1) Darth Nihilous - Has the power to rip the force from force-sensitives killing them in the process "there are some techniques within the force from which there is no defence" - Darth Traya
2) Darth Revan - He was skilled with a lightsaber and the force but his power came from his tacticul genius and leadership qualities that made it easy to control entire armadas and turn jedi seemingly at will
3) Naga Sadow - Can send stars supernova! nuff said not a duel winning ability though and as far as planet killing goes nihilous is equally effective
4) Tulak Hord - His power lies not so much with the force but his immense ability with the lightsaber at which he is the ultimate sith combatant
5) Marka Ragnos - An ancient sith lord who possesses an untold immense power! Its gotta get him on the list
Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Well at least he did things, the entire argument for Marka's power is he ruled over Naga basically and for a long time unchallenged. Still if he's the most powerful being ever and he has all of these strong Sith underneath him, why not attack the Republic?
Because he was afraid, and possibly with good reason.. He didn't attack an unknown threat because he feared what it could do. He feared that those people would be so much more powerful then him.
But yeah the argument for Ragnos is pretty simple but also incredibly effective. Lets say you have three people
Normal Human A, soldier, Ancient Spartan...
Now we all know that soldier will beat normal human... Spartan will beat soldier, wouldn't that naturally make Spartan more powerful then normal human? Just saying.
Yes, but the argument for Ragnos is too short, and one-sided. If we actually saw him doing stuff in books or games we would see some weaknesses as well. It would flesh out his character and abilities actually showing the things he does.
Let me give an example: We hear that 100 years ago, there was a guy that was an awesome mastermind. He had brilliant plans, etc. Everyone assumes he is one of the best ever, but somehow we go back in time and actually see what happens, we find out that he stole ideas from others, killing anyone else who got in his way. No one would dare expose the truth out of fear. Things can be misleading sometimes. Before ROTS, everyone pretty much assumed Sidious would defeat Mace and the other 3, and defeat Yoda because we had never seen him fight before (actually fighting).
I'm not saying Ragnos is weak, I still place him rather high, but I put others ahead of him because they have accomplishments, we have seen them fight, and we know basically the whole side of them.
Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Yes, but the argument for Ragnos is too short, and one-sided. If we actually saw him doing stuff in books or games we would see some weaknesses as well. It would flesh out his character and abilities actually showing the things he does.Let me give an example: We hear that 100 years ago, there was a guy that was an awesome mastermind. He had brilliant plans, etc. Everyone assumes he is one of the best ever, but somehow we go back in time and actually see what happens, we find out that he stole ideas from others, killing anyone else who got in his way. No one would dare expose the truth out of fear. Things can be misleading sometimes. Before ROTS, everyone pretty much assumed Sidious would defeat Mace and the other 3, and defeat Yoda because we had never seen him fight before (actually fighting).
I'm not saying Ragnos is weak, I still place him rather high, but I put others ahead of him because they have accomplishments, we have seen them fight, and we know basically the whole side of them.
Could be, but I think you are comparing the wrong things here. You see Sadow actually did fight and he was still scared of Ragnos, Ragnos did fight we don't know who but we do know he did fight... Meaning he was still powerful enough to defeat all of them and they were scared for more reasons then just cheap tricks... How powerful he was we just don't know, but he had to be incredibly powerful
Like I said, I give him a lot of credit, he's like 9th or something on my list, but could Revan have defeated those guys we don't know about? 99.9% chance I would say so since we actually know the beings he's fought which are very powerful and he's defeated every one of them. He is feared as well, though his fear extends to the whole galaxy, not just Korriban.
As for Sadow, who did he fight? Ludo Kressh but they never finished the duel. So his power comes from using Sith MAGIC to cause stars to go supernova. Not necessarily a really powerful connection to the Force here, and as I've said before, perhaps no one else has done it because it's a rare gift like Bastila's battle meditation. It doesn't really make you more powerful but more useful. Besides, who else would need to blow up a star? No one except maybe Ragnos, even with his "awesome" power, someone who could blow up stars, and an entire Sith army and he's afraid of the Republic which to my knowledge hasn't fought a full scale war in some time?
Read Wikipedia about Marka, it has a paragraph and mostly about him being in the game Jedi Academy. Speaking of which, let's look at that. Marka comes back as a spirit, infests a Force User's body (and granted she wasn't all that weak) and still gets defeated by a Jedi knight, albeit one who's about at Kyle Katarn's level. Now let's look at Exar Kun's spirit, and this is JUST his spirit, he destroyed a Force User, corrupted 3 individuals and it took 12 padawans and Luke and Vodo-Siosk Bas's spirit JOINING their power to destroy Kun. He even Force choked those 12 padawans at the same time, but after a minute they resisted it.
That's way more than Marka did, and his spirit was inside a Dark Jedi master. So no, I don't think he's the most powerful.
Well I agree that we know far to little abou himt, far to little to make a good guess of how powerful he was. Could Revan beat him? I don't think so, would he if the two fought? Who knows, nobody does. Its a serious lack of knowledge that makes Marka as powerful as he is and not more powerful.
And about that ghost, come on be serious here? That game is so full of shit, it just doesn't make any sense Ragnos should have beat the crap out of everybody that entered that room, every single last one of them. I really think that game is a mayor screw up, but I guess you could explain it threw other ways let me try.
- Ragnos didn't feel like returning all that much if he did he would have done so on his own.. Others did
- He just came back and probably wasn't on his full power back
- Korriban its gasses poisoned Sith because the last true Sith let out a fart that still haunts them..
Okay seriously those reasons make no sense, all I'm trying to say is, that Ragnos no matter how little we know about him should still rule the seven sea's
Originally posted by Fishy
Well I agree that we know far to little abou himt, far to little to make a good guess of how powerful he was. Could Revan beat him? I don't think so, would he if the two fought? Who knows, nobody does. Its a serious lack of knowledge that makes Marka as powerful as he is and not more powerful.And about that ghost, come on be serious here? That game is so full of shit, it just doesn't make any sense Ragnos should have beat the crap out of everybody that entered that room, every single last one of them. I really think that game is a mayor screw up, but I guess you could explain it threw other ways let me try.
- Ragnos didn't feel like returning all that much if he did he would have done so on his own.. Others did
- He just came back and probably wasn't on his full power back
- Korriban its gasses poisoned Sith because the last true Sith let out a fart that still haunts them..Okay seriously those reasons make no sense, all I'm trying to say is, that Ragnos no matter how little we know about him should still rule the seven sea's
Listen to yourself saying what Ragnos should've done, you're making excuses for him when this is the best thing we have to go on. We don't know how powerful Ragnos is but this is our biggest lead and you're denying it because you think he should be all powerful even though we have absolutely no proof of HIS power other than he was feared? Come on.
1. Ragnos DID want to come back, he said "a mere Jedi child shall not undo my return" and "This is impossible! One day I will return and annihilate you all!"
2. Did you see how much energy Tavion poured into him from that Scepter? And she didn't even use it all. He was definitely at full power if he came back.
3. lol
Still, you are saying the game is full of crap because Ragnos isn't as powerful as you want him? Be serious, this isn't a fan contest.
Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Listen to yourself saying what Ragnos should've done, you're making excuses for him when this is the best thing we have to go on. We don't know how powerful Ragnos is but this is our biggest lead and you're denying it because you think he should be all powerful even though we have absolutely no proof of HIS power other than he was feared? Come on.1. Ragnos DID want to come back, he said "a mere Jedi child shall not undo my return" and "This is impossible! One day I will return and annihilate you all!"
2. Did you see how much energy Tavion poured into him from that Scepter? And she didn't even use it all. He was definitely at full power if he came back.
3. lol
Still, you are saying the game is full of crap because Ragnos isn't as powerful as you want him? Be serious, this isn't a fan contest.
No not because I want him to be, but because it makes no sense if he wasn't. He is legendaric there has to be a reason for it. The best we know of him still isn't much, but it would at least suggest he's going to be very powerful. And yeah really that game is full of crap, in part in JK2 Kyle was more powerful then Luke.
What makes no sense? Again, how was he legendaric, what did he do? No one knows how powerful he is or even anywhere close, everyone simply assumes he is. This is the best we have to judge his power to because we can compare his power to Exar Kun whom we actually know about. And how is the game full of crap otherwise? Why do you think JK2 Kyle was more powerful than Luke?
Originally posted by Emperor Revan
What makes no sense? Again, how was he legendaric, what did he do? No one knows how powerful he is or even anywhere close, everyone simply assumes he is. This is the best we have to judge his power to because we can compare his power to Exar Kun whom we actually know about. And how is the game full of crap otherwise? Why do you think JK2 Kyle was more powerful than Luke?
Dessan owned Luke, Kyle owned Dessan.
Desann didn't own Luke, the battle showed them pretty equal with Desann winning by trapping Luke. Yes it was a horrible cutscene but c'mon, it's Luke we're talking about. He was undoubtedly not trying to fight and trying to get Desann to come back to his academy. Secondly he does say that he never even felt him coming, so even with a surprise Desann didn't win and if Desann really owned Luke than why did Desann leave so quickly? Also note that when Luke knocked off the rubble he wasn't breathing hard but he instead shook his head that Desann had turned to the Dark Side.
As for Kyle, we don't know how hard it was for him to win. Game wise it's pretty hard unless you're on padawan so Kyle probably had some trouble beating Desann.
All SW game characters are far overpowered and defying any logic.
Revan is
The Exile is
Kyle Katarn is
Otherwise it would not make any fun, playing the games. You simply HAVE to be able to kill anybody. And most likely you can kill your opponents ways too easy when you assume what they SHOULD be able to do.