Originally posted by Kento
Gokou states Buu was toying with him. So yea...He'd really be able to win at full power. How many people in DBZ have said they could win but weren't able. Vegeta against Freeza, Cell against Gohan, Buu against Vegetto....What they think and what is real are two different things. Buu's over there mocking them so yea he's really trying his hardest to kill Gokou. Then Vegeta letting Cell become Perfect, Recoome against Gokou, Burta and Jeice against Gokou. Because it's said doesn't make it true when one is not even trying. If Buu was serious then maybe I'd believe it but he isn't being serious at all.
But Goku also was having fun, he miscalculate that being alive his power up at SSJ 3 consume more energy and run out, meaning if he power up from the beggining to hi maximun, he didn´t need the Genkidama to defeat Buu.
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
I have sumthin to say about one of the most most controversial parts of DBZ, Cell's final Kamehameha. People say "If he could blow up a planet, the explosion would be bigger", but that is false. Cell never said he was going to bust the solar system, he said he had gathered enough energy in his Kamehameha to do so. That means he may of gathered the power to do it, but he focused it into the kamehameha to kill Gohan, which makes the beams power smaller, but more intense. That's just a thought, and probably the most logical explanation you will get.
Bingo, a smart fellow who get it, is not the size, is the power in it comprese and they focuse in a little points, this is what Toriyama means and the prove is this:
Vegeta concentrating his attack down to a small point to hit Freeza
Freeza did destroy the planet vegita in his weakest form, canon, is not about chain reaction, in his battle with Goku he held his power to create the chain reaction, the reason was to show Goku his 100% full power and beat him, Freza want to beat Goku, and Knew his 100% does not last longer, so he wanted to be sure, if he didn´t beat Goku, the planet explosion will.
Toriayama made the history of Bardock canon:
http://www.daizex.com/guides/rumors/index.shtml
Also remember cases such as Bardock, who was essentially a joint-collaboration between Akira Toriyama and Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru. In fact, Toriyama liked the idea so much, he ended up integrating it into his own canon storyline in the manga. For more information on this joint-collaboration, check out our respective "Tidbit
And my final opinion respect to Kid Buu stronger than the other Buus, he was not, but the big diference here is that Kid buu never feel tired, never run out of power, big diference with the other Buu´s who absorbe power but also get tired and can be damage, prove of this is Gohan-buu bleading and Kid Buu beating the Fat Buu, Kid Buu was not stronger, but he could beat them all due his eternal energy. that is how it when for Goku who desintegrate him many times but the Djinn return from atoms unharmed.
Vegeta Final Flash, In the manga is faster, the anime they make it long, all the power concentrade in a small point, to avoid destroying the planet they are.
Japanese
YouTube video
Originally posted by VvendetaGokou even says he was trying to finish him off but he couldn't. Gokou likes to have fun fighting opponents that are strong but he doesn't sit there and taunt specially when he's serious. And he doesn't relish in destruction and hurting people.
But Goku also was having fun, he miscalculate that being alive his power up at SSJ 3 consume more energy and run out, meaning if he power up from the beggining to hi maximun, he didn´t need the Genkidama to defeat Buu.
Originally posted by VvendetaStill he wasn't originally part of the manga and didn't show up until after the movie was made. Akira took the guy from the movie and put him into his manga.
Toriayama made the history of Bardock canon:
http://www.daizex.com/guides/rumors/index.shtml
Also remember cases such as Bardock, who was essentially a joint-collaboration between Akira Toriyama and Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru. In fact, Toriyama liked the idea so much, he ended up integrating it into his own canon storyline in the manga. For more information on this joint-collaboration, check out our respective "Tidbit
Originally posted by Vvendeta
And my final opinion respect to Kid Buu stronger than the other Buus, he was not, but the big diference here is that Kid buu never feel tired, never run out of power, big diference with the other Buu´s who absorbe power but also get tired and can be damage, prove of this is Gohan-buu bleading and Kid Buu beating the Fat Buu, Kid Buu was not stronger, but he could beat them all due his eternal energy. that is how it when for Goku who desintegrate him many times but the Djinn return from atoms unharmed.
Originally posted by Kento
Gokou even says he was trying to finish him off but he couldn't. Gokou likes to have fun fighting opponents that are strong but he doesn't sit there and taunt specially when he's serious. And he doesn't relish in destruction and hurting people.Still he wasn't originally part of the manga and didn't show up until after the movie was made. Akira took the guy from the movie and put him into his manga.
That's your opinion and I can respect that. We've all got our opinons and reasons why we think Kid Buu was strongest or one of the weakest.
2. Toriyamama made it after he finish the manga, but he and other guy made the Bardock movie, and he is the creator of Freeza, so he knows his character (Freeza) power and he made the history canon. you have a coment when you said that Freeza only can destroy a planet by creating a reaction (Battle with Goku), if you have the original manga you will read the part when Freeza said he held back, and Goku notice it, Goku say to Freeza, "you wanted to show me your full potential otherwise you will hit the planet again"
3. Read well, Kid Buu was the more dangerous of the Buus, not strongest, and you know that When Buu absorbe, he adquire the capabilities of the one he absorbe, even blead, But the original Buu doesn´t, he has eternal stamina and energy, all in the manga, not only my opinion.
For the respect thread
Gohan turning SSJ , first time, japanese.
YouTube video
this moment caught what DB is about for me, breaking limits, never stop improving.
And one of the best fights in DB
Tien vs Yamcha.
YouTube video
And the best for me is Tien vs Jackie Chun (Roshi)
I try to find the original version, only find this AMV, the music is good to me:
Enjoy.
YouTube video
To Kento:
Yes is only my opinion of how i see DBZ, sorry if i was rude in my answer to you.
Originally posted by Vvendeta
1. Goku said he need a minute to gather his real strenght, he MISCALCULATE, if he charge his total strenght from the Begining he will defeat kid Buu, Vegeta sense his full power inside him, that is why Vegeta sugested to him, Goku probably when the fight allready was on realize that He need his maximum potential, then he could´nt do it, Is very clear.so i don´t know if you like or dislike Dragon ball but you are twisting the true here.2. Toriyamama made it after he finish the manga, but he and other guy made the Bardock movie, and he is the creator of Freeza, so he knows his character (Freeza) power and he made the history canon. you have a coment when you said that Freeza only can destroy a planet by creating a reaction (Battle with Goku), if you have the original manga you will read the part when Freeza said he held back, and Goku notice it, Goku say to Freeza, "you wanted to show me your full potential otherwise you will hit the planet again"
3. Read well, Kid Buu was the more dangerous of the Buus, not strongest, and you know that When Buu absorbe, he adquire the capabilities of the one he absorbe, even blead, But the original Buu doesn´t, he has eternal stamina and energy, all in the manga, not only my opinion.
Yes, he needs time to gather his full power. But just because Vegeta says he can beat Kid Buu if he went full power doesn't make it true since Kid Buu wasn't being serious. It's very clear that Vegeta and Gokou assume Gokou can do it if he could gather his energy yet even then they don't consider the fact that Kid Buu isn't taking the fight serious. Even his fight with Vegeta he's still just playing around. He doesn't even use hands when blocking Fat Buu's attacks at the beginning. Gokou may not be fully powered up but he was taking the fight serious. He was trying to finish him off. Kid Buu taunts and mocks Gokou at the beginning of the fight and when he talks to Vegeta instead of just attacking when he could. So it's pretty clear Kid Buu isn't fighting seriously.
No, Bardock movie appeared before Bardock appeared in the manga. Akira helped create the movie sure but that means Bardock and all isn't just his. Sure it was made canon but only because he liked Bardock's character. And even in the Bardock movie it takes a little bit for the planet to explode. Freeza says that he didn't use enough power after blasting Namek's core and that it would take five minutes. That still doesn't say that if he hadn't put more power the blast wouldn't have hit the core and mucked it up making it explode faster. Some of the effects of Namek also happen on Vegeta before it explodes. Ground trembling, and lava spewing up.
Fat Buu was also a lot weaker than Kid Buu and Super Buu was a merge between Fat and Evil Buu. So they have to go from being weaker to getting back to his original power. There is nothing pointing to Super Buu being stronger or weaker than Super Buu. That is why it's all opinion unless somebody can ask Akira who was the strongest.
The way i see it.
1. when Goku say he has being Trying but he need one minute is to build up his KI until he has enough power to pulverizes KId Buu, Goku with his dead body knew how much is his maximum, even if Buu was having fun. but alive didn´t work that way, mostly because he was worn out at this point of the fight, for me if Goku knew the power of Kid Buu, and build his maximum from the begining, he would desintegrate Kid Buu without the Genkidama.
2. Saying This, Freeza is a planet destroyer character, and he could finish Namek in one attack, but the point in his fight with Goku was to beat him at hi maximum 100% and then leave Goku die with the planet, i disagree with some who said that Freeza couldn´t blow Namek, see Freeza weakest form did it with his finger, and is the vision of the author, that was my point.
3. Kid Buu could beat the Super Buu because he never get tired, not feel pain,The super Buu did, even if the Super Buu was stronger, Super Buu could have it as same like the fat Buu, but yes is only my point of view.
Goku vs Freeza Japanese
YouTube video
But did Gokou really know Kid Buu's max power? I mean Kid Buu wasn't serious and he didn't even power up when he made the blast that destroyed Earth. They know what power he can use but he never shows himself to be going all out so it would be all assumption on both Vegeta and Gokou's part just like them thinking they could beat Kid Buu while being just ssj.
He could blow Namek up and Earth up and any planet easily. But it still is feasible that it's just by disrupting the core. He said that he didn't use enough power then he says he hit the core and that they have five minutes. It is possible that the more energy used that faster the core destroys the planet. Planet Vegeta also didn't explode for like ten or so seconds while when Buu destroyed Earth it was instant.
Didn't Vegeta say that the Buu's could hurt each other because he felt Fat Buu loosing energy unlike any time before? So it would be conceivable that Super Buu (if stronger) could beat Kid Buu since they can hurt each other.
Well, not, it could be that kid Buu could have more powerfull attacks, or ki hidden, but Goku allready blow him to dust before, just the Buu regenarate form that, but Goku at his maximum, would desintegrate him completly, that was what vegeta mean.
Yes, i agree, anyway, like i said there are many who said Freeza could not blow Namek, when in the manga is state that he hold back.
Vegeta say it, but the one who was being hurt all that fight was the fat Buu, See, the Fat and Super Buu get stronger until absorbe, but also get vulnerable, like super Buu get tired against Gotenks, and Gohan Buu get beat by Vegeto, the Kid Buu don´t, he just come back from atoms and was fresh, so even weaker that Super Buu, he will beat Him.
But it's still just an assumption that Vegeta said that because he didn't even realize how strong Kid Buu was when he said that. Kid Buu didn't have great durability I'll admit so Gokou may have been able to do it if he go the actual chance but I don't think he was close to being as powerful as Kid Buu. But he would have to make sure nothing was left which would be the hard part. So it may or may not be possible even though he was weaker.
Hmm I don't remember anybody saying he couldn't destroy Namek....which would make them saying that completely false seeing as how he does...
Super Buu, Fat Buu, and Gohan Buu were all being beat by equal or superior opponents though. Kid Buu never fought somebody at his level of power or higher than him in power. I mean Fat Buu was blown into tiny pieces by Vegeta yet he didn't loose any energy at all or get hurt while he did get hurt by SSJ3 Gokou who was just punching.
Speaking of Fat Buu I wonder if Fat Buu was still > normal Gotenks after he trained and became ssj3 to be able to be Super Buu's equal or if base Gotenks could beat Fat Buu.
Goku could desintegrate Buu at his maximum, but alive and worn out he could not reach it, so the last resort was the Genkidama.
Oh i think the Kid Buu is powerfull allright, and he Was durable as fat Buu, Satan give him a Bomb that could blow a Tank and he laugh, the bad Human attack him with a Bazooka and make him piss off, And Super Buu could not be scracht by Gotenks fusion until Gotenks turn Super saiyan, just that we believe they are not durable because the saiyans blow them, but, that only prove the power of the Saiyans.
I think yes, Just a Super saiyan Gotenks SSj 3 could beat easy the fat Buu to the point of desintegrete him until the last atom. Gotenks tough he beat the Super Buu by incinerate his parts, the Buu reform from smoke, the Fat Buu or any Buu could do the same.
Goku vs Kid Buu
Japanese
