Capt America vs Daredevil

Originally posted by Alfheim
Anyway like I said just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it, like I said Cap has been able to fool Spiderman's sense

Cap being able to fool Spider-Man's spider-sense really doesn't mean anything. DD's radar sense doesn't work the same way, besides DD has also fooled Spider-Man's spider-sense. And the whole skill argument doesn't really hold water here. You say Cap's skill make up lack of speed. Only works if the opponent he faces has no skills. You can use that Spider-Man example all you want but point is Spider-Man was not at full potential and he has punked Cap before so we know he can take him. Wolverine didn't mention his name in greatest martial artists? I wasn't aware what Wolverine said was law these days. Did Wolverine mention Stick or the Cat by any chance? I hope he at least mentioned Iron Fist in there.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Sorry he has his radar sense but it just aint good enough.

Its already been proven to be good enough

Cap owns daredevil and sends his blind ass to hell.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Were not talking about. Skill can compensate for speed, like I said Punisher is much slower than DD but was still able to tag him a couple of times. The Punisher has even punked Nightcrawler. Cap is slower than Spiderman but cos his fighting skills are so good he can tag Spiderman loads of times up close. In fact Cap is so good that Spdierman has said that he cannot take him in H2H, therefore DD would have more trouble with Cap...do the math.

Sure Punisher can touch him, he's a good fighter. Lets not act like he is. But I hope you read the Daredevil arc we he became kingpin and he took down Frank like he was an 11 yr old schoolgirl. All in the senses. Cap can tag SPider-Man loads of times up close? Maybe he can do it against a Spider-Man whose holding back, worships him and doubts he's made the right decision about what side he's on but against a Spider-man thats really trying. And how conveniently you forget Cap only landed one punch against Spider-Man in the background of CW 3 even though Spider-Man was taking on multiple opponents. Your math is also wrong. DD has fought Spider-Man before and Spider-Man has made the same remark about his skills ans senses making up for his powers yet later we see Spider-Man embarras him. By your math since Spider-Man says both of them can take him cause of their skills yet he's punked both of them shouldn't they be around the same level?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes it does , the point is that Sticlk is such a good fighter that DD'senses wont be enough

No, point is even though DD isn't the greatest in pure fighting his senses more than make up

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok...but they didnt help him against Wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter than him and all of the above.

Actually they did help against Wolverine. He didn't beat Wolverine in enemy of the state but he did hold his own. Wolverine did have in a full nelson in one issue but he also beat Cap in Origins a while ago. Flawed logic on your part

Originally posted by marvelprince
And how conveniently you forget Cap only landed one punch against Spider-Man in the background of CW 3 even though Spider-Man was taking on multiple opponents.

I didn't coneniently forget anything if anything thats what you do im still reeling from that "apparently human intelligence is unlimited" from spidey vs cap thread. I can give you several other examples that negate that example but I cant be bothered.

Originally posted by marvelprince

Your math is also wrong. DD has fought Spider-Man before and Spider-Man has made the same remark about his skills ans senses making up for his powers yet later we see Spider-Man embarras him. By your math since Spider-Man says both of them can take him cause of their skills yet he's punked both of them shouldn't they be around the same level?

I think they are but Cap is slightly better. I looked at the DD respect thread very impressive.

Originally posted by marvelprince

No, point is even though DD isn't the greatest in pure fighting his senses more than make up

You could say that.

Originally posted by marvelprince

Actually they did help against Wolverine. He didn't beat Wolverine in enemy of the state but he did hold his own. Wolverine did have in a full nelson in one issue but he also beat Cap in Origins a while ago. Flawed logic on your part

To tell you the truth I would not have a problem with DD being a better martial artist than Wolverine, Wolverine gets on my nerves. I dont know how the **** he gets a fighting skill of 7. 200 years old my *** he still sux.

Well obvously you have read more comics than me, but the problem with pulling examples they always seem to contradict each other. I had a look at the DD thread and I can see where you coming from, Cap may still be a better fighter because he does seem to come up against tougher opponents, that is probably why DD was not in Secret Wars. There is an example of DD fighting Mr Hyde and DD takes him down, but the way Cap does it is more final.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
The hell? Is Daredevil retarded now? Why would he, Daredevil, one of the best martial artists around, knowingly (or hell, even unknowlingly) punch Cap's shield? He'd have plenty of time to stop his fist if the shield was in the way.

And I'd say DD might be just a tad faster, too.

Anyway, I digress from my main point.

DD wins 6/10. By no means is this an easy fight.

DD has punched Cap's shield before. Its not that DD is stupid its that Cap is good enough to do that to him.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I didn't coneniently forget anything if anything thats what you do im still reeling from that "apparently human intelligence is unlimited" from spidey vs cap thread. I can give you several other examples that negate that example but I cant be bothered.

Its still not a hard concept to grasp. In the MU the bar for human potential is set higher than in the real world. So it makes sense the way Tony, Doom and Reed are so much smarter than the other folk. Remember in the MU ordinary persons can build rocket skateboards and make suits that let them climb walls etc.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I think they are but Cap is slightly better. I looked at the DD respect thread very impressive.

I don't dispute that. In most physical aspects Cap is superior to Matt

Originally posted by Alfheim
To tell you the truth I would not have a problem with DD being a better martial artist than Wolverine, Wolverine gets on my nerves. I dont know how the **** he gets a fighting skill of 7. 200 years old my *** he still sux.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well obvously you have read more comics than me, but the problem with pulling examples they always seem to contradict each other. I had a look at the DD thread and I can see where you coming from, Cap may still be a better fighter because he does seem to come up against tougher opponents, that is probably why DD was not in Secret Wars. There is an example of DD fighting Mr Hyde and DD takes him down, but the way Cap does it is more final.

This is my point. We can't just take what characters say at face value. At practically every point in a characters history they're guarunteed at some point to say "I'm no match for (insert name here)" but then later beat said person in a fight. Couple that with the fact that when they actually do fight the fights are almost always inconclusive and their usually is some outside influences affecting ones performance. This is why we have to try and look at every in general and decide for ourselves how things are gonna happen. Its where the fun is.

And DD was in Bendis's Secret War (I know this isn't the one you meant but I felt I should plug it since it was great read)

Originally posted by Alfheim
DD has punched Cap's shield before. Its not that DD is stupid its that Cap is good enough to do that to him.

Agree here too, to an extent. DD goes for the punch and Cap can block. DD doesn't land all of his hits but he's certainly not gonna be punching shield most of the fight

Captain America more experience and superior fighting ability

Originally posted by Accel
He's able to tell where guys with guns are aiming so a punch should be simple in comparison.

Originally posted by Accel
I guess this negates all those times of DD beating or holding his own against the likes of Iron Fist and Bullseye… because we all know Wolverine is more skilled than those guys. rolleyes1

Originally posted by Accel
He doesn’t have to stop it. Just dodge it or roll with it. It’s all good.

Originally posted by Accel
You mean this? Doesn’t look like much of a disadvantage to me.

do I even have to BEING TO explain what's wrong here?

Originally posted by jinzin
bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired? 😕

Originally posted by jinzin
bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

Originally posted by jinzin
considering that wolverine has proven superior to every one of these guys in h2h combat I suppose it does.

Originally posted by jinzin
you mean like he did when cap got tired of playing around and one punched him in the gut? 😕

Originally posted by jinzin
are you serious? are you seriously trying to uphold an ennis feat? 🤨

do I even have to BEING TO explain what's wrong here?

this is a very iffy fight. DD could be seen as winning because he has radar sense, and thus should be able to dodge all punchez n take on any street-leveler, but the Cap has enhanced reflexes, not to mention far superiority in strength, fighting skill and stamina. so caps punchez would be hittin alot harder. i say DD wears down while Caps barely even breakin a sweat, and eventually just drops em.

Originally posted by jinzin
bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

very sound point

Originally posted by peejayd
* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired? 😕

1so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired?

In comics it probably is but thats beside the point, if you think about. Daredevil has swatted away bullets easily and dodged bullets easily. But then again Cap has feats like that as well just as much of dodging bullets without the aid of his shield. To even dodging lots of energy beams.

Does this mean Dardevil isn't going to touch Cap, since Cap can dodge beams? Of course not. Daredevil will be hitting him, but Cap probably takes a small majority like 6/10 thanks to the SSS.

Originally posted by braz
this is a very iffy fight. DD could be seen as winning because he has radar sense, and thus should be able to dodge all punchez n take on any street-leveler, but the Cap has enhanced reflexes, not to mention far superiority in strength, fighting skill and stamina. so caps punchez would be hittin alot harder. i say DD wears down while Caps barely even breakin a sweat, and eventually just drops em.

Again. DD is arguably a superior martial artist to Cap.

Cap is an all-around better fighter, only because of his shield AND SSS really.

DD wins 6/10.

Again. DD is arguably a superior martial artist to Cap.

Actually DD has stated Cap is one of earths best fighters. Even Zaran has stated Cap is a even greater fighter then Shang-Chi. Now in pressure point fighting I'd say DD is better. But in hand to hand Cap is just as good or even better.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Its still not a hard concept to grasp. In the MU the bar for human potential is set higher than in the real world. So it makes sense the way Tony, Doom and Reed are so much smarter than the other folk. Remember in the MU ordinary persons can build rocket skateboards and make suits that let them climb walls etc.

Well ok, but if you remember what I said. I said who is more intelligent The Leader or Dr Doom? To be quite honest with you alot of people without thinking would probably say Dr Doom. That shouldn't really happen but people take it for granted that Dr Doom is that smart. I just feel if there was not a Spidey vs Cap thread you would have probably said the same thing.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Actually DD has stated Cap is one of earths best fighters.

Yeah and you would think if he was better he would have mentioned it.

Originally posted by peejayd
* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired? 😕

Originally posted by Accel
If he can determine where a man is aiming his gun and even predict WHEN he's going to pull the trigger and react to it, he should be able to detect and react to the slightest movements in Cap's muscles just fine.

Originally posted by Accel
With pure skill? Or did it just come down to the same adamantium durability and healing factor that lets him hang with heavy hitting bricks?

Originally posted by Accel
You mean when Daredevil wasn’t right in the head and he STILL rolled with the punch?

Originally posted by Accel
So… because Ennis wrote it, it means it can’t happen?

(*SIGH*)

basically.. no not that it can't happen, rather, that it's not likely to.....

look in THAT SAME ARC, (we're not even talking different writers here this is still ennis) wolverine takes an LCD rocket that blows away both of his thighs his crotch and his torso, he's not KOed.
punisher shotgun blasts wolverine in the face and wolverine isn't KOed.
Punisher runs over logan with a steamroller! and wolvie isn't KOed
HULK HITS WOLVERINE ACCROSS A STATE LINE! wolverine gets right back up and hops the next train back to the fight....

but one chop from punisher puts him down?

look the problem with ennis is that he's already admitted that he's BIAS when it comes to superhuman heroes vs. humans... that's why spiderman and wolverine look like ameteures compared to DD in that arc. the point is, if you think ADMITTEDLY BIAS writing is something to base a quality argument off of, then ANYONE who comes into this thread saying that cap will win, or wolverine is more agile than dd BECAUSE of the fact that they just like the character more, or hate daredevil, then they must necessarily be making a good point in your opinion if you uphold the ennis feat.

Not saying it didn't happen. but even in it's OWN ARC it didn't makes sense.

Originally posted by jinzin
I'm not saying he can't, it's just that cap is a LOT harder to avoid because of his adaptability AFTER LAUNCHING an attack.. bullets can't adapt after fired, daredevil can dodge them because of that fact, he already knows their path once launched, caps path once launched isn't guaranteed to remain the same it could change mid swing and then POW.

Originally posted by jinzin
leave it to the skills
in h2h combat wolverine's punked DD in 3 panals, punked shang chi in 4, and punked cap in 3 pages.. he's obviously got SOME edge on each one of these guys.

Originally posted by jinzin
no I mean when cap plowed through his torso and layed him out in one hit after he got serious.

… where DD isn’t right in the head, rolls with the punch, and pretends to be down.

Originally posted by jinzin
basically.. no not that it can't happen, rather, that it's not likely to.....