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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Would Qui-Gon have joined Dooku?


Would Qui-Gon have joined Dooku?
Started by: Total Warrior

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Total Warrior
Dark Councilor

Registered: Nov 2014
Location: Padova, Italy


 

Would Qui-Gon have joined Dooku?

Dooku sounds sure about that, what do you think?


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Old Post Oct 29th, 2022 09:48 PM
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Darth Thor
Senior Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: Asgard


 

Actually more interested as to why Dooku wanted Qui-Gon on board. He stated about him being a powerful ally. Did Qui-Gon have some untapped potential? And could he have been swerved to the dark side the way Dooku had been ?

Would like more Qui-Gon background as well. How he discovered and began his unfinished Force Ghost training….

Old Post Oct 29th, 2022 10:08 PM
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McP
Senior Member

Registered: Sep 2014
Location: Poland


 

In TOFJ Dooku pointed out that he wont be able to protect Qui-Gon, while latter replied that now Obi-Wan is doing that. I don't think that Dooku considered Qui-Gon as that powerful ally in terms of fighting ability. More like a free thinker, that could help him to change the galaxy. At that point, Dooku probably believed himself, that he wanted peace and order.

If Qui-Gon would be on Yaddle place, I would say no. For sure. In other scenarios - hard to tell. If the Council would still forbid him to train Anakin, he would probably leave and do it on his own. Perhaps then he would turn himself to Dooku for a little bit of support.

Anyway, I'm more interested in how Dooku saw this alliance with Sidious. He knew about Maul, so in wasn't a master and an apprentice relationship form begining. More like an aliance to reach a common goals. At this point they were a partners, Sidious had Maul so Dooku possibly could have his own allies. Qui-Gon and Maul's deaths changed that clearly and pushed it to be different kind of relationship. So the rules were changed as well I guess.

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 07:54 AM
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Total Warrior
Dark Councilor

Registered: Nov 2014
Location: Padova, Italy


 

Yeah Dooku clearly became a Sith apprentice only after Yaddle’s death. Until then, he was an ally of Sidious


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Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 10:06 AM
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Darth Thor
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Location: Asgard


 

^ Yup.


quote: (post)
Originally posted by McP
In TOFJ Dooku pointed out that he wont be able to protect Qui-Gon, while latter replied that now Obi-Wan is doing that. I don't think that Dooku considered Qui-Gon as that powerful ally in terms of fighting ability.



Good point. Sounded like Obi-Wan was already at least on par with Qui-Gon in terms of fighting ability.

Also adds to Obi-Wans loss. As would have felt he failed to protect his Master in the end.

Last edited by Darth Thor on Oct 30th, 2022 at 11:49 AM

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 11:45 AM
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Galan007
|Quantum Observer|

Registered: Jul 2006
Location: Mars, 1985


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Total Warrior
Dooku sounds sure about that, what do you think?
Given what we know about Qui-Gon, I certainly think he would have walked away from the Order at some point(whether it be to train Anakin against the Council's wishes, or from just growing disillusioned with the Order in general.) I don't see him ever turning to the dark side, though.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Total Warrior
Yeah Dooku clearly became a Sith apprentice only after Yaddle's death. Until then, he was an ally of Sidious
TCW S06 established that Dooku was operatively working for Palpatine during the TPM-era, under his Sith name of Tyranus. Filoni also stated in an interview that Dooku and Maul were Palpatine's "padawan learners" at the same time.

Though now it's a little less clear if Dooku was already a fully-anointed Sith at the time of TPM, because yeah, it was heavily implied that killing Yaddle was his final test to earn that spot. So perhaps "Tyranus" was just the alias Dooku used at the time to avoid detection from the Jedi, and he didn't receive the proper "Darth" title/role until after Maul's defeat.

That would actually tidy things up a bit, as it means that Palpatine technically never broke the Rule of Two.


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Last edited by Galan007 on Oct 30th, 2022 at 01:48 PM

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 01:42 PM
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Darth Thor
Senior Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: Asgard


 

Yeah I like that tidying up. Also note even though he was clearly a dark sider at that point, his saber was still blue.

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 03:58 PM
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relentless1
Dark Overlord of KMC

Registered: Aug 2014
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah I like that tidying up. Also note even though he was clearly a dark sider at that point, his saber was still blue.


well yeah, he was still a spy for Sidious either way up til that point; having a red blade before he was actually a Darth wouldn't have been the most subtle 😂

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 05:30 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by relentless1
well yeah, he was still a spy for Sidious either way up til that point; having a red blade before he was actually a Darth wouldn't have been the most subtle 😂



Dont think you can hide that, as the crystal bleeds.

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 05:40 PM
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Underachiever59
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After reading Master & Apprentice, it's abundantly clear that Qui-Gon would have never turned to the dark side. He had his brush with the dark side, and came through it more cemented in his allegiance to the light than ever.

That said, he would absolutely have wound up leaving the Jedi Order. They were failing in their mission to follow the will of the Force, due to the Order's subservience to the Galactic Senate.

Old Post Oct 30th, 2022 05:45 PM
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Galan007
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Registered: Jul 2006
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Dont think you can hide that, as the crystal bleeds.
You have to forcefully make the kyber itself bleed, by dumping all of your hatred and whatnot directly into it. The blade doesn't just turn red on its own through an accumulation of evil deeds or w/e(hence why Anakin's blade remained blue throughout the entirety of RotS.)


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Last edited by Galan007 on Oct 31st, 2022 at 12:27 PM

Old Post Oct 31st, 2022 12:23 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
You have to forcefully make the kyber itself bleed, by dumping all of your hatred and whatnot directly into it. The blade doesn't just turn red on its own through an accumulation of evil deeds or w/e(hence why Anakin's blade remained blue throughout the entirety of RotS.)



Ah right didnt realise it was a forced manoeuvre. Just thought it’s after having embraced the dark side completely. I figured Anakin saber was blue in ROTS due to him only having just turned.

Old Post Oct 31st, 2022 12:33 PM
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Sheev
The All-Sith

Registered: Apr 2018
Location: Exegol


 

Would have been a cool inclusion to have seen Dooku bleed his crystal right after killing Yaddle.

I have always wondered about Inquisitor sabers. They weren't actually Sith, but still had red sabers. Did Sidious give them permission to bleed their crystals, or were they like manufactured that way?


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Old Post Oct 31st, 2022 09:06 PM
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Total Warrior
Dark Councilor

Registered: Nov 2014
Location: Padova, Italy


 

Red crystals can also be artifically manufactured so i guess the latter


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Old Post Oct 31st, 2022 09:49 PM
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Underachiever59
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Total Warrior
Red crystals can also be artifically manufactured so i guess the latter


That was old Legends lore, but in canon you can't manufacture kyber. That was a whole big plot point in the novel Catalyst, where Galen Erso was trying to make artificial kyber as a power source.

As for the Inquisitor sabers, the Ahsoka novel gave us some clues. The Empire began mining Ilum for kyber right after Order 66. Ahsoka traveled to Ilum intent on building a new lightsaber, but the crystals that called to her were actually the ones in the Sixth Brother's lightsaber.

So, from the context of the novel, the Inquisitors didn't have any special bond to their crystals the way Jedi do (with Jedi following the "call" of specific crystals). Instead, they were given crystals that had been harvested by the Empire from Ilum. Now, who bled their crystals is still unanswered. May have been the Inquisitors themselves, but more likely it was done by Palpatine.

Old Post Nov 1st, 2022 02:06 AM
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Darth Thor
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I doubt Palpatine Sat around bleeding crystals for Inquisitors.

Old Post Nov 1st, 2022 06:21 AM
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Underachiever59
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Registered: Oct 2017
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
I doubt Palpatine Sat around bleeding crystals for Inquisitors.


Could be that he bled a large crystal as part of an experiment, then had it broken down for the Inquisitor blades?

Old Post Nov 2nd, 2022 02:30 AM
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Galan007
|Quantum Observer|

Registered: Jul 2006
Location: Mars, 1985


 

^ Like that massive kyber he had on Exegol, for example.


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I am tired of being caught in the tangle of their lives."

Old Post Nov 3rd, 2022 01:11 AM
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Underachiever59
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
^ Like that massive kyber he had on Exegol, for example.


Yeah, my thoughts exactly

Old Post Nov 3rd, 2022 03:23 AM
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Galan007
|Quantum Observer|

Registered: Jul 2006
Location: Mars, 1985


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Underachiever59
Could be that he bled a large crystal as part of an experiment, then had it broken down for the Inquisitor blades?
quote: (post)
Originally posted by Underachiever59
Yeah, my thoughts exactly
Looked into it a bit more, and yeah, it seems like this was indeed the case.

The "Medcenter Fortress" entry in Complete Locations (2016) states: "Massive Sith-imbued kyber crystal, slivers from which will be used in Sith lightsabers":
https://ibb.co/YjJd4gN
That said, it does seem likely that Palpatine may have just cut little pieces from the giant kyber he already had on Coruscant, and used those for the Inquisitors' sabers... Which makes sense. After all, properly bleeding a Jedi's kyber seems like it was very much a Sith-exclusive ritual/rite of passage -- and since the Inquisitors were not Sith, I doubt that Palpatine would have been too keen on allowing a bunch of c-list pretenders to do something like that. /shrug

Moreover, it was reiterated that a true Sith kyber/saber must be taken, not given:
https://ibb.co/hczcYjW
So gifting Inquisitors with their red sabers would have actually been another subtle way to differentiate them from proper Sith.


__________________


"I am tired of Earth. These people.
I am tired of being caught in the tangle of their lives."

Last edited by Galan007 on Nov 4th, 2022 at 04:16 PM

Old Post Nov 4th, 2022 04:05 PM
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