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US Prisons: How do we...
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ArtificialGlory
God-Emperor of Eternity

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Flyattractor
yeah. Its the POLICY that is harmful, not the WANTON DRUG USE!

And you accuse me of living in a DREAM WORLD!

Yes, the policy is indeed a lot more harmful than drug use because it not only fails to reduce drug usage(and might actually increase it), it punishes – instead of helping – people for having an addiction as well as causing a vast array of other societal problems. You should actually watch the video I linked previously and pay close attention.


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 09:15 AM
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Flyattractor
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....THAt is a Load of LEFTY PROPAGANDA BULLSHIT!

Or to put it another way.


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Or just a positive sign that AF is at heart an ungrateful and unhappy person. A true product of a Leftist Education.

How do you live with such hate inside you?


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Last edited by Flyattractor on Nov 27th, 2017 at 09:24 AM

Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 09:21 AM
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ArtificialGlory
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Flyattractor
....THAt is a Load of LEFTY PROPAGANDA BULLSHIT!

Or to put it another way.


(please log in to view the image)

Or just a positive sign that AF is at heart an ungrateful and unhappy person. A true product of a Leftist Education.

How do you live with such hate inside you?

You're not even trying anymore, are you? Me criticizing a harmful and counterproductive policy somehow makes me an ungrateful and hateful person? Alrighty then.


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And from the ashes he rose, like a black cloud. The Sin of one became the Sin of many.

Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 09:28 AM
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Flyattractor
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No. I am not. You keep saying the same thing over and over.
You blame "The System" for the Faults of he People and I am quite frankly bored with jumping on to this Ouroboros. Neither You or I will change our opinions no matter what the other says...in other words...


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 09:35 AM
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ArtificialGlory
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Flyattractor
No. I am not. You keep saying the same thing over and over.
You blame "The System" for the Faults of he People and I am quite frankly bored with jumping on to this Ouroboros. Neither You or I will change our opinions no matter what the other says...in other words...


(please log in to view the image)

So the system cannot possibly be at fault for anything, according to you? Tell me, do you think it's normal to toss a person into jail for smoking dope or having a couple grams of weed on them? Cause that's the system right now.


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 09:43 AM
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ArtificialGlory
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Afro Cheese
Well, when you're dealing with 1.5 billion people, many of whom are in abject poverty, I'm thinking it will get a bit costly to have the kind of robust prison system the United States has. My only point is we're always so quick to point out our own flaws, but I reject the basic idea that China has any sort of edge on us in terms of their criminal justice system. They execute the most people annually and they lock people up for thought crimes. So I guess I'm just saying there can be any number of reasons why China has less prisoners... but it's not because they're less of a police state.

In fact.. they've been busted not only for locking up political prisoners but for extorting slave labor out of them in prison work camps. Prisoners work in some sort of manufacturing environment and make products which are then sold to front companies which sell the goods on the free market as goods that were made by legit paid workers. The name of the Chinese prison camps is the Loagai... which translates in Chinese to an abbreviated form of some phrase that means "reform through labor."

On Norway... I didn't realize they could just extend it like that. Sort of renders the rule useless to me, but I do think that's better than having a real 21 year maximum.


Oh I agree that China doesn't have a better criminal justice system. It's rife with human rights abuses, just like the rest of the country. But if they're locking up people left and right, how come they still have less prisoners? Do they let most of them go arbitrarily? As for executions, I think the US would be leading in that regard too if it was legal in all 50 states.

Yeah, it does seem a little redundant to me as well, but it seems to work for them.


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 11:49 AM
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Emperordmb
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Flyattractor
....THAt is a Load of LEFTY PROPAGANDA BULLSHIT!

Or to put it another way.


(please log in to view the image)

Or just a positive sign that AF is at heart an ungrateful and unhappy person. A true product of a Leftist Education.

How do you live with such hate inside you?

You’ll notice that unlike some of your other convictions, it’s not just the lefties who disagree with you, it’s also a more right-wing classical liberal such as myself, as well as the majority of libertarians, and no other right winger on KMC is jumping to your defense. Even Ben Shapiro, a conservative who dislikes weed, admits that the war on drugs has been an absolute failure in terms of its goal and economically. I mean firstly there is no justification for keeping weed illegal given that it’s much safer than alcohol, and that it’s really not something that should lead to criminal justice, and if you disagree there’s really not much hope for you. Additionally, making psychedelics is also not a smart move because it makes psychedelics significantly less safe for two reasons; 1. They’re unregulated so more harmful research chemicals slip through the cracks and get passed off as safer chemicals, and 2 people tweak the formulas of such drugs and come up with newer chemical formulas to get around the law which leads to drugs even less safe and even more drugs to regulate, it just multiplied the problem.

None of the other righties are backing you on this one because you’re talking complete bullshit here. Government was created to be a use of force and violate people’s rights through taxation and criminal justice in order to protect people’s rights on the whole from each other, and drug use is a crime that violates nobody’s rights and thus shouldn’t warrant the use of force. You screech constantly about left-wing propaganda and left wing fascism, which has some validity given the brainwashing and authoritarian policies some on the left have, however right now you’re defending a rather authoritarian policy on the right that has been lied about through countless pieces of propaganda.


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 01:54 PM
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dadudemon
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
So I am a horrible person because I want to get rid of a harmful policy and refuse to entertain a silly black-and-white worldview? Or because I don’t think that the law should be blindly followed and never challenged?


Your post needs to be corrected.

You're a horrible person because you want to reduce recidivism, property crimes, drug use, violence, rapes, and Justice System costs through fact-based science that is backed by decades of research.

You're a very shitty person. Very shitty.


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 02:14 PM
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Emperordmb
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thumb up


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 02:38 PM
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Raisen
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Emperordmb
You’ll notice that unlike some of your other convictions, it’s not just the lefties who disagree with you, it’s also a more right-wing classical liberal such as myself, as well as the majority of libertarians, and no other right winger on KMC is jumping to your defense. Even Ben Shapiro, a conservative who dislikes weed, admits that the war on drugs has been an absolute failure in terms of its goal and economically. I mean firstly there is no justification for keeping weed illegal given that it’s much safer than alcohol, and that it’s really not something that should lead to criminal justice, and if you disagree there’s really not much hope for you. Additionally, making psychedelics is also not a smart move because it makes psychedelics significantly less safe for two reasons; 1. They’re unregulated so more harmful research chemicals slip through the cracks and get passed off as safer chemicals, and 2 people tweak the formulas of such drugs and come up with newer chemical formulas to get around the law which leads to drugs even less safe and even more drugs to regulate, it just multiplied the problem.

None of the other righties are backing you on this one because you’re talking complete bullshit here. Government was created to be a use of force and violate people’s rights through taxation and criminal justice in order to protect people’s rights on the whole from each other, and drug use is a crime that violates nobody’s rights and thus shouldn’t warrant the use of force. You screech constantly about left-wing propaganda and left wing fascism, which has some validity given the brainwashing and authoritarian policies some on the left have, however right now you’re defending a rather authoritarian policy on the right that has been lied about through countless pieces of propaganda.


thumb up


boom


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 02:44 PM
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Archaeopteryx
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520
^ If you want to legalize drugs, I guess that drops the incarceration rates significantly.

What kind of reformation are talking about here DDM? Therapy, education, etc? I'm for that, but aren't those programs already available?



The problem with modern drug treatment programs is that they are based on antiquated and ineffective 12 step programs. AA, NA, etc need to drop the anonamous part of their programs to allow real study by the scientific community


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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 05:02 PM
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Flyattractor
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Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 08:50 PM
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Afro Cheese
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
Oh I agree that China doesn't have a better criminal justice system. It's rife with human rights abuses, just like the rest of the country. But if they're locking up people left and right, how come they still have less prisoners? Do they let most of them go arbitrarily? As for executions, I think the US would be leading in that regard too if it was legal in all 50 states.

Yeah, it does seem a little redundant to me as well, but it seems to work for them.
Yea like I said I don't know exactly why they have less prisoners, but it clearly isn't because they are squeamish about locking people up. It could just be that they prioritize who to lock up based on political concerns, or it could be that actual crime in China isn't very high. I really don't know. But I would tend not to give them any sort of benefit of the doubt tbh.

Old Post Nov 27th, 2017 10:51 PM
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ArtificialGlory
God-Emperor of Eternity

Gender: Male
Location: Sanctum of Innocence

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Emperordmb
You’ll notice that unlike some of your other convictions, it’s not just the lefties who disagree with you, it’s also a more right-wing classical liberal such as myself, as well as the majority of libertarians, and no other right winger on KMC is jumping to your defense. Even Ben Shapiro, a conservative who dislikes weed, admits that the war on drugs has been an absolute failure in terms of its goal and economically. I mean firstly there is no justification for keeping weed illegal given that it’s much safer than alcohol, and that it’s really not something that should lead to criminal justice, and if you disagree there’s really not much hope for you. Additionally, making psychedelics is also not a smart move because it makes psychedelics significantly less safe for two reasons; 1. They’re unregulated so more harmful research chemicals slip through the cracks and get passed off as safer chemicals, and 2 people tweak the formulas of such drugs and come up with newer chemical formulas to get around the law which leads to drugs even less safe and even more drugs to regulate, it just multiplied the problem.

None of the other righties are backing you on this one because you’re talking complete bullshit here. Government was created to be a use of force and violate people’s rights through taxation and criminal justice in order to protect people’s rights on the whole from each other, and drug use is a crime that violates nobody’s rights and thus shouldn’t warrant the use of force. You screech constantly about left-wing propaganda and left wing fascism, which has some validity given the brainwashing and authoritarian policies some on the left have, however right now you’re defending a rather authoritarian policy on the right that has been lied about through countless pieces of propaganda.

Well said. And this is barely getting into the civil rights abuses and overreach by the government that the War on Drugs causes.


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And from the ashes he rose, like a black cloud. The Sin of one became the Sin of many.

Old Post Nov 29th, 2017 03:23 PM
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