Venom and Carnage vs. Batman

I think you're giving them way too much credit. At least compared to the credit you're not giving Batman's villians.

Pretending to be a corpse in no way alters breathing. He could simply harden a part of the symbiot around his neck and no pulse would be noticeable.

You are severely underestimated the time that it takes Batman to devise a plan. His thought process has been described as "taking giant leaps in logic." He is the worlds best detective and basically nothing eludes him for long.

Except life, in this fight. Carnage takes bullet shots and laughs, so what is Bats gonna do? Die.

Unless he's got himself a nice sonic or incendiary grenade. Then hes got a much better chance.

Don't forget carnage can throw his symbiote, he's thrown an axe hand before and he'll probably do it again.

I said basically.

And I'm still not argueing he could win just that he could get away and that he's not being given enough credit.

The symbiote also tore a bomb out of Eddies chest and kept him alive, and traveled threw the internet providing a synthetic gas mask wouldnt seem too difficult.

I didnt say Bat's rougues were not formidable, just they are not in Venom or Carnages leagues. these two are built for fighting, Carnage exceeds at it.

Killer Croc<the Lizard
Bane<Rhino
Clayface<Carnage
this one is differnt
Scarecrow>Mysterio

Joker is an excellent exception

dont think Im not doubting batman. he did devies a plan too take out the JLA.

but in a heated fight Bat's would be out of tricks. Venom has evaded Punisher's traps more than once, and even slipped threw a trap set by Kraven the worlds greatest hunter, and the friggin thing was on fire! Venom isnt stupid, Carnage is but he makes up for it with pointy appendeges

I do give Bat's credit, but he is still only human. Bat's is a member of the JLA. pretty much the IT team to be on. that obviosuly counts for somthing

and he is brilliant, more than brilliant. and If I remember correct was at 1000lbs but that could be wrong still thats very impressive for a human.

You forgot Ras a Ghul.

Ras a Ghul>Venom
Lady shiva>Carnage
Solomon Grundy>than Rhino

at least in my opinion

But I think you get the point no? You stil think you're not underestimating Batman's enemies and his abilities to adapt?

Adaptation is differnt than evasion, formulation, preperation and then springing the attack.

Lady Shiva is only superior too Carnage in fighting abilty, I do not belive Im underestimating them. I look at "vs" threads as instances were the character's have a random encounter and fight to there max with just what they usaully have on them.

Ras a Ghul is immortal/magician correct? a supernatural villian so to speak?

Im sure Bat's enimies are just as lethal, just in differnt way's. Joker and the Riddler could confound both in minutes. this is what Im saying, Batman is such an intellect becuase he faces intellect's.

True, but i chose lady shiva and examples because they use swords. I find this comparable to the attacks that both venom and carnage produce. I know quite a bit about melee weapons so I feel safe in using them for examples.

Lady shiva being the worlds greatest martial artist, and Ras being even better than Shiva with a sword (do to his centuries of experience) can do little to Batman when he plays it defensively (which in these cases is actually most if not all the time.)

A quick and nimble sword can produce quite a flurry of attacks. Few in hollywood can show this so many aren't aware of just how fast a sword can be. I find it quite comparable to Venom and especially Carnage. I would peg them superior to this but neither is trained (although expeirenced i'm sure.)

And about Batman's adaptation and application, this is one of the things that astound even me. He's like Sherlock Holmes with a big ol' bag o' tricks. No one is really as smart as him in this way, so they have him figure out rediculous things in no time at all, especially in the JLA books.

slade is smarter than bats....

Did you even read the thread?

Even if that were true what does it have to do with anything?

you claimed nobody was smarter than bats, so i just felt like sticking up for slade. I mean,somebody has to, after all.

Back on topic, Venom or Carnage alone could most likely take care of bats. I see it going either 2 ways...

1) The symbiote simply beats (and kills) bats in the first encounter

or

2) bats manages to escape (barely) and goes on to figure out the symbiote's weakness. Then he returns and fights the symbiote at a later time. Symbiote loses, but escapes and heals. It returns, and they both fight again. Endless cycle, though it would only take one fatal blow to permentantly down bats, whereas the symbiotes have amazing healing abilities.

Please be more careful when reading my post. It says "no one is smarter than bats IN THIS WAY(without this excess in capitalization.)"

And I'd modify your responses to be:

1) the symbiotes kill Bats after a grueling battle that impresses even them.

2) Batman escapes with some difficulty (he's can't stick to walls but he's acrobatic enough to do it and make it look good.) And then the cycle continuos for a while until Bats puts them both in Arkham

no one in DC is smarter to bats in that way...too many Marvel guys have enhanced brains to conclude a normal human could calculate more quickly...Richards and Doom are forces of nature and not even applicable...But guys like Sinister, Leader, Mad Thinker, would be good matches for Bats

Fair enough.

i still stand by slade, claiming he is smarter than bats in EVERY WAY

Then argue that in the appropriate thread.

bats and slade r hella tough because they have brains and bodies that can use them

Very true.

carnage doesn't hesitate and wait to c if his enemy is dead, he just killis them in a way that ensures death, like beheading.

So?