*SPOILERS*ROTK,a very disappointing end to what could have been the best trilogy ever

First on the list: Clockwork you kick sooooo much ass it aint funny, way to counter me.

Originally posted by Clockwork
You clearly say things have to be cut (was a big issue in your first post), where the hell is that not problems with story adaptation ?
I would like you to point what your specific cinematic problems were, if that is what you want to discuss, because, it's not clearly put, and the thread is about 8 pages long and I don't feel like going through it again ...

I think you make a great point here. Cuts would make a difference in Story adaptation, But I wouldnt mind things being cut from the movie because i feel it would of flowed better. I would loved to have seen the Steward/son thing cut and Falfarmir(sp?) and niece of the king of Rohan love story. or how about have both that might have saved the Steward/son conflict for me. Cause than you see why those to get together, both never looked at as = in there elders eyes.

Originally posted by Clockwork
To conclude, the most problems you had are imo disproven, leaves us with

The cutting part

Gollum flashback
btw : this flashback goes even back before 'The Hobbit'
Necessary for the public that didn't read the book
Cinematicly nice to refer to

Spoiler:
when Gollum decides to kill Frodo & Sam (let killed actually)

Can't be put in the first film (inappropiate: Gollum ? in this movie just a side character (when Bilbo finds the Ring and when he gets tortured by Sauron and also he is 'following' the fellowship - offscreen! )
Not really necessary for the second film, he could have put it in the end somewhere, but it has (cinematic) more significance where it is know (imo)
[/B]

I disagree, what if in FOTR or TT we saw that Flash back. I am fan suspense. We would have known from the moment that Golum hooked up with Frodo he wanted to kill him and not only wanted to, knew he could take it to the next step.

Originally posted by Clockwork
Denethor
Been discussed, imo we see too little of the background of Denethor, but to cut Denethor completely, how would you justify that? Go defend Minas Tirith, only with Gandalf who just comes to help to Gondor, with no 'leader' what so ever of Gondor itself ??? => would be cinematicly very incorrect imo ..[/B]

Dont cut him you cant. Cut the conflict with his son, cause there is not enough background in the movies to truly understand the problems there.

Originally posted by Clockwork
Stop the film right after Mount Doom
Been discussed, would make it a Holywood film, and I respect PJ especially because he did not do that..[/B]

For me its all about that fade on the mountain, and i understand and respect why you like it. But for me it just took me out of the movie. I said to my self why did he do that?

About the Hollywood film I also disagree. This is about as Hollywood as you get. Close to a 400 million budget. Two DVD releases on each movie. In fact only Hollywood could make this movie.

Originally posted by Clockwork
Your cinematic problems were wrong imo (and to the rest I think), so that leaves me and them to discuss you about the fact to cut the film in 2.30h you say, 'like the FotR and TT', but if I remember correctly, those two films were 179' and 178' long (=3hrs 😉), again a wrong
observation/statement.[/B]

Well what i was trying to express was that the film could have been cut to what the others were so if the others were cut to 3hrs this one could of been and should of been.

Originally posted by Clockwork
And about the singing : go hire the Extended Edition and see how much people are singing in those versions (btw, those EE are so much better than the theatrical versions) I recommend you to really see them, and I am looking forward to the EE of RotK[/B]

I totally agree on the EE. The EE rock! But I feel you cant have singing if it was not in the theatrical relases. It does not count if it was just in the EE. Thats not fair to those ppl that didnt put out the 30 bones to get the EE's.

I tought the end was GREAT, there is one thing thu, when they all arrive in Minas Tirith after the battle at the black gate, it would have been great if we that exact line that boromir said in Lothlorien about The White Tower, and that one day their paths should lead them there, I think that would have been great

Originally posted by Verity
I don't see how there could be complaints! I thought it was great! What else does everyone want?! 😕

Was that statement aimed toward me because I wasn't really complaining. I was stating the things that made me feel a little bad about the movie. It's just that since this is the end of the trilogy, I thought it would be a "perfect" movie, but there is no such thing. Making a movie just like the book has probably never been done, and may never be. Anyway, I change my rating from 4 out of 5 to 4.5 out of 5.

out of 10, id give it a...................12

better than matrix and other trilogys by far

ahh Jaws and from dusk til dawn are far better, j/k

Originally posted by sauron
better than matrix

no shit! 😛 Lotr is the best, that's all, no need for an explanation.

First off, as some one who read the books and gave the first movie an 8 out of 10 and a 10 out of 10 for the second, the third is a very disappointing 4 out of 10. In fact I was so inspired by the first movie it motivated me to finally finish the last book and a half I had to read.

*rolls on floor laughing my a$$ off* Wow, you're real smart aren't ya? Who the hell cares about your stupid ranking? Oh yeah, I gave FotR a 1 out of 10, and would anyone care?? Nooooooo.

The movie is called the Return of the King: Yet most of the story is about the King of Rohan(sp?) and his niece and the steward of Gondor(sp?) and his son. The story was barely about Aragorn and him coming back to the throne. There needs to be more time spent on him and his struggle to be the king.

We're well aware that the movie is called - The Return of the King, and you're saying that PJ should've focused more on Aragorn!?! You might as well critisize the Tolkien books and came out with no agreement. If PJ did what you wanted to do then it wouldn't be Tolkien's story! It would be like a fanfic and might I add that you should write fanfiction, and maybe you're actually get compliments.

Theoden is an important character to the books and so is Eowyn. Not one thing was specifically centered around in RotK, and I'm sorry if your meaningless thread didn't pay you any good. And might I add that Aragorn was never been crowned king before, so why would he 'come back'?

So what 'struggle' are you speaking of? Aragorn never wanted to be king but his native people needed his aid and so Aragorn faced his fear and became king.

Spoiler:
I though Eownn died in the book?????

oh well...it was a good movie...not the greatest ever...but certainly an end....

Now come on, let's respect peoples opinions.

hey man !!!
movie is movie. book is book. it is totally y diff.
y don't you think ur so lucky to see all the chacrector ujump out of your imagination. i all my life i've never seen any movies which 're adepted from book is toally as same as the book said.even the God FAther. you've to think that we live in such a commercial worlsd, everything dpends on money. if you wantto see everything from the book in the movie just close your eyes and dream. and it's going to take you a few more months to see that in the teather.
i think PJ was right to make it this way. ithink he is one of the best director to make such a huige film huge production anf ofcoz he earned a lot of money too. any way you should think that JRR didn't write LOTR movie script at that time ,he wrote the book. but PJ did.
however why they don't have all the trailer scene in the movie that's all

well everyone critizes and sometimes it's a bit ridiculous... that was almost.

nice points man, im wit u on all ur opinions, but they really had no time to depict all that stuff, n the opening scene was pointless imo, they shoulda showed it in the 2nd one instead, but yea, the book is just 2 friggin' long...

i don't think it was completely pointless, the audience that hadn't read the books didn't understand how gollum/smeagol got the ring. Now they did. I thought it was okay... I could have done without, but they had to start with something... 🙂

The Omega
Clockwork> Yes, I saw that some people flamed very… hrm… harshly. I do not, hence there is no reason for Matrixjohn to take things personal when I write them. And you telling ME to shut up is as polite as… ? How about you organise your replies instead of writing three quite confusing and very long posts?

Clockwork
either you try to (politely) discuss with him to tell him otherwise, or you just shut up!

YOU try to discuss politely so no need for you to 'shut up', didn't make myself quite clear on that, my mistake (it was ment to be a general observation)

And for the confusing posts, I really tried to make it not confusing .. sorry for that ... it was indeed a lot but hey, I'll just say nothing next time ... not 😉

JohnMatrix I disagree, what if in FOTR or TT we saw that Flash back. I am fan suspense. We would have known from the moment that Golum hooked up with Frodo he wanted to kill him and not only wanted to, knew he could take it to the next step.

The link 'Smeagol killing Deagol for the ring'<->'Gollum intention to kill Frodo and Sam' would be lost. That 'suspense' would be gone/not so present in RotK. I think PJ moved the flash back to RotK, because of that, and I think it's cinematic a very good decision.
And Gollum didn't want to kill Frodo from the beginning, only after his socalled betray at the water in TT ('betray' in order of Faramir), actually he decides to kill them in the extended edition, when they leave Osgilliath, also shown in the beginning of RotK

JohnMatrix I totally agree on the EE. The EE rock! But I feel you cant have singing if it was not in the theatrical relases. It does not count if it was just in the EE. Thats not fair to those ppl that didnt put out the 30 bones to get the EE's.

this is a good point, not concerning the singing, but it relates to this:

people who didn't see LotR:TT:EE did not see the flash back with Boromir, Faramir and Denethor, and because of that, the relation between Faramir and Denethor comes out of the blue in RotK.
And maybe it would be better to move the following scenes to the extended edition:
* in depth relation Faramir-Denthor
* Faramir coming back hanging next to his horse
* Faramir and Eowyn together at the end (Aragorn becoming King)

It are very confusing scenes for them who didn't watch LotR:TT:EE or who didn't read the books.

Besides that, everything was PERFECT

if everything from the book was put in!!! good god man, your legs would go numb and youd be lucky if you could remember how too walk, dont get me wrong i love the books, but that film was 3 and a half hours (4 including trailers) so if EVERYTHING was put in, it would go well into 5, maybe 6 hours, now i wouldnt complain, but there was this woman behing me started talking ON HER PHONE 3 hours into the film, got very aggitated and shouted at her, got a round of applause

Julie> No, she didn’t in the books.

Spoiler:
She's taken to the Houses of Healing, where she meets the wounded Faramir, and the two of them fall in love

Clockwork> Ah, no problem then. If confused and having a lot on your mind to discuss, try writing it in Word or Notepad and organise it afterwards.

Sauron> Seeing as ee will be almost 5 hours long, you’re right. Even with a break in the middle of RotK it is a VERY long time to sit in a cinema.

Matrixjohn> I’m waiting.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. BUT... When a single person starts critizising a movie that the audience love and the critics adore, I can't help asking myself if that person isn't just trying to get attention. Especially when the criticism can't be backed up by anything.

lol omega i never had a break at my cinema, didnt mind though 😄😄😄 i saw rotk so my life is complete

Originally posted by sauron
[B i saw rotk so my life is complete [/B]

Waiting to see Silmarillion's movie to complete mine.