrespective of the different moral values and standards of a particular culture. Contrary to what some imply, the incidence of homosexuality in a population does not appear to change with new moral codes or social mores."

Moreover, homosexuality may not be the sexual orientation of the majority of people, but that does not make it abnormal. If one were to use that type of logic, he would have to consider left handed people to be abnormal also. To a heterosexual person, an intimate relationship with someone of the same sex might seem abnormal or unnatural, but not any more so than heterosexual relations would seem to someone who is gay.

There is nothing abnormal or unnatural about wanting to share your life and love with another person, having the ability to produce offspring is not a prerequisite. If it were, heterosexual couples who did not wish to, or for some reason can not have children would be considered abnormal and unnatural also.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
According to the American Psychological Association, "[Homosexuality] is found in about ten percent of the population, a figure which is surprisingly constant across cultures, irrespective of the different moral values and standards of a particular culture. Contrary to what some imply, the incidence of homosexuality in a population does not appear to change with new moral codes or social mores."

Moreover, homosexuality may not be the sexual orientation of the majority of people, but that does not make it abnormal. If one were to use that type of logic, he would have to consider left handed people to be abnormal also. To a heterosexual person, an intimate relationship with someone of the same sex might seem abnormal or unnatural, but not any more so than heterosexual relations would seem to someone who is gay.

There is nothing abnormal or unnatural about wanting to share your life and love with another person, having the ability to produce offspring is not a prerequisite. If it were, heterosexual couples who did not wish to, or for some reason can not have children would be considered abnormal and unnatural also.

EXCELLENT POST! 🙂

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
And as to habit - Will & Grace, Brokeback mountain, gay parents - once again the majority of gay people out there came from straight parents. A straight world. It seems to me, if that logic worked, that homosexuality is a product of the heterosexual world. And besides, if humanity was foolish enough to base it's sexuality on a movie, well it deserves extinction. Just like those that claim videogames make them think killing is ok.

Indeed. Almost all gay men and lesbians have grown up in a heterosexual world, with little or no exposure to homosexuality. The overwhelming majority of gay men and lesbians were raised by heterosexual parents, educated by heterosexual teachers, and socialized with heterosexual siblings and friends. They were surrounded by heterosexism in magazines, books, movies and on television, yet they grew up to be gay.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
A homosexual invented the computer. If not for him, you would not have the means to express your "enlightened" views. 🙄

And a heterosexual developed the operating system that revolutionized the computer..😉

But the real kicker is..neither of these people would be alive today, if "heterosexual" sex had not been able to produce offspring..🙂

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Someone certainly is full of it. First, human beings are not "designed." Second, whether or not sexual orientation is chosen or genetic has nothing to do with the ability to procreate.

And the award for silliest comment of the year goes to..duh..duh..duh..

Adam Poe!!

Food for thought Adam..

If men only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual relations with men..and women only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual activities with women...guess what? The human race would die out. So one's desire to have sex with the opposite gender..is indeed related to "procreation"...🙄

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Sexual orientation, whether it be heterosexual or homosexual is not something that one chooses. Studies indicate that sexual orientation has a genetic or biological component, and is determined before birth. Like heterosexuals, gays and lesbians discover their sexuality as a process of maturing, they are not recruited, seduced or taught to be homosexual.

Silly assumption based on your own opinion and a few biased studies. There's no conclusive evidence linking "homosexuality" to genetics. You know this.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Many people suffer from all types of abuse and neglect as children, yet grow up to be heterosexual. There is no correlation between any of these occurrences and homosexuality.

Of course there is a correlation. Just because someone has grown up in a neglectful situation..it doesn't automatically mean they're going to grow up gay. Just like if a person grew up with a drug addict..they wouldn't automatically become a druggie. But one can't deny that there is a higher risk of one engaging in such behaviors..if they are exposed to it on a day to day basis. Common sense again bud. Learn it and use it.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
According to the American Psychological Association, no scientific evidence exists to support the effectiveness of any therapies that attempt to convert homosexuals to heterosexuals. The American Psychological Association Executive Director Dr. Raymond Fowler also states that "Groups who try to change the sexual orientation of people... are misguided and run the risk of causing a great deal of psychological harm to those they say they are trying to help."

The American Psychological Association..the same people who supported rebirthing, ritilin, and administering antidepressants to hyperactive kids..at least try to use the opinions of people that someone will give a damn about..😉

Originally posted by whobdamandog
And a heterosexual developed the operating system that revolutionized the computer..😉

But the real kicker is..neither of these people would be alive today, if a "heterosexual" couple had not been able to produce offspring..🙂

Blah blah blah... 🙄

Originally posted by whobdamandog
If men only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual relations with men..and women only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual activities with women...guess what? The human race would die out. So one's desire to have sex with the opposite gender..is indeed related to "procreation"...🙄

If every man and woman had a choice as to whether to be gay or straight, those who choose to be straight would far outweigh those who choose to be gay. There is no danger of the human race dying out, if you think that, you are an idiot. 🙄

Originally posted by whobdamandog
Silly assumption based on your own opinion and a few biased studies. There's no conclusive evidence linking "homosexuality" to genetics. You know this.

This is also so proof that homosexuality is unnatural. If it isn't unnatural, embrace it, and get over it.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
But one can't deny that there is a higher risk of one engaging in such behaviors..if they are exposed to it on a day to day basis. Common sense again bud. Learn it and use it.

Both my parents are straight, as in everyone else in my family. I have exposed to my heterosexual family every single day for the past 22 years. I have been around my straight friends every day, yet I am gay.

If I was exposed to drugs every day, doesn't mean I'd start taking them.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
According to the American Psychological Association, "[Homosexuality] is found in about ten percent of the population, a figure which is surprisingly constant across cultures, irrespective of the different moral values and standards of a particular culture. Contrary to what some imply, the incidence of homosexuality in a population does not appear to change with new moral codes or social mores."

Moreover, homosexuality may not be the sexual orientation of the majority of people, but that does not make it abnormal. If one were to use that type of logic, he would have to consider left handed people to be abnormal also. To a heterosexual person, an intimate relationship with someone of the same sex might seem abnormal or unnatural, but not any more so than heterosexual relations would seem to someone who is gay.

There is nothing abnormal or unnatural about wanting to share your life and love with another person, having the ability to produce offspring is not a prerequisite. If it were, heterosexual couples who did not wish to, or for some reason can not have children would be considered abnormal and unnatural also.

Wow, only 10% of the population is actually gay?

And it isn't a natural thing to do, since sperm is designed(there's that word again) to fertilize an ovarie. Men are meant for copulation with women. Any study of biology or anotomy would tell you that.

Guess you're right.

10% of 3 billion people going agianst their bodies designed function IS normal. 😉

Originally posted by Makedde
I didn't know this! Very interesting. 🙂

It would be difficult to overestimate the importance to the modern world of the mathematical, philosophical, and cryptographic work of Alan Mathison Turing.

Turing's first professional success came with solving a central problem in the philosophy of mathematics. He showed that one could not construct a universal machine, or algorithm, that proved whether any given mathematical statement was itself provable. The problem had been posed in 1900 by a famous German mathematician, David Hilbert.

In the course of solving Hilbert's Entscheidungsproblem, Turing invented what is now known as the Universal Turing Machine. ...What he developed is what we have come to know as "the computer," what you are using to read this post and a machine that can solve any number of general problems given the appropriate programming.

During World War II, Turing was called on to help decode German messages that had been encrypted with a device known as "Enigma." Turing's work with other scientists at Bletchley Park, where British cryptographers worked feverishly to break the top secret codes of the German armed forces, was crucial to the Allied success in the war.

Turing's work at Bletchley Park and the mathematics behind his work on the Universal Turing Machines led him to devise one of the earliest proposals on how to construct a computer. He conceptualized the world's first semi-programmable computer, Colossus, which helped crack the German codes.

You can learn more about Alan Mathison Turing HERE.

Originally posted by Makedde
Blah blah blah... 🙄

Possibly the best rebuttal thus far in this thread..bravo...😉

Originally posted by Makedde
If every man and woman had a choice as to whether to be gay or straight, those who choose to be straight would far outweigh those who choose to be gay.

And you got this statistic from where now..😕

Oh that's right..you made it up..😆 😆

Originally posted by Makedde
This is also so proof that homosexuality is unnatural.

Exactly this is what many have been stating all along. As I stated before to you, take a basic course in human biology..it will definitely confirm your statement above.

Originally posted by Makedde
If I was exposed to drugs every day, doesn't mean I'd start taking them.

You are correct. But the probability of you engaging in such behavior would be much greater than someone who wasn't exposed to that type of environment..if you would like some statistics to support this notion..I can gladly provide them for you..😉

Originally posted by sithsaber408
And it isn't a natural thing to do, since sperm is designed(there's that word again) to fertilize an ovarie. Men are meant for copulation with women. Any study of biology or anotomy would tell you that.

Who the hell has the right to tell a man where he can put his sperm? If sperm is meant to fertilise the egg, masturbation must be abnormal, because the sperm have no egg to fertilise.

Originally posted by Makedde
Who the hell has the right to tell a man where he can put his sperm? If sperm is meant to fertilise the egg, masturbation must be abnormal, because the sperm have no egg to fertilise.

The rectum was meant for excreting waste..that doesn't stop some people from using it for other things..if you know what I mean...😉

Originally posted by Makedde
Who the hell has the right to tell a man where he can put his sperm? If sperm is meant to fertilise the egg, masturbation must be abnormal, because the sperm have no egg to fertilise.

Your "the hell telling" sperm where it was designed to go now?

Dont sidestep the issue with masturbation. It's not a sexual orientation.

Please stay on topic.

Men are designed to copulate with women. This is a fact.... you know it.

You dont have a period every month because your eggs were un-fertilized by a WOMAN.

God made us for certain things.

In our "great intelligence" we sometimes like to PRETEND he was wrong.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
Your "the hell telling" sperm where it was designed to go now?

Dont sidestep the issue with masturbation. It's not a sexual orientation.

Please stay on topic.

Men are designed to copulate with women. This is a fact.... you know it.

You dont have a period every month because your eggs were un-fertilized by a WOMAN.

God made us for certain things.

In our "great intelligence" we sometimes like to [B]PRETEND he was wrong. [/B]

👆

Originally posted by whobdamandog
And a heterosexual developed the operating system that revolutionized the computer..😉

But the real kicker is..neither of these people would be alive today, if "heterosexual" sex had not been able to produce offspring..🙂

Clearly not the point. sithsaber408 asserted that heterosexuals have been exclusively responsible for the advancement of society particularly in the areas of "technology, medicine, intellect, etc." and that by extension, homosexuals owe them some debt of gratitude. This is not the case.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
And the award for silliest comment of the year goes to..duh..duh..duh..

Adam Poe!!

Food for thought Adam..

If men only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual relations with men..and women only engaged in and were attracted to having sexual activities with women...guess what? The human race would die out. So one's desire to have sex with the opposite gender..is indeed related to "procreation"...🙄

The ability or inability to procreate has nothing to do with whether or not sexual orientation is chosen or genetic. Couples who are elderly, infertile, or sterile cannot procreate, but it does not follow from this that their sexual orientation is chosen.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
Silly assumption based on your own opinion and a few biased studies. There's no conclusive evidence linking "homosexuality" to genetics. You know this.

Accept for the University of Illinois at Chicago study in which researchers combed the entire human genome for genetic determinants of sexual orientation and found them on chromosomes 7, 8, and 10 which you selectively ignore every time it is brought up.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
Of course there is a correlation. Just because someone has grown up in a neglectful situation..it doesn't automatically mean they're going to grow up gay. Just like if a person grew up with a drug addict..they wouldn't automatically become a druggie. But one can't deny that there is a higher risk of one engaging in such behaviors..if they are exposed to it on a day to day basis. Common sense again bud. Learn it and use it.

Then how do you explain the fact that nearly all gay men and lesbians have grown up in a heterosexual world, with little or no exposure to homosexuality, were raised by heterosexual parents, educated by heterosexual teachers, socialized with heterosexual siblings and friends, were surrounded by heterosexism in magazines, books, movies and on television, and yet they grew up to be gay?

Furthermore, how do you explain the fact that nearly all children raised by gays and lesbians grow up to be heterosexual?

Common sense, indeed.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
The American Psychological Association..the same people who supported rebirthing, ritilin, and administering antidepressants to hyperactive kids..at least try to use the opinions of people that someone will give a damn about..😉

As opposed to which organizations?

Originally posted by Makedde
Who the hell has the right to tell a man where he can put his sperm? If sperm is meant to fertilise the egg, masturbation must be abnormal, because the sperm have no egg to fertilise.

As would be a sterile man being with a fertile woman. Or a sterile women with a fertile man. Or having sex past menopause. Or after cancer causes a removal of the ovaries/testicles. And celibacy.

And out of interest, talking design and all - the female body has the potential to bear an inordinately large amount of children in a relatively constant manner. One could say it was designed to do that - despite the fact the wear and tear of pregnancy and childbirth - in excess- can reduce the lifespan of the women, increase the likelihood of certain illness and other problems - now, would one say it was her duty then to bear as many children as she possibly can because she was designed to bear many?

And a man can remain fertile upto his late 70's - as he was designed to be fertile at that advanced age should he be still making children?

Originally posted by whobdamandog
And you got this statistic from where now..😕

Oh that's right..you made it up..😆 😆

I would say it's common sense. After all, you are claiming it's choice. If it's choice have a look at the world around us. Where are the massive majorities choosing homosexuality? What, there isn't any? Once again if it WERE choice, which it isn't, it still doesn't matter, as the majority of people aren't choosing it. Once again humanity is not at risk.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
Possibly the best rebuttal thus far in this thread..bravo...😉

As opposed to this brilliant rebuttal:

Originally posted by whobdamandog
Uhh... no.

Bravo, indeed.

Originally posted by whobdamandog
The rectum was meant for excreting waste..that doesn't stop some people from using it for other things..if you know what I mean...😉

It certainly does not stop heterosexuals from using it "for other things." Anal sex is not exclusive to homosexuals; many gay men do not participate in anal sex, and lesbians certainly do not.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
Your "the hell telling" sperm where it was designed to go now?

Dont sidestep the issue with masturbation. It's not a sexual orientation.

Please stay on topic.

Men are designed to copulate with women. This is a fact.... you know it.

You dont have a period every month because your eggs were un-fertilized by a WOMAN.

God made us for certain things.

In our "great intelligence" we sometimes like to [B]PRETEND he was wrong. [/B]

Again, human beings are not "designed." Furthermore, if sex was solely for procreation, human beings would not be sexually viable year round.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
You dont have a period every month because your eggs were un-fertilized by a WOMAN.

😆👆 That was great!

Originally posted by Makedde
Who the hell has the right to tell a man where he can put his sperm?

Anywhere except another dude's ass-hole. 😘

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Clearly not the point. sithsaber408 asserted that heterosexuals have been exclusively responsible for the advancement of society particularly in the areas of "technology, medicine, intellect, etc." and that by extension, homosexuals owe them some debt of gratitude. This is not the case.

Did a heterosexual union..produce offspring that was able to engage in such technological acheivements?

✅

So Sithsaber is correct..heterosexual sexual activities are indeed the driving force behind a society's advancement..😉

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
The ability or inability to procreate has nothing to do with whether or not sexual orientation is chosen or genetic.

The foolishness awards just keep on piling up for you my friend.

The ability to procreate is a "natural" human function. Therefore that would imply that sexual activities which enable procreation..are indeed natural" and "genetically" engrained behaviors.

Do homosexual activities allow for procreation? I don't think so..but you're welcome to believe that they are...

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Accept for the University of Illinois at Chicago study in which researchers combed the entire human genome for genetic determinants of sexual orientation and found them on chromosomes 7, 8, and 10 which you selectively ignore every time it is brought up.

Were these studies conducted on women?
Were they conducted on gay males?
Were they conducted on people who grew up in social environments without fathers and mothers?
Were they conducted on people who grew up in poor communities?
What ages of people were the studies conducted on?

You never really answered these or other related questions..but my general thought is..if studies aren't done across the board..their generally inconclusive..😉

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Then how do you explain the fact that nearly all gay men and lesbians have grown up in a heterosexual world, with little or no exposure to homosexuality, were raised by heterosexual parents, educated by heterosexual teachers, socialized with heterosexual siblings and friends, were surrounded by heterosexism in magazines, books, movies and on television, and yet they grew up to be gay?

Furthermore, how do you explain the fact that nearly all children raised by gays and lesbians grow up to be heterosexual?

Were these statistics conducted on women?
Were they conducted on people who grew up in social environments without fathers and mothers?
Were they conducted on people who grew up in poor communities?
What ages of people were the in the survey?
What races were the people in the survey?

You never really answer these types of questions Adam..but my general thought is..if polls aren't done across the board..on people from all walks of life and all different types of demographics, then they're generally pretty biased..and inconclusive..😉

As opposed to which organizations?

Ones that don't soley support your positions..indeed you do need to obtain more common sense my friend...😉

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
As would be a sterile man being with a fertile woman. Or a sterile women with a fertile man. Or having sex past menopause. Or after cancer causes a removal of the ovaries/testicles. And celibacy.

And out of interest, talking design and all - the female body has the potential to bear an inordinately large amount of children in a relatively constant manner. One could say it was designed to do that - despite the fact the wear and tear of pregnancy and childbirth - in excess- can reduce the lifespan of the women, increase the likelihood of certain illness and other problems - now, would one say it was her duty then to bear as many children as she possibly can because she was designed to bear many?

And a man can remain fertile upto his late 70's - as he was designed to be fertile at that advanced age should he be still making children?

😠 SHUT THE FUKK UP! Atleast they're boning people of the opposite sex, you fukking idiot!

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
I would say it's common sense. After all, you are claiming it's choice. If it's choice have a look at the world around us. Where are the massive majorities choosing homosexuality? What, there isn't any? Once again if it WERE choice, which it isn't, it still doesn't matter, as the majority of people aren't choosing it. Once again humanity is not at risk.

Indeed. The potential rejection by family and friends, the fear of discrimination, the opportunity to experience harassment, and the possibility of being a victim of violence are great reasons someone would choose to be homosexual.