The Bible

peel me a grape - someone 🙁

Thats why he gave free will, to give people the choice to believe in him or not.

You may ask why waste his time creating people who will not beilieve in him, because he has to 😛 if he forced everyone to believe and do what he wanted, he would be a dictator god. Bush would then have to liberate heaven...and a whole lot of problems would arise.

So blame bush for the contradiction in the bible 😊

He quotes a hehe. He wouldn't randomly say hehe. He's normally an honest laugher

I think non-belleivers should read it. and that it is their choice to read or not to read it.

he would be a dictator god

I SAID I THINK THEY SHOULD READ IT.

BUT I CANT MAKE THEM, IT IS THEIR CHOICE.

why should they read it?

Myself, I don't like being threatened into doing things....

Is this really different from the Fact or Fiction thread?

lol ... its not threatening you to do things man.... 😂 People obey the laws because they are grateful for their salvation and want to show their God that they are grateful

Darth Sauron> But God decided to harden the Pharaohs heart so he would not let the Israelis go free. That's MESSING with free will...

"Believe in me or perish." Free will???

And how about the time before colonisation, when countless societies had never HEARD about the Christian God. What kind of free will did they have?

Originally posted by yerssot
you missed the part where I wrote:

"where is it written"

I did not ask for your opinion,... and the bible doesn't count as source since the book is (in this subject) under debate for having contradictions

Sorry... How do you define a God on stuff other than the collected works that define him? It's like saying that you cannot use the Iliad to understand Odysseus because people don't think that Troy existed. Where is it written...

God is Omniscient because he is beyond size, and can thus create a universe.

Here.

Ytaker> EXACTLY. Where do you DEFINE God outside of the written texts? Your personal opinion does not constitute any proof of anything.
As Yerssot asks:
where is it written he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he still would go through with it if he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he knew men would redeem itself?
where is it written he had to grieve if he knew they would redeem?

Originally posted by The Omega
Darth Sauron> But God decided to harden the Pharaohs heart so he would not let the Israelis go free. That's MESSING with free will...

"Believe in me or perish." Free will???

And how about the time before colonisation, when countless societies had never HEARD about the Christian God. What kind of free will did they have?

Or it's doing something the Pharoh doesn't like.

Ask to go to heaven, or go to hell. Free will? Ask a woman to marry you, or be a bachelor. Free will?

Not countless. Just a couple million. Jesus hit at the time of maximum impact, and may have more than if he appeared in a different time. You’ve got to try and do as much good as possible, and if he released at a different time, he might not be as effective.

Originally posted by The Omega
Ytaker> EXACTLY. Where do you DEFINE God outside of the written texts? Your personal opinion does not constitute any proof of anything.
As Yerssot asks:
where is it written he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he still would go through with it if he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he knew men would redeem itself?
where is it written he had to grieve if he knew they would redeem?

Where exactly do I define him outside every bit of infomation that people have gathered about him?I don't. That would be stupid. You cannot define any historical figure except by what people have written about them. You could look to logic though. A being that can do anything, including create a universe, can also look at anything, as that is part of that range of power.

If you broke a lamp, would you still be a bit miffed even if you could get a new one out of a shop? Would you be a bit miffed if you had to bin an old lamp that you loved to make a space for a new one?

Originally posted by Darth Sauron
Thats why he gave free will,

Do we really have free will. If a guy is falling out of an airplane, does he have the free will to safely levitate himself to the ground?
If a guy gets shot in the head, does he have the free will to stay concious.

Do i have the free will to become super rich in the next few seconds?
NO

I cant stand the circular argument that some religious believers use.
THe one that goes something like "the bible must be the word of god, because it says so in the bible".

Originally posted by Ytaker
Where exactly do I define him outside every bit of infomation that people have gathered about him?I don't. That would be stupid. You cannot define any historical figure except by what people have written about them. You could look to logic though. A being that can do anything, including create a universe, can also look at anything, as that is part of that range of power.

If you broke a lamp, would you still be a bit miffed even if you could get a new one out of a shop? Would you be a bit miffed if you had to bin an old lamp that you loved to make a space for a new one?

Answer it without any hassle, please

Originally posted by eleveninches
Do we really have free will. If a guy is falling out of an airplane, does he have the free will to safely levitate himself to the ground?
If a guy gets shot in the head, does he have the free will to stay concious.

Do i have the free will to become super rich in the next few seconds?
NO

That isn't a human ability. I can run, but I cannot outrun a cheetah. There are limits to freewill. Your freewill is rather dependant on your body. You cannot overpower the nature of matter. Or to put it more accuately, your freewill is limited due to the limits of you.

You have a finite body, and thus have a finite freewill.

yeah sorry eleven inches but that was a kinda stupid post
DONT GET ME WRONG, i agree with the fact that most of the bible's fiction but am just quoting that post
plus everybody go easy on me i have a cold cry

Originally posted by yerssot
spare me and probably TO your own little stories. I asked a question and you constantly ducked it.

Answer it without any hassle, please

Here's a truncated version of what I said

1. No.

2. I could state the impossibility of the universe, e.g. the big bang being so fine tuned.

3. The argument "there are infinite universe" doesn't work, as you cannot use it unless you can find those universes. If I won the lottery twenty times in a row, the odds would be too high against to accept that it just happened.

4. I could also use Descartes argument of perfection. Anyone can conceive of a circle, lines of equal length draw around a point, just as anyone can conceive of a perfect God, all powerful, all benevolent, all knowing, omnipresent, and every perfect idea has a perfect cause.

5. No, not to you.

6. I weighed the evidence, and found it pointing to God, but I cannot remember it all without truth drugs and several weeks of interrogation.

no, you're just being ignorant about the post.

Have I asked you about your ideas of the universe? NO
Have I asked you if you knew Descartes? NO

What did I ask?

THIS:

where is it written he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he still would go through with it if he knew it would happen?
where is it written that he knew men would redeem itself?
where is it written he had to grieve if he knew they would redeem?

all about the subject of God's grieve and the fall of men.