The personal attacks aren't necessary, and you don't have to explain everything to me; I'm not stupid. You are hurting my feelings.
Could you show me where Marvel says "there is no known limit to the Hulk's strength?" Could you?
Great Logic. I miscalculated Wolverine's strength. However
Spiderman, Wolverine, Venom... none of them are relevant to this thread.
"By supreme decree of the writers of DC, Superman Prime is the strongest superhero ever!"
No, He isn't.
I wish I knew more about Superman Prime, but it sounds like that he should most likely win.
On the debate about Wolverine's strength, it was once specified on a Wolverine comic card that if Len Wein (who created Wolverine) continued writing him, he would have possibly been boosted to Spiderman's strength level.
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
The personal attacks aren't necessary, and you don't have to explain everything to me; I'm not stupid. You are hurting my feelings.Could you show me where Marvel says "there is no known limit to the Hulk's strength?" Could you?
Great Logic. I miscalculated Wolverine's strength. However
Spiderman, Wolverine, Venom... none of them are relevant to this thread."By supreme decree of the writers of DC, Superman Prime is the strongest superhero ever!"
No, He isn't.
First things first. You are correct. I was being rather acerbic in my replies to you. That was unnecessary (especially since we are debating comics). I'm sorry, seriously. I'm used to debating a lot at work hence i guess some spilled over to you.
You definitely did not deserve the tone i used.
Anyways, now that that is out of the way.
About the Hulk and his strength.
Here is his bio according to the Marvel Directory. In it you will see where they say that the Hulk 'possesses the capacity for nearly limitless physical strength.' Note: Nearly limitless is different from limitless.
It also says further down that the Hulk's transformation speed is as follows: 'the total transformation took from 25 seconds to as long as 5 minutes.'
And further down it adds that 'in times of stress the Hulk's adrenaline level escalates, causing a corresponding escalation in strength. This is not accompanied by an additional gain in mass, but does appear to promote increased levels of energy efficiency. To date the Hulk has never apparently been provoked into demonstrating a maximum output of strength; hence, its upper limit remains a mystery.'
Hence it states that his upper limit is not known. That is different from having an infinite upper limit.
Anyways, the rest of the excerpt is below.
As for the armwrestling match. The reason i was saying that Prime would win can be surmised as follows:
1) The Hulk vs normal Superman matches have always ended in a draw (in that Supes wins one, the Hulk won the other). Hence the Hulk and normal Supes are equal - with the exception that Superman starts higher, and the Hulk can become stronger than normal Supes with his rage induced strength.
2) Superman Prime is beyond normal Superman in strength since he has been absorbing energy for thousands of years.
3) Thus Prime is stronger than the Hulk as well. Not just more powerful but stronger.
An analogy would be a race between a Corvette Z06 and a Viper. And let's say the race is a veritable tie. Now, let's say there is a race between the Corvette and a Lamborghini Murcielago. And the Lamborghini kicks the @$$ of the 'Vette.
Logically speaking if the Lambo can whoop the vette, and the vette tied with the Viper, intuitively the Lambo can also whip the Viper.
That was my logic.
Not that the Hulk is weak. He is not, he is one of the strongest characters in both Marvel and DC. That is a fact.
The thing is that the Hulk has fought normal Superman to a standstill. And if that is the case then how can he defeat a Superman that has been gaining strength for millenia?
Anyways, that was my logic.
And you are entitled to yours by the way (and once again sorry for being on your behind liek crazy. Sometimes i forget this is a comic book forum and become too serious. Mea culpa). But that was my logic.
Anyways, here is the excerpt on the Hulk's strength.
Known superhuman powers: The Hulk possesses the capacity for nearly limitless physical strength. The gamma radiation that mutated the Hulk's body fortified his cellular structure and added, from some as yet unknown source, over 800 pounds of bone marrow and tissue to his body.
Previously, this mutation was not a stable one. The Hulk would periodically revert o the human form of Bruce Banner, losing the extra mass and energy to the same as yet unknown source from which he derived it. The process by which Banner transformed into the Hulk had a chemical catalyst, adrenalinc. As in normal humans, Banner's adrenal medulla secrets large amounts of adrenaline in times of fear, range, or stress, which hormonally stimulates the heartbeat rate, raises blood-sugar levels, and inhibits sensations of fatigue. Whereas this secretion simply heightens normal physical abilities in normal human beings, in Banner's case it triggered the complex chemical/ extra-physical process that transformed him into the Hulk. The total transformation took from 25 seconds to as long as 5 minutes, depending on the initial adrenaline surge which is determined by the original, external stimulus. Soon after the transformation, the amount of adrenaline in the Hulk would return to more normal, reduced levels. However, since Dr. Leonard Samson separated the Hulk and Banner into two discrete beings, Banner remains in human form and the Hulk remains in his superhuman mutated one.
In times of stress the Hulk's adrenaline level escalates, causing a corresponding escalation in strength. This is not accompanied by an additional gain in mass, but does appear to promote increased levels of energy efficiency. To date the Hulk has never apparently been provoked into demonstrating a maximum output of strength; hence, its upper limit remains a mystery.
In addition to great strength, the Hulk's body possesses a high degree of resistance to injury, pain, and disease. The Hulk's skin is capable of withstanding great heat without blistering (up to 3,000° Fahrenheit), great cold without freezing (down to -190° F), and great impacts (he can survive direct hits by field artillery cannon shells). It is possible to injure him: he could not, for example, survive a near-hit with a nuclear warhead. The Hulk's highly efficient physiology renders him immune to all terrestrial disease.
The Hulk can use his superhumanly strong leg muscles to leap great distances. The Hulk has been known to cover 3 miles in a single bound.
The Hulk has two powers apparently not related to his physical attributes, he can see astral forms, and he as a seemingly mystical homing ability that enables him to locate the area in New Mexico where he first became the Hulk. The nature of these abilities is not yet known.
That is from marveldirectory.com, a fansite. These sites are very innacurate, and unreliable. You continuously quote this site as if it were www.marvel.com; an official source. I asked when MARVEL said that "the upper limits of Hulk's strength are not known." They haven't. In the offical Marvel Encyclopedia: Incredible Hulk the writers say that for all intents and purposes, the Hulk's strength is limitless.
This is innacurate, as Hulk has been hit by nuclear warheads in the past, and has survived them, only slightly injured. His base strength is far above 70 tons; the Grey Hulk can lift more than that. Hulk's base strength is far above 100 tons. If Hulk sees that a planet is being hurled at him (however this is done,) Hulk would be able to lift it. The sheer adrenaline surge for fear of his life would allow him to lift it.
How strong is Superman Prime? Mind you, "stronger than Hulk," is not a number.
LoL, that response was funny.
>>>1) The Hulk vs normal Superman matches have always ended in a draw (in that Supes wins one, the Hulk won the other). Hence the Hulk and normal Supes are equal - with the exception that Superman starts higher, and the Hulk can become stronger than normal Supes with his rage induced strength.
Sooooooo the fights ended in a veritable draw because they were equal in strength? No -- so of course the rest of your analogy is faulty if your premise is.
>>>The thing is that the Hulk has fought normal Superman to a standstill. And if that is the case then how can he defeat a Superman that has been gaining strength for millenia?
It is an ARMWRESTLING match. The result of their battles has ZERO significance. Silver Surfer can reasonably augment his strength such that he would defeat Thor in an armwrestling match, but Thor ALWAYS whips Surfer in their comic battles.
>>>Here is his bio according to the Marvel Directory. In it you will see where they say that the Hulk 'possesses the capacity for nearly limitless physical strength.' Note: Nearly limitless is different from limitless.
Yes, and "nearly infinite" is DEFINITIVELY and THEORETICALLY different than "infinite," but in PRACTICE, it is not.
Anyway, here is the caveat that precedes that bio:
"Now that I am following the same layout that the TOHOTMU did a lot of the bios are old."<--------------
Hulk's base strength is NOT "far above 100 tons." If he was casually sauntering down the street (read: perfectly CALM), he could bench 100 tons at MINIMUM. What people fail to realize is that ANYTHING can immediately trigger an increase in one's heartrate, thus sending his strength level skyrocketing (and people ALSO fail to realize that NO ONE is aware of the exact anger: strength ratio, so it is perfectly logical to believe that it can only take seconds for him to "rage up."😉.
Good point Never.
Marvel says that Hulk can lift 100 tons at minimum. Therefore, His strength is above 100 tons.All I am saying is that whatever Superman Prime's strength is, Hulk could meet it, or exceed it, as Hulk's strength is near infinite, or limitless (infinity cannot be reached.) That is not implying that Hulk could beat Superman Prime in a fight. That is impossible.
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
If you don't believe me, go buy a Marvel Encyclopedia. Why would I lie on a comic book forum?
One, marvel encylopedias become outdated and are constantly changed and become unreliable within months of buying them, and two, because some people are hidden fanboys, and lie about things so well, it sounds true.
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
All I am saying is that whatever Superman Prime's strength is, Hulk could meet it, or exceed it, as Hulk's strength is near infinite, or limitless (infinity cannot be reached.) That is not implying that Hulk could beat Superman Prime in a fight. That is impossible.
ONCE AGAIN, I stress my weight arguement, The Hulk would have no time to even become angry to gain that strength, or should we go back to the fact hes not a battery, and doesnt NEED time to gain strength?
IRTMU THIS IS NOT A FIGHT. Superman wouldn't be trying to knock him out. Hulk does need a small amount of time to react to the stimulus (a fraction of a second), but he doesn't need an hour or two to get angry or get stronger.
Read my previous posts. If you "throw Jupiter at Hulk," He will be able to lift it just as he lifted the mountain, (he does raise himself with the mountain on his back.) He may need motivation to continue to lift this weight, but Hulk can lift any weight that he needs to.
Betty being raped is more than enough motivation to allow him to armwrestle Superman Prime.
Cosmic Cube,
Yes, all comic books are full of bs, but atleast with Superman
he has always been performing feats of unparalleled
strength. By contrast, with the Hulk, we hardly ever again
saw him preform anything close to this, atleast not on the same
consistent basis as Superman.
And can you please post the inside of that comic book, where
Reed asks Hulk about how he is able to keep the mountain
up?
But as I said, even if he did lift a mountain, that still
changes nothing, since Superman, unlike the Hulk, has been
performing similar feats on a regular basis. And that's normal
Superman!
But I want to address all this silliness about Hulk having potentially
unlimited strength because he can get angrier and angrier.
The fact is, no one can just keep getting angrier and angrier
forever. If Hulk saw Betty raped and killed, he would get plenty
mad, and plenty strong, but he's not going to keep getting
madder and madder forever. Just imagine for yourself the
worst thing that can happen to you, and how angry you would
get, now ask yourself, can you possibly get significantly madder
than that?
Furthermore, you forget that Hulk's anger isn't a magical
wish-granter. Just because he may get mad enough to, say,
want to shatter the Moon into pieces, doesn't mean he actually can.
Anger and hatred are just like love, they get you all worked up,
put all sorts of exaggerated thoughts and ideas into your head,
but they don't necessarily make you significantly smarter or
stronger, or give you the ability to make those ideas come true.
Originally posted by King Burger
But I want to address all this silliness about Hulk having potentially
unlimited strength because he can get angrier and angrier.
The fact is, no one can just keep getting angrier and angrier
forever. If Hulk saw Betty raped and killed, he would get plenty
mad, and plenty strong, but he's not going to keep getting
madder and madder forever. Just imagine for yourself the
worst thing that can happen to you, and how angry you would
get, now ask yourself, can you possibly get significantly madder
than that?
Furthermore, you forget that Hulk's anger isn't a magical
wish-granter. Just because he may get mad enough to, say,
want to shatter the Moon into pieces, doesn't mean he actually can.
Anger and hatred are just like love, they get you all worked up,
put all sorts of exaggerated thoughts and ideas into your head,
but they don't necessarily make you significantly smarter or
stronger, or give you the ability to make those ideas come true.
ONE, it is not ANGER, it is STRESS.
Two, AGAIN, do YOU know (or anyone else for that matter) in what proportion his strength increases to his ANGER? Do YOU know whether or not, for example, if he reaches his "breaking point" (think Wolverine's "berserker fury"😉 if his strength will just automatically continue to rise? No, you DON'T. NOBODY knows how precisely in what ration his stress levels increase his strength. YES, it is perfectly logical to conclude that he can lift NIGH anything (since they said that, FOR ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, his strength is VIRTUALLY limitless). So why assume that he CANNOT lift it?
And actually, Grey Hulk (the weakest of the much) already shattered an asteroid that was bigger than earth, so YES, it actually means that he CAN.
How these people debate these characters with little or no actual knowledge of what they have already accomplished is beyond me.
Hulk doesn't perform feats of strength on a regular basis? You mean like lifting commercial airplanes? And bending Adamantium? And throwing one of the infinity gems to the center of the planet? And destroying a planetoid almost twice the size of Earth with raw strength? Oh no, he doesn't do things like that. You don't read many Hulk comics, do you?
Why do I always have to argue this? Save your theories. There is no scientific explanation for Hulk's strength increase, ok? The writers have said "For all intents and purposes, Hulk's strength is limitless." You don't know how angry someone could get; anger grows exponentially. You don't know the Hulk's strength/anger ratio. You don't seem to know much about Hulk. You can only theorize. The fact is that his strength is limitless; thats the power that Marvel decided to give him. Don't like it?
Talk to Marvel.
Can you name one feat of strength Post-Crisis Superman or Superman Prime has done that is greater than Hulk's? When has Superman ever lifted 150 billion tons or more by himself. Name one time. Don't say moving the moon. The moon does not weigh more than 100 billion tons in space, with the absence of gravity, (you know, the force that makes lifting things kinda hard?) He had plenty of help as well.
Hulk could easily move or destroy the moon, or the Earth for that matter. He destroyed a planetoid twice the size of Earth. There's enough proof for you.
Eleveninches, Hulk is beyond the "conventional" dimensions of strength as well. Give a number damnit.