"hmm...well i see an apple but you see a pear. How can we know which fruit is on the table when i see one and you the other.
So which one IS the truth?"
Hell if I know, someone has to be right though, unless it's some other fruit, like a bannana, then we're both full of shit.
Or, you could call in a third party and ask them what fruit they see on the table.
Originally posted by BackFire
"hmm...well i see an apple but you see a pear. How can we know which fruit is on the table when i see one and you the other.So which one IS the truth?"
Hell if I know, someone has to be right though, unless it's some other fruit, like a bannana, then we're both full of shit.
Or, you could call in a third party and ask them what fruit they see on the table.
I got all wrapped up in the fruit convo i forgot what this whole thread was about.
Beautiful lie i guess - truth is good but its subjective as my fruit convo proved.
Dreampanther> “The problem with truth is people use it to hurt other people. You know people use it as an excuse to say mean and terrible things to other people, then hide behind the fact that "it's the truth".”
If the truth hurt other people, then it’s just “too bad” for these other people.
The truth is the truth.
If terrible things are being said, which is a LIE, and then concealed as “the truth” it’s not really the truth, is it?
Kids shouldn’t be lied to, just because the parents can’t handle their questions. Children are robust little critters. If parents think the kids are not READY to understand/comprehend the truth, that is something else.
Do not confuse OPINIONS/LIKES/DISLIKES with truth/lies. The truth is not negotiable – IF we take truths to be built on or indeed really FACTS.
Let’s say you’re short! That’s a fact. It’s the truth. You may not like it, but you are short.
Now, let’s take your HAIRCUT. How people view it will depend on who they are. Some may like it, some may not.
So perhaps the question should’ve been “Do you want the awful facts”? or “a nice lie”.
(Just trying to establish the foundation of premises here)
Originally posted by The Omega
Do not confuse OPINIONS/LIKES/DISLIKES with truth/lies. The truth is not negotiable – IF we take truths to be built on or indeed really FACTS.(Just trying to establish the foundation of premises here)
I like the idea of clarifying definitions. It's always a good place to start.
What I am arguing, though, is that there is a difference between truth and facts. Truth, according to Foucault (I apologise for citing him so often, but his arguments make a lot of sense, and he argued about this very specific topic), is something that people agree upon.
For instance (he was homosexual, so he used this example a lot) he said that a few decades ago, most people believed it was true that homosexuality was wrong. You could go to jail for it, and most people believed it was true that you went to hell for it.
Now, times have changed, so what was true then, is not true now. This led him to argue that while people believe in an eternal, everlasting truth, there is actually no such thing. Facts are something different.
For instance, it is a fact that Bush just won the election. Now for me it may be true that this is the worst thing that could have happened, while for you it may be true that this is the best thing that could have happened. Our truths are based on our interpretations of facts.
(Please, before anybody wants to get into an argument with me about Bush, it was just an example, in fact, I'm already sorry I used him as an example.)
What Foucault argues is that truth, in contradiction to your statement, is exactly that: An opinion. It is something that changes, from person to person and from time to time.
Originally posted by Darth Revanthe truth doesn't change
That "the truth" changes over time as society changes. People used to think homosexuality was horribly wrong, now more and more are starting to accept it.
Originally posted by moneypenny
The universal truth is bred out of the collective unconsciousness.
Like the universal truth a couple hundred years ago till now that "niggers" or whatever ghastly term they inflicted on black populations back then, were inferior? 🤨 That was almost certainly on people's subconscious, even part of their Freudian super-ego.