FF: FF7 Sephiroth Vs FF( Trance Kuja

Here we go, another day in paradise. Hey I found out something today that completely screws all your arguments up. If FF9 was actually a good enough game I might have noticed it as well on a secondary play through. Kuja never blew up a planet, he destroyed the surface of Terra only, even LESS damage then what Sephiroth would have caused with Meteor. Just directly copying from what the other guys said.

Second: The FFIX UOG say that Terra is located in the core of Gaia. If Kuja blew up Terra, Gaia would have been destroyed too. Terra was still there. This is proved by Kuja in the Crystal World, when he said that the process of assimilation between Gaia and Terra was already begun, and he couldn’t do anything to stop it, even if he tried. How Terra was asssimilating Gaia if Terra didn’t exist anymore? Because Terra was still there. Kuja didn’t blew up the planet, he just destroyed the surface of it.

Originally posted by Xenogears
Sephiroth having equal or more skill than Kuja is a LARGE opinion on your behalf. If by chance he is more skilled than Kuja, that alone wouldn't give Sephiroth the victory against him.

Actually, Kuja having more skill then Sephiroth is a large assumption on your behalf. You're comparing a full CGI movie where the character move fluently to an old PS1 game where characters can barely move at all. As I said, in Advent Children Seph showed more skill then Kuja did in FF9, you can't deny it if just because of the quality of media they're both on.

Originally posted by Xenogears
And this has to do with being able to destroy a planet, how? Injuring a planet to consume its energy and nuking one are two totally different things, not to mention the time it takes a person to cast Meteor with the Black Materia is time-consuming. Kuja destroyed Terra within a few seconds.

He didn't even destroy Terra. He damaged the surface. 😂

Originally posted by Xenogears
Where's the confirmation that Jenova destroyed a planet that's as large as the world of Terra. That meteor Jenova was riding was nowhere near the size of Terra, or Earth. Secondly, the way Sephiroth can "destroy" a planet, or corrupting it rather, is by using the lifestream against it, and as your beloved Sephiroth states, "The last thoughts of Geostigma's dead... those remnants will join the lifestream and circle the planet; choking it; corroding it." That's not really going to assist Sephiroth here, considering this is not Gaia they're fighting on, nor has Sephiroth ever used the lifestream against his opponents before. What he can do with it in battle is a mere pigment of your imagination.

You apparently don't know anything about asteroids. An asteroid shrinks dramatically during it's decent into the atmosphere of a planet. An asteroid about the size of our Earth would become about the size of the moon after it burns up in an atmosphere like ours. He never used the lifestream because he never needed to, like I said before. He's the strongest Character in FF7, outmatching everyone by quite a bit. Why would he need to resort to things like that? Oh, and BTW... Merely destroying his body could infect you with J-Cells as well. Afterall, that IS how the lifestream was originally corrupted to begin with. The destruction of Jenova in the crater spread her cells througout the planet, where they quickly multiplied and infected everything.

Originally posted by Xenogears
Yeah, capable of sailing the cosmos with a planet. Big whoop there.

All that needs to said in response to this is: Nuking an entire planet > Anything Sephiroth has shown to do.

Wow...what complete and utter bullshit...lmfao

Causing a wound that threatens the very life of the planet > destroying the surface of a planet.

Originally posted by Xenogears
Your comparison of humans getting infected with diseases and Trance Kuja becoming infected with Jenova cells is ridiculous and laughable. What makes you think using the negative lifestream against a being of Kuja's caliber would be effective? No scratch that, what makes you think Sephiroth would be able to infect Kuja with J-cells in the first place? 😆

Show me some place where it says Kuja is immune to disease please, or Zindane for that matter since they're both the same race.

Originally posted by Xenogears
Now here is where I laugh at the biggest and most utter piece of nonsense you've put down here. You sure do know how to contradict yourself saying Sephiroth has enough durability to endure planet-destroying assaults, yet at other times you state that it is only an illusionary attack by said character, where he manipulates the person into seeing the animation, because when another fanboy is debating you, you don't want them to lose control and throw tantrum. Fact of the matter is, it's in fact an illusionary attack, as far as most people are concerned. In addition, if Sephiroth can get raped by an omnislash from his boyfriend Cloud Strife, it proves that he can't endure attacks of the like and assaults far worse than that, such as say...Kuja's planet-destroying Ultima.

What are you going on about? I contradict myself? How? Gawd. You're right, I don't want them throwing a tantrum, I've dealt with that enough of Codec, it's annoying because they start spitting more bullshit then what they were before. Would you believe that I've been told that Goku can morph into a Dragon? See? People lie when they're angry. Fact of the matter is, if Super Nova is an illusion then Sephiroth is probably even more powerful. Oh and, I seem to recall kicking Kuja's ass with nothing but physical attacks... so complaining that Seph got beat by an Omnislash doesn't really matter.

Originally posted by Xenogears
[b]Edit: And your theory of Sephiroth becoming a god right after Kuja blasts him with a planet destroying attack is beyond hilarious.

Farewell and have a nice day. [/B]

Well, it doesn't matter anymore since we've learned that Kuja never destroyed Terra.

He's right about the Kuja destroying Terra, only the surface was destroyed and it wasn't like one giant beam of death, it was several blasts.

Originally posted by Chaotic
His incarnation in Advent Children was his strongest yet, he has all the abilities from the game plus many more. And the talk of full potential is relevant because he's never shown more power then what he did in Advent Children. Which is much below his maximum.

And yet with all of Sephiroth's never before seen power he still relies on his masamune in a fight. Honestly as far as the movie goes Sephiroth does not impress me. Not in the very least.

Originally posted by Chaotic
It says I have to be more well known. [/B]

Aye. Forgot about those restrictions.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Even so, that doesn't change the fact that he was preforming Jenova's plan down to the exacts, which is why he summoned Meteor instead of taking a quicker route. [/B]

Jenova used meteor as well during her ancient war days? Jenova you pussy. If she actually used meteor too I am led to believe her "planet busting" abilities are not as concrete as you think they are.

Originally posted by Chaotic
That's exactly my point, speculation won't cut it. It seems that we're both at a standstill. The movie says he can yet he didn't, so I assume he can. You speculate that he can't, who's right? Speculation won't cut it, meaning the closest drop to evidence we have is what he said. Since he didn't do it or even attempt it for that matter, you have to use the best evidence you can. Which is what is said. [/B]

I don't take Sephiroth's word for granted.

Originally posted by Chaotic
He didn't do it because he never had the chance to do so. He fought Cloud, who got lucky, and was defeated. He might have been wrong about being a Cetra, but he only knew what he read. He saw that his Mother was Jenova and that Gast had Jenova classified as an Ancient. He was wrong, but only because he was lead to believe so by reports. I would think that he'd know what he was capable of. Especially since he's shown to have every other ability that Jenova has. [/B]

Cloud did not get lucky. Sephiroth committed the same mistake he always does: he underestimated Cloud. For all of Sephiroth's intellect he still repeats the same mistake over and over again. You also need to remember Sephiroth is not 100% Jenova. Let me clear myself up: what he has is the remains of Jenova aka--a head/neck/whatever it was.

Originally posted by Chaotic
I don't see how it is honestly. [/B]

Fine by me.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Well, if you don't want to count that as controlling the lifestream then I've got another for you. In the SE published story "The Maiden Who Travels the Planet" he does indeed control the lifestream, not negative LS either, the pure stuff. He used it to suck President Shinra's concisenesses away during the events of Final Fantasy VII. Once again, I can't post links, so you'll have to look it up yourself. [/B]

That still does not prove he will be able to corrupt Kuja with n-lifestream. His control over the lifestream is not as outstanding as you're making us believe. Why didn't he stop the lifestream when it helped holy? Exactly. Besides Sephiroth was able to suck Shinra's consciousness away because Shinra had already joined the lifestream. The same case cannot be applied to Kuja.

Originally posted by Chaotic
What do you mean I can't make the claim he's made of the same stuff? EVERYTHING is made of the same material, right now to their atoms. He has to be comprised of cells, just like every other living creature. And an attack from a Dragon isn't the same thing as a Disease, you can't say it is. Also, after Sephiroth received the Black Materia from Cloud he had no use to even TRY to control him anymore. As I recall, he never even tried, so making the assumption that he can't is absurd, especially when he can still manipulate his other clones. [/B]

How exactly do you know he never tried? He even lost the fight inside Cloud's mind at the end of FF7.

Sephiroth infecting and controlling Kuja is too far fetched because Kuja is too powerful. He has never shown the ability to manipulate someone on Kuja's level. Not to mention Cloud, and the rest of the SHM had issues that could be easily exploited. In essence the SHM were kids.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Okay, then let's say Super Nova IS an illusion, that doesn't decrease the power of the attack, in fact it only makes him that much stronger. Instead of creating a fireball that destroys worlds he's now capable of diving into ANYBODIES mind and creating an illusion. What would stop him from putting Kuja into an illusion then cutting him down where he stands without any resistance whatsoever? Nothing, his will is obviously at least as strong as Kuja's own. Defying your creator, willing yourself a body from nothing both seem about the same to me. [/B]

Thank God for having different colors and opinions.

Like I told you earlier the main flaw of your argument is that Kuja will just be standing there while Sephiroth attempts to infect him with Jenova Cells, manipulate him and try to cast an illusion on him.

Sephiroth cannonically has yet to prove he can survive Trance Kuja's Terra busting attack.

He has shown he is weak to swords...2 times in canon cutscenes.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Here we go, another day in paradise. Hey I found out something today that completely screws all your arguments up. If FF9 was actually a good enough game I might have noticed it as well on a secondary play through. Kuja never blew up a planet, he destroyed the surface of Terra only, even LESS damage then what Sephiroth would have caused with Meteor. Just directly copying from what the other guys said.

Second: The FFIX UOG say that Terra is located in the core of Gaia. If Kuja blew up Terra, Gaia would have been destroyed too. Terra was still there. This is proved by Kuja in the Crystal World, when he said that the process of assimilation between Gaia and Terra was already begun, and he couldn’t do anything to stop it, even if he tried. How Terra was asssimilating Gaia if Terra didn’t exist anymore? Because Terra was still there. Kuja didn’t blew up the planet, he just destroyed the surface of it.

And? Sephiroth has yet to prove he can pull something like that off, or more importantly that he can survive something like that.

Originally posted by Chaotic

Actually, Kuja having more skill then Sephiroth is a large assumption on your behalf. You're comparing a full CGI movie where the character move fluently to an old PS1 game where characters can barely move at all. As I said, in Advent Children Seph showed more skill then Kuja did in FF9, you can't deny it if just because of the quality of media they're both on.

You do realize the guy with state-of-the-art CGI cinematics to back him up will look better, right?

Originally posted by Chaotic

He didn't even destroy Terra. He damaged the surface. 😂

Still more than anything Sephiroth has accomplished.

Originally posted by Chaotic

You apparently don't know anything about asteroids. An asteroid shrinks dramatically during it's decent into the atmosphere of a planet. An asteroid about the size of our Earth would become about the size of the moon after it burns up in an atmosphere like ours. He never used the lifestream because he never needed to, like I said before. He's the strongest Character in FF7, outmatching everyone by quite a bit. Why would he need to resort to things like that? Oh, and BTW... Merely destroying his body could infect you with J-Cells as well. Afterall, that IS how the lifestream was originally corrupted to begin with. The destruction of Jenova in the crater spread her cells througout the planet, where they quickly multiplied and infected everything.

Hmm...He was in the lifestream when he was destroyed. Of course it would spread over it. Besides if that was the case then the entire FF7 party would have been infected with Geostigma. It did not happen.

FF9 characters operate on a higher level than FF7. Shit a Tranced Mog is a beast in FF9.

Maybe he didn't use the lifestream because his control over it is not as outstanding as you're tyring to make us believe.

Originally posted by Chaotic

Causing a wound that threatens the very life of the planet > destroying the surface of a planet.

Meteor is not part of his power/abilities set. He won't be pulling shit like that off on a regular basis and without the Black Materia it's not even possible. Get it right.

Originally posted by Chaotic

Show me some place where it says Kuja is immune to disease please, or Zindane for that matter since they're both the same race.

Sephiroth does not deliberately corrupt people with J-Cells. You're twisting it up to back you up. In fact he's shown in AC that he can only manipulate those who are already infected with J-Cells.

Originally posted by Chaotic

What are you going on about? I contradict myself? How? Gawd. You're right, I don't want them throwing a tantrum, I've dealt with that enough of Codec, it's annoying because they start spitting more bullshit then what they were before. Would you believe that I've been told that Goku can morph into a Dragon? See? People lie when they're angry. Fact of the matter is, if Super Nova is an illusion then Sephiroth is probably even more powerful. Oh and, I seem to recall kicking Kuja's ass with nothing but physical attacks... so complaining that Seph got beat by an Omnislash doesn't really matter.

Sephiroth attacks Cloud. Cloud survives...and counters with a slash. Sephiroth is beaten. Get it right.

Originally posted by Chaotic

Well, it doesn't matter anymore since we've learned that Kuja never destroyed Terra.

We have learned that Sephiroth is delusional and has not demonstrated the level of Raw Power Kuja has.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Here we go, another day in paradise. Hey I found out something today that completely screws all your arguments up. If FF9 was actually a good enough game I might have noticed it as well on a secondary play through. Kuja never blew up a planet, he destroyed the surface of Terra only, even LESS damage then what Sephiroth would have caused with Meteor. Just directly copying from what the other guys said.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Second: The FFIX UOG say that Terra is located in the core of Gaia. If Kuja blew up Terra, Gaia would have been destroyed too. Terra was still there. This is proved by Kuja in the Crystal World, when he said that the process of assimilation between Gaia and Terra was already begun, and he couldn’t do anything to stop it, even if he tried. How Terra was asssimilating Gaia if Terra didn’t exist anymore? Because Terra was still there. Kuja didn’t blew up the planet, he just destroyed the surface of it.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Actually, Kuja having more skill then Sephiroth is a large assumption on your behalf. You're comparing a full CGI movie where the character move fluently to an old PS1 game where characters can barely move at all. As I said, in Advent Children Seph showed more skill then Kuja did in FF9, you can't deny it if just because of the quality of media they're both on.

Originally posted by Chaotic
He didn't even destroy Terra. He damaged the surface. 😂

And if I really wanted to push the issue, Kuja seemed to have done what he did somewhat effortlessly.

Originally posted by Chaotic
You apparently don't know anything about asteroids. An asteroid shrinks dramatically during it's decent into the atmosphere of a planet. An asteroid about the size of our Earth would become about the size of the moon after it burns up in an atmosphere like ours. He never used the lifestream because he never needed to, like I said before. He's the strongest Character in FF7, outmatching everyone by quite a bit. Why would he need to resort to things like that? Oh, and BTW... Merely destroying his body could infect you with J-Cells as well. Afterall, that IS how the lifestream was originally corrupted to begin with. The destruction of Jenova in the crater spread her cells througout the planet, where they quickly multiplied and infected everything.

Unfortunately, Sephiroth has not done anything to prove that he can pull off a feat similar to what Kuja has done, and with ease might I add.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Causing a wound that threatens the very life of the planet > destroying the surface of a planet.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Show me some place where it says Kuja is immune to disease please, or Zindane for that matter since they're both the same race.

Originally posted by Chaotic
What are you going on about? I contradict myself? How? Gawd. You're right, I don't want them throwing a tantrum, I've dealt with that enough of Codec, it's annoying because they start spitting more bullshit then what they were before. Would you believe that I've been told that Goku can morph into a Dragon? See? People lie when they're angry. Fact of the matter is, if Super Nova is an illusion then Sephiroth is probably even more powerful. Oh and, I seem to recall kicking Kuja's ass with nothing but physical attacks... so complaining that Seph got beat by an Omnislash doesn't really matter.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Well, it doesn't matter anymore since we've learned that Kuja never destroyed Terra.

Sephiroth is only more skilled than Kuja in martial skill, what he can do with his body. In terms of magical skill Kuja easily has the upper hand. I personally think that Seph would beat normal Kuja, but would lose to Trance. T.Kuja has more power than Seph and even though the Terra feat is sometimes overhyped, in that he didn't destroy the whole planet in one gigantic blast, he scorched the surface with many small ones and correct me if I am mistaken but Terra is a fairly small planet, it is legit and more than Seph has been shown capable of. I'll tell you this right now tho, Omega Weapon in DoC would f*ck Trance Kuja up!

Well, I think I proved my point.

Superboy Prime, it's been nice debating with you. You win, I've lost interest and my entire point of coming here was to show that I wouldn't be "completely pwned like a n00b" and I think I proved that statement to be false. You've got to be a saint to put up with my ramblings without resorting to flaming.

Xenogears, learn to work on your people skills homie, calling me a jackass? What the hell did I do to you? A bit short tempered are we? Piece of advice get laid dude, it'll do wonders for ya.

Violent2Dope, you seem like a cool fella, nice sig BTW, Ganondorf is the bomb. FYI though, Omega Weapon was nothing, I doubt it could **** Kuja up because it got ****ed up by Chaos.

If you guys ever wander over to MovieCodec Forums, look me up. I'm Cid there.

Omega Weapon was gonna kill all life on the planet to transport it to another world or some such bullshit. That's way above Kuja's Terra feat. Oh and Xeno, why do you hate this guy? He doesn't seem that bad.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Well, I think I proved my point.

Superboy Prime, it's been nice debating with you. You win, I've lost interest and my entire point of coming here was to show that I wouldn't be "completely pwned like a n00b" and I think I proved that statement to be false. You've got to be a saint to put up with my ramblings without resorting to flaming.

Xenogears, learn to work on your people skills homie, calling me a jackass? What the hell did I do to you? A bit short tempered are we? Piece of advice get laid dude, it'll do wonders for ya.

Violent2Dope, you seem like a cool fella, nice sig BTW, Ganondorf is the bomb. FYI though, Omega Weapon was nothing, I doubt it could **** Kuja up because it got ****ed up by Chaos.

If you guys ever wander over to MovieCodec Forums, look me up. I'm Cid there.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Omega Weapon was gonna kill all life on the planet to transport it to another world or some such bullshit. That's way above Kuja's Terra feat. Oh and Xeno, why do you hate this guy? He doesn't seem that bad.

Oh well you kinda seem to dislike him.

Originally posted by Xenogears
How ironic considering you hand out insults to people over at codec.

Only when they insult me first. Or if they're just some stupid newbie who's only there to be an ass.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Omega Weapon was gonna kill all life on the planet to transport it to another world or some such bullshit. That's way above Kuja's Terra feat. Oh and Xeno, why do you hate this guy? He doesn't seem that bad.

Yeah, but Omega was just a tool in the end, something to be used in part of a grander plan.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Yeah, but Omega was just a tool in the end, something to be used in part of a grander plan.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Either way he was still stronger than Kuja.

Not really, saying that he's stronger then Kuja is saying Chaos is stronger, which is saying that Cloud is stronger, which means Sephiroth is stronger.

As much as I love FF7 and Hate FF9 even I know that Cloud and Vincent are no match for Kujie.

Originally posted by Chaotic
Not really, saying that he's stronger then Kuja is saying Chaos is stronger, which is saying that Cloud is stronger, which means Sephiroth is stronger.

As much as I love FF7 and Hate FF9 even I know that Cloud and Vincent are no match for Kujie.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Vincent didn't fight Omega head on he fought it's mind or sumthin. Only after being weakened was Chaos able to kill Omega's body. Oh, and Chaos IS stronger than Cloud.

There is no evidence to support Chaos being stronger then Cloud. He probably isn't, if he was then Vinny would have had no problem dispatching Sephiroth on his own in the center of the earth. But he didn't, it took everybody.

And he fought Omega Weiss inside of it, which is probably a lot stronger then the actual weapon itself. The Weapons are pushovers, all of them. Cloud and his group took down Ultimate Weapon and Shinra took down Sapphire and Diamond. If you treat the Ruby and Emerald as cannon since they finally made it into the Japanese game, Cloud and company beat them as well. Even thought it's not cannon, The Turks killed Jade Weapon as well.

Weapon isn't a powerful monster.

Originally posted by Chaotic
There is no evidence to support Chaos being stronger then Cloud. He probably isn't, if he was then Vinny would have had no problem dispatching Sephiroth on his own in the center of the earth. But he didn't, it took everybody.

And he fought Omega Weiss inside of it, which is probably a lot stronger then the actual weapon itself. The Weapons are pushovers, all of them. Cloud and his group took down Ultimate Weapon and Shinra took down Sapphire and Diamond. If you treat the Ruby and Emerald as cannon since they finally made it into the Japanese game, Cloud and company beat them as well. Even thought it's not cannon, The Turks killed Jade Weapon as well.

Weapon isn't a powerful monster.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Bullshit. What has Cloud done to put him above Chaos? Remember in FF7 Vincent wasn't able to use Chaos to it's fullest. Watch the cutscene at the end of DoC when Chaos is flying towards Omega and destroys him and then tell me Cloud is stronger than Chaos. One of the weapons was destroyed ny the Junon beam and Ultima Weapon is the weakest wep. And the weapons gameplay wise were stronger than Sephiroth.

He could still transform though... Also... you miss the point entirely. But I'm not explaining again. I'm not sticking around this forum.

Originally posted by Chaotic
He could still transform though... Also... you miss the point entirely. But I'm not explaining again. I'm not sticking around this forum.

Uh...Cloud is nowhere near Chaos's level. Can Cloud quake the Earth with his power? Definitely not. Can he travel as fast as Chaos? Definitely not. Can he take assaults from weapons as if they were nothing at all? Definitely not.

What's even funnier is that he's stated Chaos would own DT Dante, and saying that Cloud is more powerful than Chaos means he would own DT Dante even worse, which is a load of shit seeing as Cloud wouldn't stand a bit of a chance against Dante, let alone Dante with his Devil form triggered.