So, will Anakin become a Jedi in EIII ??

Started by AnlyYrz4 pages

Nothing like revitalizing a dead thread...

Got a couple comments.

"A young jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights"

and the

"When I left you I was but the learner, now I am the master." (or some such)

These can easily be explained using the rules of the English language and exploring the situations the characters were in when they spoke.

The first quote, as I remember, is of OWK who has sat down Luke and his telling him a sort of BRIEF history. For those that are slow or blind, the keyword is BRIEF. Being concise is a top priority in good writing doctrines.

Now, Obi-Wan could have said, "A young jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine, who then went on to complete the Jedi trials and became a Jedi Knight and turned to evil, helped the empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights."

However, obviously this statement is awkward, especially from a "storyteller" point of view. While it's nice to add details, this one is rather mundane, and doesn't make for a good story nor does it help in the department of being brief and concise(something this sentence was not). So, in the spirit of good literature and story telling, this was left out.

The second quote can be seen in the same light. Darth Vader is about to engage Obi-Wan IN A SWORD FIGHT. I will further add that IT WAS TO THE DEATH.

Darth Vader obviously wanted to impress the fact that at some point Obi-Wan was his teacher. As far as the script goes, I can see that point being made very clear. It's short and easy to understand. Darth Vader could have engaged Obi-Wan in a full-length dissertation of the every step that it took from his Padawanship to his desertion of the Light, but under the circumstances(again, swordfight) it just wasn't necessary.

All these characters, in both instances, were trying to get across was that they were student/teacher. While if we take the text literally we come up with a contradiction, this contradiction can be overlooked by understanding what these characters were trying to get across. All these characters were trying to do was enlighten the audience as to a student/teacher bond they shared. They did so in short, concise sentences. People do this sort of paraphrasing all the time. As an example I will explain the start of my day... I woke up this morning, hopped into the shower, and then went to work. If you were to critically, and literally, analyze this statement, you will notice that I woke up, hopped into the shower(apparantly still wearing my PJ's as I did not mention taking those off), and then went to work(either in wet pajamas or naked, depending on whether or not you caught the fact that I didn't mention my undressing). However, you probably INFERRED that I had undressed before showering, and that I put work clothes on after that shower. People paraphrase all the time, it's part of daily life. Neither Obi-Wan or Darth Vader had to go to elaborate lengths to completely factualize their past. They simply spoke naturally, trying to convey a complicated message as concisely as possible. One of the beautiful things about the human mind is that it can interpret abstract thoughts and come to conclusions based on inferences. One should not need every single step, instance, or fact in any given pattern in order to come into understanding of that pattern. Leave the cold, hard logic to calculators and binary automatons. Learn to love the English language and the art of conciseness.

There's something else going on there. OB1 is clearly embarrased about the whole situation. And in ANH he suddenly has the son of his former student sitting there, wanting to know what happened to his father. No one wants to talk about it, and now OB1 (feeling guilty party no. 1) has to talk about his own failure. Plus he's trying to protect Luke in trying to channel his feelings, to prevent him from rushing to his daddy should he feel the urge. From OB1's POV there's a lot at stake so he chooses his words carefully, trying not to lie but also to not reveal too much and to hide his own blame.

As for Vader, he's just hateful towards OB1 and doesn't mind making him look bad. So all he's concerned about is making OB1 look bad, both during his fight with OB1, as well as in the one with Luke.

anakin in ep3 in my opinion reaches the rank of jedi knight still making him a LEARNER in order to reach the rank of jedi master....which is the rank obi kenobi has reached in ep3 to match mace windu yoda etc...i think it follows PADAWAN-JEDI KNIGHT-JEDI MASTER-JEDI GHOST of course i colud be wrong

The view I agree most with was already mentioned earlier in thread(and since I know corn is enjoying the merry-go-round anyway 😛 ) Anyway, my take on that phrase by Vader is that when last they met, Vader was still a learner in the sense that he couldn't beat Obi-Wan even in all of his rage, and Obi-Wan being an ever growing master himself still knew more than Anakin did. There might be some details in the movie that tip the fight either way, but however it happens we know Obi-Wan prevails in Episode III. And from the time Vader and Obi-Wan last met, Vader must've grown much, and learned under the emperor so the match in ANH would have a different outcome than the one before. I'm thinking too that Ben knew in advance that he would have to die, and the way he chooses to go seems to indicate Ben knew well what he was doing...

Vader seems to know the same thing Ben does. He does say "Escape is not his plan"; Vader must have been itching for a rematch.

if you keep it strictly on topic... this should be closed since Pablo already gave the answer: yes, he will be and he'll nag that he won't be a master yet

if you go on about what OB1 and Vader says in ANH:
he is still a learner, since he at the time of the duel was a knight and not a master. A master should know everything (or at least almost everything) what there is to know for his profession, a knight knows the basics and some details; no?

Anakin will be a Jedi Knight in Ep.3 and not a learner, but in the end, Obi-Wan defeats Anakin. That is why Anakin felt lesser than Obi-Wan, prior to their meeting on the Death Star. Simple as that.

It is also possible that although Anakin passes the Jedi trials, perhaps Obi-Wan says to the council that Anakin is not yet ready to be separated from him. This could be the ultimate "holding-back" of Anakin.

looks like JP's last word has been squashed 😄

Okay, time to make a surrogate last word.

JP: "Last Word!!!"

So will Anakin be a Jedi when the movie begins or during EpIII?

Yep no padawan briad just the revenge of the mullet 😮‍💨

yes anakin will be a jedi when ep3 starts and he will prove it by cutting off count dooku head and arms he probibley will be strong in the force.

I've read that tim but will that make the cut though so to speak??? (word joke) I mean its a bit gory for the wee ankle biters to see and he doesnt have a helmet on like jango???!!! 😮‍💨 dooku's head> 🤣

Originally posted by darktim1
yes anakin will be a jedi when ep3 starts and he will prove it by cutting off count dooku head and arms he probibley will be strong in the force.

And how do you know?

SUPERSHADOW!!! 😆 😆 😆 😮‍💨

I take it would be easier to make him Knight already in the yellow scroll then to use a scene on it

Yeah he made jedi knight status in the clone wars 😮‍💨

if that's what the scroll says

maybe??? 😮

Originally posted by smoker4
SUPERSHADOW!!! 😆 😆 😆 😮‍💨

Can't argue with that.