Originally posted by BackFire
I doubt his actions caused that much trouble. Tell me, what exactly are you reffering too?
Originally posted by bardock
actual a 150 veterans testified to war crimes that is the qoute you are misrepresinting.please watch or read the testamony before commenting.go watch fox news and dream about how you would make love to rush limbaugh like you were gonna do and let the politically educated people talk ok.
😬 i don't watch Rush Limbaugh dude so stop assuming stupidity.... 😬 and trying to insult my intelligence.... 😬 ... we are talking about Mr Kerry not what another 150 protestors did..... that would only show further how impressionable he is..... 😬
"When Kerry returned from Vietnam he joined the anti-war protestors... but he didn't just protest he took to diplomatic means to make the army look like monsters... he confined before conrgress stating that are troops were slaughtering people and villages from his own recollections even though this was far from the truth and he new it."
You're wrong, many many soldiers will vouche that lots of American soldiers were killing innocent people. This happened, alot. It is fact. My father saw it happen, as did his brother and MANY other people who were in the war. The American soldiers were very poor during this war, they were cold, cruel and hateful towards all vietnamese people. Kerry is not the only person to make these types of claims. Oliver Stone made a whole movie about the horrors of the Vietnam war that was caused by our soldiers (many of which were monsterous) AND the horrors they faced. It's called Platoon, maybe you've heard of it.
"Anyway after his convining he took it upon himself to meet in France with North Vietnamese and Chinise diplomats... OUR enemies to "TRY AND NEGOTIATE" (which by the way is considered treason for speaking to a forgien power on belaf of a nation without its constent ) which summed up to appeasing to our enemies making them believe we were weak and buying them time to further thier hand in negotiations with our ACTAUL envoys to end the war, therefore prolonging the conflict indirectly"
Hmmm...this one's tricky, obviously he made a mistake, one I'm sure he's regretful for now. But it is nice that he at least attempted to negotiate so less people woulc have to die in a war that, in all honesty, America didn't belong in. His heart was in the right place, but in his young age, he just didn't think it through. I wouldn't say this is an action of "a coward" or "a weakling". I'm sure it took a lot of courage to go over there and stand face to face with the head of two countries that were recognized as enemies of Kerry's, and try to talk them out of war and what not.
Again, sounds like he just made a mistake when he was young, lots of people did after the Vietnam war.
Originally posted by BackFire
"When Kerry returned from Vietnam he joined the anti-war protestors... but he didn't just protest he took to diplomatic means to make the army look like monsters... he confined before conrgress stating that are troops were slaughtering people and villages from his own recollections even though this was far from the truth and he new it."You're wrong, many many soldiers will vouche that lots of American soldiers were killing innocent people. This happened, alot. It is fact. My father saw it happen, as did his brother and MANY other people who were in the war. The American soldiers were very poor during this war, they were cold, cruel and hateful towards all vietnamese people. Kerry is not the only person to make these types of claims. Oliver Stone made a whole movie about the horrors of the Vietnam war that was caused by our soldiers (many of which were monsterous) AND the horrors they faced. It's called Platoon, maybe you've heard of it.
"Anyway after his convining he took it upon himself to meet in France with North Vietnamese and Chinise diplomats... OUR enemies to "TRY AND NEGOTIATE" (which by the way is considered treason for speaking to a forgien power on belaf of a nation without its constent ) which summed up to appeasing to our enemies making them believe we were weak and buying them time to further thier hand in negotiations with our ACTAUL envoys to end the war, therefore prolonging the conflict indirectly"
Hmmm...this one's tricky, obviously he made a mistake, one I'm sure he's regretful for now. But it is nice that he at least attempted to negotiate so less people woulc have to die in a war that, in all honesty, America didn't belong in. His heart was in the right place, but in his young age, he just didn't think it through. I wouldn't say this is an action of "a coward" or "a weakling". I'm sure it took a lot of courage to go over there and stand face to face with the head of two countries that were recognized as enemies of Kerry's, and try to talk them out of war and what not.
Again, sounds like he just made a mistake when he was young, lots of people did after the Vietnam war.
Oliver Stone made his movie based on some stories overall our forces acted honorably but as in all places there were extremes... 😬 The protestors and media of that war concentrated only on the bad parts and never on the atrocities of our enemies.. most of the towns we razed were enemy strongholds... 😬 of course this is not about the conflict it self but about a persons actions..... 😬 Kerry was not anywhere near those things... he was there for four months on a patrol boat... not marching threw the jungle razing towns....
It did not take guts to surrender over others and his actions were foolish and self-promoting 😬 he new that his company did not slaughter people and he new that POWs were being held and being traded so that an insidious enemy can encroach on yet another free people 😬 Bolting and running is not a way to handle a situation... he knew that there was no negotiations and he new the only way to end the war was to basically humiliate the US into submission and withdraw.... thats what he gave the enemy and I don't think that was something that a person cannot think threw and act rashly on... I do not trust him and thats that... and all i know is what i know about him.... 😬 i listen to no one when i make my decision while looking at the facts at hand.
Originally posted by bardock
i was just have a little fun there.but he was using a qoute from other veterans testamony.
😬 then why did that Veteran not speak? There were 2 million plus troops in Veitnam... if the atrocities that occured happened in that volume... i think there would be far more witnesses then 150.... 😬
no they werent.you said you form your views do to the facts at hand do research look behind the bias.go to www.factcheck.org
"Oliver Stone made his movie based on some stories overall our forces acted honorably but as in all places there were extremes... The protestors and media of that war concentrated only on the bad parts and never on the atrocities of our enemies.. most of the towns we razed were enemy strongholds... of course this is not about the conflict it self but about a persons actions..... Kerry was not anywhere near those things... he was there for four months on a patrol boat... not marching threw the jungle razing towns...."
Again, wrong. Oliver Stone based his film on his own experiences. Everything that happened in that film happened to him during the war. From Razing a town full of innocent people that had no choice but to harbor The VC troops out of threats of death. Too the attempted rape of a young vietnamese girl. These all happened, and they were not "spread out", most Vietnamese soldiers will tell you that this happened on a nearly regular basis. The war was simply poorly executed, and it occured during a time when people were confused and changing ideals, so many of the soldiers who were there through the draft did not want to be there. So they took their anger out on anything they could. More often then not, that "anything" was not the enemy.
"It did not take guts to surrender over others and his actions were foolish and self-promoting he new that his company did not slaughter people and he new that POWs were being held and being traded so that an insidious enemy can encroach on yet another free people Bolting and running is not a way to handle a situation... he knew that there was no negotiations and he new the only way to end the war was to basically humiliate the US into submission and withdraw.... thats what he gave the enemy and I don't think that was something that a person cannot think threw and act rashly on... I do not trust him and thats that... and all i know is what i know about him.... i listen to no one when i make my decision while looking at the facts at hand."
Again, how do you know his company did nothing wrong? It's your word against his, and he was there, thus, he has credibility in actually KNOWING what happened, where you are speculating. Also, what do POW's have to do with anything? The POW's would have been there whether Kerry went to negotiate or not. Again, I don't see the connection. How was he to know there were no negotiations? At least he tried, I really doubt he went over there with any intention other then ending the war and stopping needless deaths. I really don't think he's as bad as people make him out to be. So he was against teh war, who cares? You're making it sound like he's soley responsible for America loosing the war, that of course is idiotic. He simply did what he thought would help, trying to end the war in a peaceful way. Damn him for trying, though, right?
On a side note, before all the morons come in and scream "OMGZ KERRY SUCKS YOU LIBERAL N00B!!! LOLZZ!!11" I am not a Kerry advocator, nor do I think he would make a good president. I am not voting for either Bush or Kerry because they are both poor candidates. I'm simply defending a man who is demonized far more then he should be.
if you want to believe a movie about Vietnam go ahead... i have read enough history and have seen enough documentries to say there was atrocities but they were not rampant as they are made out to be... during the Cambodian campaign soldiers were ordered to return stolen goods and complied by direct order from the generals.... that was the kind of thing that was occuring.
Originally posted by bardock
no they werent.you said you form your views do to the facts at hand do research look behind the bias.go to www.factcheck.org
That was the biggest pot of liberal biased i have ever seen 😑
Originally posted by RaventheOnly
if you want to believe a movie about Vietnam go ahead... i have read enough history and have seen enough documentries to say there was atrocities but they were not rampant as they are made out to be... during the Cambodian campaign soldiers were ordered to return stolen goods and complied by direct order from the generals.... that was the kind of thing that was occuring.
Actually, I'm believing eye witness accounts from my Father and my Uncle, both of who were there, and both of whom saw many of the things being discussed happen. They were there, you were not, they have credibility, you do not. End of the story.
Originally posted by BackFire
Actually, I'm believing eye witness accounts from my Father and my Uncle, both of who were there, and both of whom saw many of the things being discussed happen. They were there, you were not, they have credibility, you do not. End of the story.
😬 they were two people of two million+ they may have seen things but there are plenty others who said otherwise also... 😬 I respect and do not doubt what they saw but our troops were not the true monsters in that fight 😬