Phoenix vs. Galactus · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

vlaaad12345 Senior Member

Originally posted by Neo Darkhalen
Phoenix won.

Against a very weak galactus...earth based heroes have done that.

Mr Master Junior Member

Phoenix is so overrated by some,

the only thing every fan has to die by is,

"Phoenix amputated/disconnected that Alternate Future Timeline"

"Phoenix destroyed an Alternate Universe in a 'What if' issue"

That's it, that's all Phoenix has done under her own power that's worth mentioning.

And yet,

POST-Retcon Beyonder gave Rachel the FULL power of the embodiment of the Phoenix Force:

(excerpt from the Official Marvel Handbook 2004 - Marvel Girl bio)

"Beyonder once hinted
that Rachel could potentially become equal in power to the previous Phoenix.

Indeed,
the Beyonder granted Rachel the Full power that the previous Phoenix had possessed"

........................................................................................

This is POST-Retcon Beyonder (Cube Being) getting the credit for this.

Heck, Cube Beings aren't even above Aspects of Eternity or even a single Celestial.

On Panel verification:

Beyonder gives Rachel the power:

Rachel becomes the Full embodiment of the Phoenix Force:

........................................................................................

So Eternity >>> Celestials >>> Cube Beings >>> Full Phoenix Force

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Mr Master
This isn't true at all.
Rachel was one with the Phoenix Force, completely merged.
(everything the Phoenix Force was, Rachel was also)
That Rachel beat a Starving Galactus.
Also,
Phoenix (WHR or not) has never disconnected a Reality from the Multiverse.
Phoenix did however, disconnect a Timeline (Future of reality 15104)
from a Universe. (Reality 15104)

"In ONE Future, [B]Phoenix severed the Alternate Future OF Reality - 15104"
Phoenix severed the future ... OF ... Reality 15104 ... NOT of 616.
Reality 15104 is a Future Timeline connected to 616. [/B]

Reality 15104 was a possible future timeline of 616. 🙂

That whole "being one" thing seems like a lot of fancy talk really. For being one in Endsong the Force sure seemed seperate when Jean had to rip it out of Emma and tell it that they were one.

Rachel is stil the phoenix with the lowest showings who was having no problems whatsoever with the hungry galactus. his blasts weren't haveing any sort of effect on her.

Would decreaseing his hunger increase the power of his bolts and increase his durability?

Are you still thinking that it was three shots? The phoenix flare up in attempt to intimidate shouldn't count, and nor should the shot she took at his harvesting machine. So Rachel oneshotted (only one attack was aimed at him) a hungry galactus.

A normal galactus might fair better but you're still facing two factors. Rachel is the weakest, Galactus did abysmally (got one shotted)

So even increaseing his power wouldn't help much and then throw on your using a more powerful phoenix host as well.

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Mr Master
Phoenix is so overrated by some,
the only thing every fan has to die by is,
"Phoenix amputated/disconnected that Alternate Future Timeline"
"Phoenix destroyed an Alternate Universe in a 'What if' issue"
That's it, that's all Phoenix has done under her own power that's worth mentioning.
And yet,
POST-Retcon Beyonder gave Rachel the FULL power of the embodiment of the Phoenix Force:
(excerpt from the Official Marvel Handbook [B]2004 - Marvel Girl bio)
"Beyonder once hinted
that Rachel could potentially become equal in power to the previous Phoenix.
Indeed,
the Beyonder granted Rachel the Full power that the previous Phoenix had possessed"
........................................................................................
This is POST-Retcon Beyonder (Cube Being) getting the credit for this.
Heck, Cube Beings aren't even above Aspects of Eternity or even a single Celestial.
On Panel verification:
Beyonder gives Rachel the power:
Rachel becomes the Full embodiment of the Phoenix Force:

........................................................................................
So Eternity >>> Celestials >>> Cube Beings >>> Full Phoenix Force [/B]

Oh ABC logic... Let me try that.

Captain America beat hulk
Cap>Hulk
Hulk beat Thor
Hulk>Thor
Thor Beat Ego
Thor>Ego
Galactus stalemated Ego
Ego=Galactus
Galactus is more powerful that surfer
Galactus>Surfer
Firelord beat surfer
Surfer<Firelord
Spiderman beat Firelord
Firelord<Spiderman
So we get

Cap>Hulk>Thor>Ego=Galactus>Surfer<Firelord<Spiderman

ISn't ABC logic great? 🙂

Cap>>>Galactus
😄

vlaaad12345 Senior Member

Originally posted by Creshosk
Reality 15104 was a possible future timeline of 616. 🙂
That whole "being one" thing seems like a lot of fancy talk really. For being one in Endsong the Force sure seemed seperate when Jean had to rip it out of Emma and tell it that they were one.
Rachel is stil the phoenix with the lowest showings who was having no problems whatsoever with the hungry galactus. his blasts weren't haveing any sort of effect on her.
Would decreaseing his hunger increase the power of his bolts and increase his durability?
Are you still thinking that it was three shots? The phoenix flare up in attempt to intimidate shouldn't count, and nor should the shot she took at his harvesting machine. So Rachel oneshotted (only one attack was aimed at him) a hungry galactus.
A normal galactus might fair better but you're still facing two factors. Rachel is the weakest, Galactus did abysmally (got one shotted)
So even increaseing his power wouldn't help much and then throw on your using a more powerful phoenix host as well.

A normal galactus wipes 3+ solar systems with his ass he would do much more then a little better.

xjustice69x Senior Member

Originally posted by Creshosk
Oh ABC logic... Let me try that.
Captain America beat hulk
Cap>Hulk
Hulk beat Thor
Hulk>Thor
Thor Beat Ego
Thor>Ego
Galactus stalemated Ego
Ego=Galactus
Galactus is more powerful that surfer
Galactus>Surfer
Firelord beat surfer
Surfer<Firelord
Spiderman beat Firelord
Firelord<Spiderman
So we get
Cap>Hulk>Thor>Ego=Galactus>Surfer<Firelord<Spiderman
ISn't ABC logic great? 🙂
Cap>>>Galactus
😄

sounds about rite to me lol 😱

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Creshosk
Oh ABC logic... Let me try that.
Captain America beat hulk
Cap>Hulk
Hulk beat Thor
Hulk>Thor
Thor Beat Ego
Thor>Ego
Galactus stalemated Ego
Ego=Galactus
Galactus is more powerful that surfer
Galactus>Surfer
Firelord beat surfer
Surfer<Firelord
Spiderman beat Firelord
Firelord<Spiderman
So we get
Cap>Hulk>Thor>Ego=Galactus>Surfer<Firelord<Spiderman
ISn't ABC logic great? 🙂
Cap>>>Galactus
😄

😆

Good one, by the way you made a good point with the phoenix and galactus fight on your previous post.

Estacado Legendary

Originally posted by Mr Master

crylaugh @ that fat watcher.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by Creshosk
Reality 15104 was a possible future timeline of 616.

Right.

But the Future Jean amputated belonged to 15104 ... not 616.

Again,
because of 15104's infancy, (150 years old) it was baby (or tiny) Universe.
Like all Realities in Marvel when young.
They are "Tiny" ... so tiny that Watchers can hold them in their hands too.

Originally posted by Creshosk
That whole "being one" thing seems like a lot of fancy talk really. For being one in Endsong the Force sure seemed seperate when Jean had to rip it out of Emma and tell it that they were one.

As you wish,

but I'll consider what Marvel Comics say
until Marvel comics contradicts what was stated on panel.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Rachel is stil the phoenix with the lowest showings

Where is this stated or depicted?

"Rachel is the weakest" ... "Rachel has the lowest showings"

because according to Marvel, Rachel is the avatar most like Jean.

Originally posted by Creshosk
who was having no problems whatsoever with the hungry galactus. his blasts weren't haveing any sort of effect on her.

I'm not impressed at all by Phoenix defeating a Starving Galactus.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Would decreaseing his hunger increase the power of his bolts and increase his durability?

?

Originally posted by Creshosk
Are you still thinking that it was three shots? The phoenix flare up in attempt to intimidate shouldn't count, and nor should the shot she took at his harvesting machine.

100-three or one, I'm still not impressed by Phoenix defeating a Starving Galactus.

Heck, I seen heroes do that.

Originally posted by Creshosk
So Rachel oneshotted (only one attack was aimed at him) a hungry galactus.

As you wish.

Originally posted by Creshosk
A normal galactus might fair better but you're still facing two factors. Rachel is the weakest, Galactus did abysmally (got one shotted)

I'll wait for you to post the proof that states,

"Rachel is the weakest" (avatar I assume)

I provided evidence to the contrary.

WPOTC may be above Rachel.

Originally posted by Creshosk
So even increaseing his power wouldn't help much and then throw on your using a more powerful phoenix host as well.

Normal Galactus beats every Phoenix except for WPOTC.

Galactus insatiable curbstomps WPOTC.

Sundipped MURDERER

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
A normal galactus wipes 3+ solar systems with his ass he would do much more then a little better.

Not a great feat compared to holding an entire universe in your hands and making amputations to it (baby or not). He may do better but still loses.

vlaaad12345 Senior Member

Originally posted by Sundipped
Not a great feat compared to holding an entire universe in your hands and making amputations to it (baby or not). He may do better but still loses.

So we are using the strongest versions now?then I guess we use the true full powered galactus and he stomps a mudhole in phoenix.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by Mr Master
Phoenix is so overrated by some,
the only thing every fan has to die by is,
"Phoenix amputated/disconnected that Alternate Future Timeline"
"Phoenix destroyed an Alternate Universe in a 'What if' issue"
That's it, that's all Phoenix has done under her own power that's worth mentioning.
And yet,
POST-Retcon Beyonder gave Rachel the FULL power of the embodiment of the Phoenix Force:
(excerpt from the Official Marvel Handbook 2004 - Marvel Girl bio)
"Beyonder once hinted
that Rachel could potentially become equal in power to the previous Phoenix.
Indeed,
the Beyonder granted Rachel the Full power that the previous Phoenix had possessed"
........................................................................................
This is POST-Retcon Beyonder (Cube Being) getting the credit for this.
Heck, Cube Beings aren't even above Aspects of Eternity or even a single Celestial.
On Panel verification:
Beyonder gives Rachel the power:
Rachel becomes the Full embodiment of the Phoenix Force:

........................................................................................

That's without the "abc" whatever.

Bottomline though,

Cube Beings can grant other beings the FULL Power of the Phoenix Force.

And Cube Beings are MANY levels below a single Celestial in power:

Not abc, just Facts. 🙂

Sundipped MURDERER

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
So we are using the strongest versions now?then I guess we use the true full powered galactus and he stomps a mudhole in phoenix.

Nope. Galan gets knocked on his ass again then tries to make Phoenix feel guilt about her power source again. I'll admit it'll take more than a 1 shot this time tho.

spidey-dude Restricted

Originally posted by Creshosk

Cap>>>Galactus
😄

😆

Kutulu Restricted

Originally posted by Sundipped
Nope. Galan gets knocked on his ass again then tries to make Phoenix feel guilt about her power source again. I'll admit it'll take more than a 1 shot this time tho.

Galactus was killing off the Phoenix force in one storyline, but the stars began to grow dim and it would have caused damage to the universe, so he stopped. In that storyline though he was on the verge of killing it.

vlaaad12345 Senior Member

Originally posted by Sundipped
Nope. Galan gets knocked on his ass again then tries to make Phoenix feel guilt about her power source again. I'll admit it'll take more than a 1 shot this time tho.

Right,let me know how that delusional fanboy world of yours works out for you.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by Sundipped
Not a great feat compared to holding an entire universe in your hands and making amputations to it (baby or not).

Phoenix never held an entire Universe in her hands and made amputations to it.

With PREP (Seven pages to be exact)

Jean amputated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104.

Reality 15104 is 150 years old,
how can this be compared to 616 which has been expanding for Billions of years?

Reality 15104 is a possible Future of Reality 616.

Reality 15104's Future, NOT 616's ...
is what Jean amputated and Repaired in the WHR atomically.

Jean never did anything to Reality 15104 which manifested in her hands.

(read X-Men #154)

At the end of the issue (#154) Jean goes back in time,
changes Scott's mind about Emma & the X-Men,
this then Alters the possible Future of 616.

So essentially it was Scott's decision that created and Altered 15104, not Jean.

Jean ONLY manipulated Scott's decision,
but the power to alter that Reality laid in Scott's mind.
.........................................................................................

BTW.

Uatu did the same thing with Reality 311 (the year 1602 of the 616 Universe)

Uatu held it in his hands, and then placed that entire Universe within himself.

That entire Universe of course was a Timeline just like Jean's,
and a "Tiny" one at that, because it was a young Reality just like Jean's 15104.

Sundipped MURDERER

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Right,let me know how that delusional fanboy world of yours works out for you.

Will do. 😛

Creshosk Senior Member

Originally posted by Mr Master
Right.
But the Future Jean amputated belonged to 15104 ... not 616.

Which in turn belonged to 616. 😱

Can't deny that Mr. Master. 😉

Originally posted by Mr Master
Again,
because of 15104's infancy, (150 years old) it was baby (or tiny) Universe.
Like all Realities in Marvel when young.
They are "Tiny" ... so tiny that Watchers can hold them in their hands too.

A baby universe is still a universe.
A kitten is still a cat.
A foal is still a deer
A calf is still a cow.

A toddler is still a human.

Originally posted by Mr Master
As you wish,
but I'll consider what Marvel Comics say
until Marvel comics contradicts what was stated on panel.

or your interpritation of what Marvel comics says rather.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Where is this stated or depicted?
"Rachel is the weakest" ... "Rachel has the lowest showings"

Its true. 🙂

Originally posted by Mr Master
because according to Marvel, Rachel is the avatar most like Jean.

out of the numbers
1, 2, 3, 4, 5

2 is the number most like 1 however 1 is still not 2.

Though technically you could say that Emma or Storm were weaker phoenixes in Endsong and that What if... Rachel is still no Jean.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I'm not impressed at all by Phoenix defeating a Starving Galactus.

And I'm not impressed by galactus being punked out so easily.

Galactus really doesn't seem to be all that.

Originally posted by Mr Master
?

What was hard to understand about that.

Would it increase his durability and the power of his attacks or would it simply increase the amount of energy available to him?

If it doesn't provide any extra durability against attacks or increase his attacking power then a better fed galactus would sitll fair about the same. His blasts having no effect and him feeling as much pain as he did when he was starving.

Originally posted by Mr Master
100-three or one, I'm still not impressed by Phoenix defeating a Starving Galactus.

And I'm not impressed by Galactus in general.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Heck, I seen heroes do that.

Exactly. Galactus, big whoop. Earth based heroes can beat him..

Originally posted by Mr Master
As you wish.
I'll wait for you to post the proof that states,
"Rachel is the weakest" (avatar I assume)
I provided evidence to the contrary.

no2 Not really you haven't. Typical Phoenix speach doesn't cut it when its obviously not true. Otherwise there'd be no disticntion bewteen the phonexii.

Originally posted by Mr Master
WPOTC may be above Rachel.

So if P=J and P=R then J=R since J>R J=/=R therefore P cannot be equal to both R AND J.

Just phoenix initiation speech.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Normal Galactus beats every Phoenix except for WPOTC.

To bad you've got no evidence of that. 🙂

Originally posted by Mr Master
Galactus insatiable curbstomps WPOTC.

Nor of this. Funny how you demand "On panel evidence until you change your mind about things you have no on panel verification for. 🙂

Originally posted by Mr Master
That's without the "abc" whatever.
Bottomline though,
[B]Cube Beings can grant other beings the FULL Power of the Phoenix Force.
And Cube Beings are MANY levels below a single Celestial in power:
Not abc, just Facts. 🙂 [/B]

Trying to justify your ABC logic?

🙂

Sundipped MURDERER

Originally posted by Mr Master
Phoenix never held an entire Universe in her hands and made amputations to it.
With PREP (Seven pages to be exact)
Jean amputated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104.
Reality 15104 is 150 years old,
how can this be compared to 616 which has been expanding for Billions of years?
Reality 15104 is a possible Future of Reality 616.
Reality 15104's Future, NOT 616's ...
is what Jean amputated and Repaired in th WHR atomically.
Jean never did anything to Reality 15104 which manifested in her hands.
(read X-Men #154)
At the ned of the issue (#154) Jean goes back in time,
changes Scotts mind about Emma & the X-Men,
this then Alters the possible Future of 616.
So essentially it was Scott's decision that created and Altered 15104, not Jean.
Jean ONLY manipualted Scott's decision,
but the power to alter that Reality laid in Scott's mind.
.........................................................................................
BTW.
Uatu did the same thing with Reality 311 (the year 1602 of the 616 Universe)
Uatu held it in his hands, and then placed that entire Universe within himself.
That entire Universe of course was a Timeline just like Jean's,
and a "Tiny" one at that, because it was a young Reality just like Jean's 15104.

Still a greater feat like I said.

Forget about timelines and universal aspects. I'm going off of what has happened on panel in combat situations and Phoenix has owned Galan.