who is better, Vince Carter or Tracy Mcgrady?

Originally posted by Lord Evolution
Deep into the playoffs? They went to the second round that is in no way deep.

Why would you take Lebron in scoring? Tmac has already won two scoring titles.....

Lebron is not more clutch. Tmac has already proven himself to be very much clucth over the years, in every possible way. Game winners, game tiers, etc...and lets not forget the performance he put on vs SA, what was it 13 points in 59 secs, I dont remember what it was exactly.

Driving ability and finishing off drives is in the category of scoring, which Tmac is better than Lebron at.

It's already deeper than anywhere McGrady has been. And he took the Pistons to game 7, basically by himself.

You can't say that T-Mac is more clutch because he has more Game Winners, and tiers and everything else,... because he has been playing longer, so it is likely he will have more. Lebron also has a lot of game tiers, game winners, etc. And Lebron has done it where it counts, in the playoffs. McGrady hasn't.

I'll take Lebron in scoring because, in my opinion, Mcgrady has more "off" nights then he should. Not saying that he has a lot of them, but there is a better chance of Mcgrady having a bad game, then there is Lebron. McGrady's highest every PPG in his career is 32 PPG. Lebron's is 31.4. The most points Mcgrady has ever scored in one year is 2,407. The most Lebron has ever scored in one year is 2478. And Lebron is only going to get better,

Originally posted by DanZeke25
It's already deeper than anywhere McGrady has been. And he took the Pistons to game 7, basically by himself.

You can't say that T-Mac is more clutch because he has more Game Winners, and tiers and everything else,... because he has been playing longer, so it is likely he will have more. Lebron also has a lot of game tiers, game winners, etc. And Lebron has done it where it counts, in the playoffs. McGrady hasn't.

I'll take Lebron in scoring because, in my opinion, Mcgrady has more "off" nights then he should. Not saying that he has a lot of them, but there is a better chance of Mcgrady having a bad game, then there is Lebron. McGrady's highest every PPG in his career is 32 PPG. Lebron's is 31.4. The most points Mcgrady has ever scored in one year is 2,407. The most Lebron has ever scored in one year is 2478. And Lebron is only going to get better,

The whole "only going to get better" line is well...PISSING ME OFF!!!

Sorry I just hear it so much and it isnt really a fact its just an opinion.

Anyways 😎

Lebron has a better team right now than what Tmac had back in ORL, and when HOU went to the playoffs they played DAL a considerably better team than the Wizrds.

Plus Lebrons in the East(the 😆 conference)

Mcgrady's playing in a much tougher conference and division

Didnt Mcgrady score 63 in a game? He's an overall better scorer, and until Lebron wins a scoring title or does something in a season so amazing that you have no other choice but to say hes a better scorer, Tmac is better.

Heres my top 3 scorers

1. Kobe
2. Iverson
3. Tmac

Originally posted by Lord Evolution
The whole "only going to get better" line is well...[B]PISSING ME OFF!!!

Sorry I just hear it so much and it isnt really a fact its just an opinion.

Anyways 😎

Lebron has a better team right now than what Tmac had back in ORL, and when HOU went to the playoffs they played DAL a considerably better team than the Wizrds.

Plus Lebrons in the East(the 😆 conference)

Mcgrady's playing in a much tougher conference and division

Didnt Mcgrady score 63 in a game? He's an overall better scorer, and until Lebron wins a scoring title or does something in a season so amazing that you have no other choice but to say hes a better scorer, Tmac is better.

Heres my top 3 scorers

1. Kobe
2. Iverson
3. Tmac [/B]

Lebron is going to get better... BUT, Lebron is already the best player in the NBA he proved it against the Spurs last night. Top Scorers.. ok i'll give you Kobe, but he takes a buttload of shots. Iverson, i love his heart and never quit attitude but he takes more shots than Kobe does, which is really hard to do. Tmac ok i see why you say Tmac, but stop being so biased. Just because Lebron is the "future" doesn't mean he can't be the present as well. 100 percent guarantee than Lebron leads the league in scoring this year and wins his first MVP. He will end up averaging 30+ points a game 8 rebounds and 7 assists. Which is downright sick. Tmac had a better team last year than Lebron did, and where were the Rockets.. oh yea, out of the playoff's.

Tmac played in 47 games last year, and was pretty much injured in all of them. Still some how made the all star game, and I believe he was the West's leading vote getter behind Yao. 😕

Lebron isn't the best player in the NBA, and please lets not get into this I want to argue about Tmac and Lebron.

Lebron is the future blah blah blah we dont know that, but as of right now he's IMO the 3rd best player in the NBA. Behind Kobe and Tmac. Iverson is a much better scorer than Lebron, he's up there with Kobe and that's is very rare.

Tmac makes crunch time FT's, Lebron isnt at all reliable in that category, and Tmac has a better ability to take over a game when needed to. Right now hes deferring to Yao, but he can get to the basket any time he wants to, but he knows that the best way to win is through Yao.

What are you basing your best player in the NBA on? Tmac was injured last year, big surprise. i bet he will be injured again this year, he's injury prone. His back has always been a problem for him so i just don't think he can overcome that at this point in his career. Whereas, Lebron is young, uninjured and a complete player. Tmac is a great scorer, not the best of passers, and can't finish the way Lebron can. Lebron finished 4 tough layups last night with his left hand. I'd like to see Tmac put up a performance like Lebron had last night against the Spurs.

Again, what are you basing best player on? Cuz i don't get it.

Im basing my best players on offense/defense, and of course Kobe tops that list easily, but if I was going off all around players then KG would be #2 behind Kobe.

Kobe is definately a valid #1. IMO the only thing keeping Lebron from being considered the best player in the league by a widespread group is his defense, until he adds great defense to his repitoure i guess Kobe has to get the crown. Lebron has to be a close third behind KG. Keep in mind, all of these players are straight out of high school players.

Yeah I know it's weird to, that the best players in the NBA are straight from high school.

Kobe, Tmac, Lebron, KG, Amare, Howard(ORL), and these are just off the top of my head, there's a lot more.

i made the list you asked for, i can't remember in which thread though, there were like 25 total i think

I want to ask this.

Say there was a draft with every NBA player. You have the very first pick, who do you choose?

For me, it is an extremley easy answer, Lebron or Wade. Not only are they 2 of the best players in the league, they WILL only get better, and they will dominate for longer. This is a small part on what I base the best player on.

IMO, you don't even need to use the "only going to get better" line. LeBron is better, this is being objective. Taking away last year, T-Mac's injury year and looking at the 04-05 season, LeBron has averaged better stats. T-mac averaged a few more points than LeBron, but LeBron topped him in rebounds, assists, FG %, and 3 Point FG %. They were about even in steals and blocks, and T-mac beat him in FT %, but overall, LeBron was better, and now, there is no argument that he is better, even with T-mac's injury.

There is no argument that he is better?

Of course there is silly

Plain and simple Tmac is a much better scorer and until Lebron does something Tmac hasn't in the scoring department, you absoulutely have to say Tmac is better.

And the whole "Lebron is only going to get better" line is so damn retarded, you do realize that's only an opinion, but you keep stating it like its a fact or its so clearly bound to happen. Which it isnt.

It isn't a fact, I never said it was fact, but it's probable that it will happen, because it usually takes more than 3 years for a player to reach his peak. You can't rely on it, but you also can't shun it.

Besides, that wasn't my point. I showed you some stats as to how LeBron is better comparing their 04-05 seasons (T-mac's injury free season in Houston), and it came out that LeBron came out on top overall. If you're only comparing their scoring, T-mac wins, but this is who's better overall, and in my opinion, Lebron is. I respect your opinion, I'm not denying it. But we just don't agree with each other on this one, that's all.

Originally posted by Lord Evolution
There is no argument that he is better?

Of course there is silly

Plain and simple Tmac is a much better scorer and until Lebron does something Tmac hasn't in the scoring department, you absoulutely have to say Tmac is better.

And the whole "Lebron is only going to get better" line is so damn retarded, you do realize that's only an opinion, but you keep stating it like its a fact or its so clearly bound to happen. Which it isnt.

It is called developement. Young players get better. That is how it works. Lebron will learn different ways to play by gaining expierence, which will make him better. The only way to stop that is if he gets injured. It's not like I am picking a random young player, and saying "He will only get better." It's Lebron James, and he WILL get better, enough said.

Dwyane Wade will also get better. Dwight Howard will get better. Chris Bosh, Chris Paul, Randy Foye, Jameer Nelson, will ALL get better if they stay healthy. And that is just to name a few.

Originally posted by DanZeke25
It is called developement. Young players get better. That is how it works. Lebron will learn different ways to play by gaining expierence, which will make him better. The only way to stop that is if he gets injured. It's not like I am picking a random young player, and saying "He will only get better." It's Lebron James, and he WILL get better, enough said.

Dwyane Wade will also get better. Dwight Howard will get better. Chris Bosh, Chris Paul, Randy Foye, Jameer Nelson, will ALL get better if they stay healthy. And that is just to name a few.

Of course your going to take the young player if you're choosing in a draft, that's because you are looking in the future, and that's is no way to determine who the better player is, we arent living in the future, were living in the present, and presently Kobe and Tmac are better players than Lebron.

And what makes you think these players will get better? What makes you think they havent reached their pinnacle yet? Lebron and Wade are playing at a very high level right now.

I'd take LeBron first if their was a draft for 1 season only.

Originally posted by Lord Evolution
Of course your going to take the young player if you're choosing in a draft, that's because you are looking in the future, and that's is no way to determine who the better player is, we arent living in the future, were living in the present, and presently Kobe and Tmac are better players than Lebron.

And what makes you think these players will get better? What makes you think they havent reached their pinnacle yet? Lebron and Wade are playing at a very high level right now.

Presently, T-Mac has been getting injured a lot, so he can't be better than Lebron presently.

Originally posted by Lord Evolution
Of course your going to take the young player if you're choosing in a draft, that's because you are looking in the future, and that's is no way to determine who the better player is, we arent living in the future, were living in the present, and presently Kobe and Tmac are better players than Lebron.

And what makes you think these players will get better? What makes you think they havent reached their pinnacle yet? Lebron and Wade are playing at a very high level right now.

Even if Lebron DOESN'T get any better. By statistical analysis, athletic ability, and the intangibles ( leadership, getting his team involved{passing, unselfishness}, clutchness), Lebron has to hold the edge over T-mac, and just barely takes a back seat to Kobe.

Kobe is just far to clutch not to mention it, but Lebron hit some big shots last season too.

i'll give kobe the number 1 spot.. just because he's that good.

but lets look at the stats between T-Mac and Lebron.

Lebrons best statistical season was 04-05 in which he averaged 27 ppg 7.4 rpg 7.2 apg and 2.2 spg.Mcrady's best statistical season was 01-02 in which he average 25.6 ppg 8 rpg 5.3 apg and 1.6 spg

Best Season : Lebron ( more assists, more points, nearly same rebounds, more steals)

Both have average over 30 ppg once in their career. Mcrady (32.1) in 02-03(6th year in the league) and Lebron 31.4 in 05-06(3rd year in the league) Career averages Lebron 26.5, T-mac 22.1 ( Mcrady didn't start till his fourth season) WITHOUT his first 3 seasons.. mcrady averages 25.5 ppg

Scoring : Push

T-mac has never averaged more than 6 apg in a single season, Lebron has done it all three years he's been in the league, and Lebron has made some crazy nonsensical pass's that just shouldn't be possible..

Passing : Lebron

T-mac has never averaged more than 7 rpg but has consistently averaged 6+ rpg throughout his career, with the only season he didn't being last year( he was injured) Lebron has averaged 7 or more twice in his career. Career averages- Lebron 6.7 rpg T-mac 6.4 rpg.

Rebounding : Push

Lebron has a career average of 1.8 spg with is best year being 04-05 ( 2.2 spg) Mcrady has a career average of 1.4 spg with ihs best year being 03-04 (1.7 spg). Blocks Mcrady 1.0 bpg Lebron .9 bpg

Defense : Push

Athletic Ability- Lebron 6'8" 240lbs Mcrady 6'8" 223lbs, both extremely agile, but edge should go to Lebron because Mcrady's back isn't what it used to be. Mcrady is still insane though.

Athletic Ability : Push

Mcrady has been in the league 10 years, Lebron 3 years. Mcrady has proved himself to be able to put up number year in and year out. Well, over the last 7 years while he was a starter anyways...

Longevity : T-Mac... obviously

Lebron has played in one postseason.. in which he led his team to 7 wins.. going 7-6 and taking the pistons to a game 7 in the eastern conference quarterfinal. Tracy Mcgrady has played in 6 postseasons and has never made it out of the first round, including being swept his first 3 appearances. his record is 5-20.

Playoffs : Lebron

Lebron is unquestionably a better leader than Mcgrady

Leadership : Lebron

Lebron made some key game-winning shots down the stretch last year and in the playoffs, along with some key performances in the playoffs. therefore...

Clutch : Lebron

Overall: Lebron is the hands down winner, although they are very similar in some key categories, Lebron is a better player than TMac is at this point.

Also, Mcrady has never finished a full season, and has missed alot of time from injury. The most games Lebron has missed in a season is 3. Mcrady has never played in more than 77 out of 82 games.

This season so far... Lebron 26 ppg 9.7 rpg 5.5 apg Mcrady 16 ppg 5 rpg 6 apg..

This season : Lebron

wow i didn't realize i wrote that much

Nice job. Although, IMO those aren't their best statistical seasons, it still drives a good argument.