Originally posted by Evil Dead
I dislike all religion in general. Not their beliefs, simply their existence. I do however bash Christianity more so than others. I do this because Christianity is the one religion I am bombarded with on a daily basis. If I were to live in the mid-east, I'm sure Islam would bare the brunt of my discontent.I dislike all religion because I find them unnecessary. Ideas and beliefs are good for people to have but there is no reason for millions of those who share similar ideas and beliefs to get together and form gangs. A man can choose to believe in and honor any god he sees fit. I have no problem with that. That promotes internal thought and character growth for that man. Would that same man not feel just as loyal to his beliefs if he were the only man on earth who had those beliefs? Would he not choose to live by the word of his chosen god if he were not surrounded by others who share in worship of the same god? If he truly believes what he claims, he would. Therefore an actual religion devoted to worship of his god or beliefs is moot, unnecessary. It serves no good purpose. The very fact that religions have evolved and consist of millions of individuals suggests to me that personal growth and worship for each individual is not the primary goal. It appears to me that the reason for all those who believe similar beliefs to congregate in one place at one time is for two purposes.
1. Maintain the flock. All these true believers gather together to make sure other members are acting in accord to the religion's belief system. If a member starts to wander....starts to change his ideas....starts to believe less in the religion it is the purpose of every other member to "council" him, to lead him back to the life set in their religious doctrine. Instead of promoting personal growth of ideas and beliefs, the religion is there to do the exact opposite. It exists to surround an individual with millions of others who are expected to show that individual the errors of his ways, confining him to the beliefs set in accord by religious doctrine. It's a prison for the mind. All members keep an eye on all other members to ensure no free thinking can occur.
2. Strength in numbers. A man can live in solitude his entire life with nothing more than a bible and his mind and be the most devout Christian to ever walk the earth. That is a noble man. He cares not if others do not believe the same as him. He knows what he believes, he knows his god and knows he is serving his god. Religions, however, are not comprised of such devout individuals. Most Christians defy the beliefs of the religion on a daily basis. Some are alcoholics, some are drug addicts, some even break commandments......such as Jim Baker, who devoted his entire life to preaching the word of his god. For those less devout members, the sheer numbers of the religion help to maintain their belief that what they are doing is right and all others must be wrong by default. It's all about reassurance, something no person who is truly devout to any belief would need or want.
Religion is all about reassurance. When you start to doubt your beliefs or form new ones there will always be millions of people there to sit you down and set you straight......to let you know that their chosen religion is correct. If confining personal growth of ideas and beliefs of individuals wasn't bad enough, there is also a deadly side affect. While all this "we're right" reassuring is going on, they are also proclaiming any who don't share the same beliefs to be wrong.....which causes a superiority complex to arise. I can tell you now that I am not a Christian. That does not mean I need to be saved. It simply means I do not share your beliefs. Christians can read their bible all they want.....I've read it many times myself, it's a good book. It makes them no better than I. Perhaps I am not the one who needs to be saved.
Alot of my problems with Christianity are those present in all religions/cults. I'm not well versed on many religions other than Christianity so I do not know which are universal and which are unique to the Christians. Here's a short list off the top of my head.
1. You believe ideas and beliefs that are not your own. You did not come to your current conclusions of life, god and purpose on your own. They were dictated to you be someone else. You, being a follower, listened and decided , "yeah...that sounds like it could be true". You live your life based on a millenia+ old religious system that was dreamt up in other's heads.......and you never even met these people. I would be horrified to think that if I wrote my ideas and beliefs about life and purpose down that 1,000 years later millions of people would be living their lives based on MY beliefs......conclusions I personally came to while pondering existence.
2. You believe in a book that is laughable at best. The compilation of texts occured long ago, before much about our natural world was known. As each year passes and knew discoveries are made you choose to ignore the impact it has on the book's validity. Adding all time together as recorded by the Bible, the earth is merely a little over 6,000 years old. Why? Because those who dreamt up the stories had no clue as to the actual age of our planet. The only species to survive the great flood which covered the planet were those Noah had on his ark. How many millions of insect species are there alone? How did Noah collect specimens that are only indiginous to the Americas when the Americas themself were not known? Why did god creat Adam and Eve, the first two Homo Sapiens? What about the other 13 or so known species of human ancestors, where are they in the bible? What about the Dinosaurs who ruled earth far longer than we humans have? I missed the verses on them. I could go on like this forever. Every question I've asked is easily answered. The reason the bible contains such a vast quantitiy of things we know today to be untrue is simply that the writers of the bible, those who made the stories up, did not know about such things. They did not have the resource material to base their stories on. That's the problem with the bible. If it truly was a text written by god, dictated to man to record it would include such things as a god would know about all of the above mentioned and include them in his dictation. Since it is simply a collection of books written by common, every day story tellers who had no access to the information we have today, it doesn't. The bible and everything in it comes from the mind of man, not god.
3. Brainwashing. You raise your children to believe what you believe. You don't say, "well, honey...me and your daddy believe ______". You say, "well honey, _____ is fact". Children listen to their parents in their early years. It is the primary inlet for information about the world around them. They don't believe in Santa Clause because they truly believe that a fat guy MUST travel the world giving presents to children. They believe in Santa Clause because you tell them a fat man travels the world giving presents to children. Same with god. The only difference is that as children get older and start to doubt Santa Clause based on the physically impossible feats he is supposed to accomplish, you let them. You finally give up and admit to them he does not exist. With god on the other hand you never let their doubt grow. As a good Christian it is at that point your duty to shepherd them back to the flock, to show them the errors of their thinking.
4. Pick and Choose. You base your life on a religion, and religion on a book. You pick and choose which parts of the book are physical fact and which parts are merely tales, translatable. You know it's absurd to believe that a man could be swallowed alive by a fish and survive for days inside. You call this a morality tale. In the same breath you will say that Jesus of Nazereth is physical fact, despite the equally absurdness of the tale. You admit a man can't live inside of a fish but won't admit that a man can not walk on water......or turn water into wine. Why do you not proclaim the Jesus story as merely a morality tale? It's a much better one.
There are many more but I'm tired of typing.
Originally posted by Ou Be Low hoo
I haven't had an extreme experience of self-righteousness with Jews and Muslims, as I have had with the ol' Xian fraternity...I'm just talking about personal experience here...not what you see in the media.
My appologies OBLh - I asked in the first post a personal opinion, not a general one, I guess thats what you gave me, so..thanks.
Originally posted by DCLXVI
Many members are prejudiced against Judaism and Islam, though perhaps not openly....BTW> I must have been on crack that night, I meant "Bilb". 😉
I see. Thanks again.
As for general - I just donn't think being prejudice against anyone is a good way of fighting them...Im thinking perhaps education?
If we discriminate and are nasty towards them, then we're in theory acting like all of them, no?
It does all depend - I learned of the religion in America - i just never assumed it was so strong and that fundamental.
Re: Immense dislike of Christians / Christianity!
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
I myself am not a Christian, but I cannot help but wonder as to why there is such an immense prejudice against Christians only.If anyone could possibly explain to me, as to why is Christianity is worse than Islam or Judaism in its ideas, then I would be most grateful.
Most of you who preach tolerance and the fact that there should be no discrimination are the very same people who constantly discriminate and trash Christians - so you're doing the very same thing you're condemning the Christians for. Whys that?
If you are blatantly against organized religion than that does indeed include Judaism and Islam, yet everyone is directly referencing to Christianity. Does, somehow the fact that you are surrounded by Christians give you a Christan-bash-free card? It really doesnt.
So I would like to know, why?
All input welcome.
Shuttup you cross worshiper! tongue10
If you love Jesus so much why dont you marry him!?!? schmoll
And dont even think about wearing white down the aisle! diva
Makes you look fat and clashes with those dark rings around your eyes and....I cant remember the other reason! naughty
Damn I'm hot! diva
Take notes doll! winkiss
......
I hate Christians so much because their beliefs directly affect my everyday life. It's really hard seeing as I live in The United States of Jesusland and my president is a born again evangelical Christian nut job who's driving my country back 200 years. The bible is the new constitution.
Jews and Muslims I dont agree with either but there's not many of them in the US so I cant be bothered hating them. Hating Christians is a lot of hard work doll! I need several spa pampering treatments to recuperate! eyes
Re: Re: Immense dislike of Christians / Christianity!
Originally posted by Tex
Shuttup you cross worshiper! tongue10
If you love Jesus so much why dont you marry him!?!? schmoll
And dont even think about wearing white down the aisle! diva
Makes you look fat and clashes with those dark rings around your eyes and....I cant remember the other reason! naughtyDamn I'm hot! diva
Take notes doll! winkiss......
I hate Christians so much because their beliefs directly affect my everyday life. It's really hard seeing as I live in The United States of Jesusland and my president is a born again evangelical Christian nut job who's driving my country back 200 years. The bible is the new constitution.
Jews and Muslims I dont agree with either but there's not many of them in the US so I cant be bothered hating them. Hating Christians is a lot of hard work doll! I need several spa pampering treatments to recuperate! eyes
A spot on dead accurate example of whats wrong with the world today. Thanks for volunteering for being the poster child of baseless hate & bigotry..
It's most certainly not baseless. Need I remind you of the tens of thousands of murdered innocent who were killed in the name of your lord?
Or the hate and bigotry that is the foundation of your church?
Or its archaic stance on sexuality, gender and science and common reason?
Christianity is the greatest threat to the social and technological advancement of the United States.
Christians are a disease of ignorance and bigotry whose refusal to acknowledge science and history in favor of their bible will only continue to propel a message of hate, oppression, sexism, homophobia, prejudice and racism.
I hate their beliefs and their unwillingness to educate themselves.
Re: Re: Re: Immense dislike of Christians / Christianity!
Originally posted by bilb
A spot on dead accurate example of whats wrong with the world today. Thanks for volunteering for being the poster child of baseless hate & bigotry..
He's giving valid reasons for his feelings and beliefs, he's shown they aren't baseless hate or bigotry, moreso, his reasons are pretty accurate (though generalized) for believing what he does. At least he's telling us why he thinks a certain way, which is more then this last post of yours has done.
Originally posted by Tex
It's most certainly not baseless. Need I remind you of the tens of thousands of murdered innocent who were killed in the name of your lord?Or the hate and bigotry that is the foundation of your church?
Or its archaic stance on sexuality, gender and science and common reason?
Christianity is the greatest threat to the social and technological advancement of the United States.
Christians are a disease of ignorance and bigotry whose refusal to acknowledge science and history in favor of their bible will only continue to propel a message of hate, oppression, sexism, homophobia, prejudice and racism.
I hate their beliefs and their unwillingness to educate themselves.
Tex, you are doing the same thing you are condemning those people for. And by your reply here, your approach is no better than theirs - its filled with hate and prejudice.
And to fight hate and prejudice is not to hate and discriminate, its to educate.
Here is a short list of people who thought they can make the world better place by ''getting rid'' of people they didn't like -
[list]Adolf Hitler
Joseph Stalin
Mao Tse-tung
Pol Pot
Ayatollah Khomeini[/list]
They all thought a certain group of people were a disease on the world.
Originally posted by Tex
It's most certainly not baseless. Need I remind you of the tens of thousands of murdered innocent who were killed in the name of your lord?Or the hate and bigotry that is the foundation of your church?
Or its archaic stance on sexuality, gender and science and common reason?
Christianity is the greatest threat to the social and technological advancement of the United States.
Christians are a disease of ignorance and bigotry whose refusal to acknowledge science and history in favor of their bible will only continue to propel a message of hate, oppression, sexism, homophobia, prejudice and racism.
I hate their beliefs and their unwillingness to educate themselves.
Ok line by line here..
Thousands of people have been killed in the name of all kinds of dieties & political reasons, Chrisitianity is not unique in this aspect.
My religion is based on love and grace and embraces all, regardless of any and all differences in humankind.
Stances on sexuality, science & 'common knowledge' chnge throughout all socities in direct correlation to events that affect ists people. Simply because teh church often upholds its views is not a negative, it simply means we have principles, which last time I checked was a measure of integrity.
Social and technological advancement? err, I think not. Better give an example on this one because from where I sit that is totally baselss.
I am not an gnorant or bigoted person, but i do recognize that there are alot of them in the Christian faith, That does not mean it is rampant. It does seem to be the case here tho seeing as how you a) dont seem top know anyothing about Chrisitanity except that you hate it and b) YOU are bigoted against Christians.. so pot, meet kettle.
Sounds like I have educatred myself far more with much better results than you in which case you're entire areguemnt is baseless and anecdotal at best.. and hatefilled and ignorant at worst..
"Thousands of people have been killed in the name of all kinds of dieties & political reasons, Chrisitianity is not unique in this aspect."
No, it's not unique, which just says that people were killed in the name of the christian god, at least you're not denying it.
"My religion is based on love and grace and embraces all, regardless of any and all differences in humankind."
That's what it should be, however, it's not the case most of the time. Many christians are judgemental over other people for their beliefs, sexuality or occupation, often, more judgemental then non christians are of others.
"Stances on sexuality, science & 'common knowledge' chnge throughout all socities in direct correlation to events that affect ists people. Simply because teh church often upholds its views is not a negative, it simply means we have principles, which last time I checked was a measure of integrity. "
It is a negative when it refuses to acknowledge new facts and theories that go against it's "teachings". Staying true to your beliefs and being stubborn is not a good thing, as society changes, beliefs also need to change to become valid and relevant to the current timeframe. Christianity does not do this (see their outdated and prejudice stance on homosexuality for proof of this).
There are other groups of people who have stayed true to their beliefs, no matter how outdated they become to society, such as the KKK and skinheads. Both hold ideals that they've had for years, doesn't make them right, or moral.
Originally posted by BackFire
Of course, Tex isn't saying "kill all christians" or anything violent like that. He's giving accurate examples of what's wrong with much of them.It's not Tex's, nor anyone elses responsibility to educate these people.
So ultimately what you're saying here? Its noones responsibility to educate them, but this is whats wrong with them, and we hate them. They are disease and ultimately need to be got rid of...if that is not whats being said, then please explain what is being said?
Calling a group of people ''disease'' on society is not talking what is wrong with him - that is already preaching of hate and prejudice.
Hitler hated Jews - he hated everything about them and their beliefs. Ayatollah Khomeini hated Americans and everyhting about them and their beliefs...those were just nuts enough to act on their hate.
Hate, ignorance and greed are the biggest problems in our society - and if you think that to fight hate is to hate back, then you are sadly mistaken - hate only brings more hate, and more suffering.
Are you saying that only Christians are homophobic? Are you saying that only Christians ever killed in the nameof god? If so, then you are missinformed. The reality is much different. And generalisation is dangerous.
Originally posted by BackFire
"Thousands of people have been killed in the name of all kinds of dieties & political reasons, Chrisitianity is not unique in this aspect."No, it's not unique, which just says that people were killed in the name of the christian god, at least you're not denying it.
"My religion is based on love and grace and embraces all, regardless of any and all differences in humankind."
That's what it should be, however, it's not the case most of the time. Many christians are judgemental over other people for their beliefs, sexuality or occupation, often, more judgemental then non christians are of others.
"Stances on sexuality, science & 'common knowledge' chnge throughout all socities in direct correlation to events that affect ists people. Simply because teh church often upholds its views is not a negative, it simply means we have principles, which last time I checked was a measure of integrity. "
It is a negative when it refuses to acknowledge new facts and theories that go against it's "teachings". Staying true to your beliefs and being stubborn is not a good thing, as society changes, beliefs also need to change to become valid and relevant to the current timeframe. Christianity does not do this (see their outdated and prejudice stance on homosexuality for proof of this).
There are other groups of people who have stayed true to their beliefs, no matter how outdated they become to society, such as the KKK and skinheads. Both hold ideals that they've had for years, doesn't make them right, or moral.
you are right, I dont deny in the least that horrible atrocities have been commited in the name of God, which is inexcusable to me as it is not what my faith is about. But I aslo believe in forgiveness and therin lies even more beauty IMO.
Yes, i understand that some things need to be flexible, but as far as what consitutes a change in theology is not toally deoendent on science IMO. Science is not a perfect art, theories are proven and disproven all the time which reinforces the need for a static stance on some issues. That does not mean that I persoanlly believe in al that the church preaches but I do respect their integrity in not bowing to pressure on social issues.
And also yes, groups like the KKK are extremely dangersous because they are zealots, which is also not unique to Christinaity.
My point is that every reason you guys give for disliking Christians is applicable to all religious & social groups. To single out Christians is bigoted. And further, MOST Christians do believe in tolerance, forgiveness and love for all humankind.. how is that a bad thing?
My point is that every reason you guys give for disliking Christians is applicable to all religious & social groups. To single out Christians is bigoted. And further, MOST Christians do believe in tolerance, forgiveness and love for all humankind.. how is that a bad thing?
Because they don't preach what they claim too most of the time.
Every reason people give IS applicable to every religion for the most part, the problem is it happens in christianity more then it does in other religions. Like, it's almost always christians picketing against gay marriage, it's almost always christians complaining about violent movies/videogames, it's almost always christians complaining about taking the 10 commandments out of government buildings. They do the things people complain about much more often then others do.
Yes, i understand that some things need to be flexible, but as far as what consitutes a change in theology is not toally deoendent on science IMO. Science is not a perfect art, theories are proven and disproven all the time which reinforces the need for a static stance on some issues. That does not mean that I persoanlly believe in al that the church preaches but I do respect their integrity in not bowing to pressure on social issues.
It's dangerous to ignore everything outside of a fictional book, which is what christianity does.
Are you saying that only Christians are homophobic? Are you saying that only Christians ever killed in the nameof god? If so, then you are missinformed. The reality is much different. And generalisation is dangerous.
No, I'm not saying that, but they do commit those acts more often then other people do, THAT's what I'm saying, nothing more.
So ultimately what you're saying here? Its noones responsibility to educate them, but this is whats wrong with them, and we hate them. They are disease and ultimately need to be got rid of...if that is not whats being said, then please explain what is being said?
No one said they need to be gotten rid of, Tex merely used the metaphor of "disease", meaning that they are dangerous, in his opinion, to the greater good of humanity. It's not like he's going to say they should all be killed or something. However, it is NOT my obligation (or anyone elses)to educate them in any way, they choose to believe what they believe, and most of them are far to stubborn to be persuaded otherwise by "educating" them. Why waste time trying to show them why they are wrong if they will never admit it? We've seen it happen in the numerous threads about gay marriage and gay equality, people will come in with all sorts of valid reasoning as to why gay marriage should be allowed, and a christian will come in and say "well the bible says this so this is right", and that's that.
Calling a group of people ''disease'' on society is not talking what is wrong with him - that is already preaching of hate and prejudice.
Sure, if that's all that was said, but that's not the case, he also gave very valid reasons as to why he feels the way he does prior to calling them a disease.
People are converting from Christianity, or are becoming less...fundamentalist, so something is happening, thats for sure. I had a huge argument with a Christian on this boards yesterday and it was kinda suprising the comments I got - but i know that there are others who are not like that, such as Bilb here.
To group her, with the fundamentalist religious weirdos, would be just wrong.
I don't hate them - I feel compassion and sorrow because thy will spend their whole lives taking the bible literaly and some will even doubt it, yet continue to believe it because of fear of hell.
I cannot think of anyting worse then living your life in fear.