"Batman can beat Thor because he's cooler!" That's an example of how not to debate. We would like to see the rationale behind any claims that one character can beat the other rather than a claim based on popularity and subjective bias.
Also, we insist that all claims be backed up by evidence from canon sources. If you claim that Spiderman is stronger than Superman, then you have to prove it.
There comes a point, I believe, that showings become unnecessary. Common sense needs to come into the equasion. He has taken on godzilla-sized monsters (This was back when he was only a class 80), and wasn't killed. Ben has held his own against norse and egyptian gods fer chrissake. And your telling me that a midget with claws and a healing factor can take him out? Please share what your smoking with me.
Originally posted by Muck101So let's discard showings, and use common sense based off of ben's showings... 🤨
There comes a point, I believe, that showings become unnecessary. Common sense needs to come into the equasion. He has taken on godzilla-sized monsters (This was back when he was only a class 80), and wasn't killed. Ben has held his own against norse and egyptian gods fer chrissake. And your telling me that a midget with claws and a healing factor can take him out? Please share what your smoking with me.
In short: "I'm biased to all hell, I want ben to win so we'll use his history, but discard wolverine's history. Then we'll reduce Wolvering to a few descriptions and through in an insulting tone. and then try to discredit you by saying that your reasonuing is based off of illlegal mind altering drugs rather than the Wolverines showing, which we already discarded."
You prove only your bias.
Originally posted by Tony Stark
Question?Are you capable of running your nice 40 miles a week easier today than it was for you 2.5 yrs ago. (assuming that you weren't doing 50 miles a week then) And how much easier would it be if you actually worked out to do it on the most advanced equipment on the planet for the next 2.5yrs from today and you did at at an exertion lvl that most in the world were unwilling to match because of their lack of willpower or heart to do so. Oh... and your body is in constant mutation so that your strength, durability, endurance and agility increased a little everyone of those days within that 2.5 yrs.
So yes...even though it happened 2.5 yrs ago.
Un 😕
Confused face indeed... I really don't see how this rant applies to Thing... His durability nor his strength have been proven to have increased to the point you're talking about. And, the last time that Ben's durability was tested against Wolverine's claws was a fairly recent example in which... Thing's durability lost.. 😐
So unless Thing's gained a momumental increase in durability and strength and you can PROVE that.. you know.. with scans...
Then all you're spewing here is nonsense. 😬
Originally posted by Tony Stark
And are you saying that someone whom is 200x stronger than some one can not easily overpower the other at will and turn them into a puppet... Ben would "IF" needed take a slash to allow Wolverine to get close enough to be able to do so.
Yes that's exactly what I'm saying.. Not because Thing's not strong enough to overpower Logan, simply because he doesn't have to tools that would allocate him to be in the position to do so.
If this were a wrestling match you would have a good point, but it's a no holds barred fight. Wolverine's superior speed, skill, and agility will come into play.
And Ben taking a slash has already proven to be a downfall for him in a fight.. Him taking a stab much more of the same...
Originally posted by Tony Stark
And FTR Wolverine is 5' 3" to 5' 5" Ben is 6' to 6'5 all dependent upon artiest even with Wolverine's claws being 6" to 12" he would match Ben's reach at best. No leverage advantage for Logan. He couldn't slash Ben without being put in his vise.
I'm still under the impression that Wolverine's reach outstrips Bens...
And please, it's ridiculous to pretend that Thing is immune to Wolverine's claws when Thing HIMSELF stated that the cut into his face was one of the most painful humiliating and vulnerable experiences of his life.
He's not immune to the claws.. he can TRY to take a slash, but as far as evidence goes. If he does, the fight's basically done for. 😐
Originally posted by Jyppe
A Small man, and big, very strong man have a match. The little man is obviously "weaker" in terms of strength etc, and the Big guys is obviously tougher, but slower. Let's say the two guys are comparable in skill. The big man wins this outcome.So.. What happens when we give the little man a knife? Okay, the big man still might able to take the majority. By blocking the knife with his hand and then throwing it aside. etc
Aaand, then when we add Superhuman healing factor, and lace the small guys bones with adamantium, and instead of wielding a knife, they'll be part of the lil' guy? And on top of that, let's add some superior skill/smarts/agility. Uh, even without the healing factor he'd take the majority. No matter how strong the other guy will be.
It just really takes a good hit to stomach/throat.
7-8/10 for Wolverine.
Seriously...
How I mean.. I imagine that Captain America with Wolverine's claws ALONE would be enough to get the majority from Thing.
Pack on adamantium laced bones and an HF like Logan's... and it's nearly absurd to think that Thing would take ANY of those fights without winning due to sheer dumb luck.. 😬
Originally posted by Soljer
I dunno, hence I said "if I recall correctly."Maybe I was thinking of a different instance?
Any help - someone think of which fight between Ben and Logan I was thinking of that WASN'T canon?
I bet you're thinking ofthe Big Town fight when Wolverine couldn't pierce Ben's hide.. that's DEFO not canon..
Originally posted by Soljer
I dunno, hence I said "if I recall correctly."Maybe I was thinking of a different instance?
Any help - someone think of which fight between Ben and Logan I was thinking of that WASN'T canon?
I bet you're thinking ofthe Big Town fight when Wolverine couldn't pierce Ben's hide.. that's DEFO not canon..
Originally posted by Muck101
Thing ftw. Wolvie cant beat -everyone-.
Wolverine loses a fight with Thing because he can't win in a fight with EVERYONE........?......... 😐
That's some errrr pretty abstract "logic" you're working with there... 😕
Originally posted by Muck101
There comes a point, I believe, that showings become unnecessary. Common sense needs to come into the equasion. He has taken on godzilla-sized monsters (This was back when he was only a class 80), and wasn't killed.
Originally posted by Muck101
Ben has held his own against norse and egyptian gods fer chrissake.
Originally posted by Muck101
And your telling me that a midget with claws and a healing factor can take him out? Please share what your smoking with me.
Well... I don't really "smoke" 616 Marvel comics.. but I s'pose you COULD...
Originally posted by jinzin
He didn't Carver's malinformed...He was admantiumized when he cut Bens face to shreds.
Originally posted by jinzin
Seriously...How I mean.. I imagine that Captain America with Wolverine's claws ALONE would be enough to get the majority from Thing.
Pack on adamantium laced bones and an HF like Logan's... and it's nearly absurd to think that Thing would take ANY of those fights without winning due to sheer dumb luck.. 😬
Depending on whether Thing can BFR him, and I'm pretty sure Thing could catch Wolverine at least once out of ten. He does have pretty big hands after all, and is trained in "martial arts". I bet he punches faster than Pre-PlanetHulk Hulk, as Hulk wasn't trained in any kind of fighting, thus he propably doesn't know the proper technique.
I'm not sure if this matters though. Thing's still quite a "big" hero, other than being a lard ass I mean. Maybe it's his so called heart that would grant him a victory over Wolverine, I dunno.
Can't you settle for a majority?
Besides, last time Hulk Thunder Clapped Wolverine (6 Hour war I think, the one which was oddly drawn) He wasn't trying to hit Wolvie with the clap AFAIK. They were digging something up and then Hulk got all angry about it and slammed his hands together. They weren't fighting AFAIK.
Could be wrong though
Originally posted by Kid Kurdy
1. Hulk is a natural born fighter.2. Hulk has always been faster than Thing.
Sorry Kid Kurdy but i disagree with that last comment. Whenever the Thing took on the Savage Hulk he was always shown to have the edge in speed over Hulk. He usually got more punches in, despite the Hulk's size and reach advantage, b'cos of his faster reflexes. Ben Grimm is a very capable fighter even in human form, having grown up as a gang lead in a rough part of town. If Ben wasn't faster than Savage Hulk he would've been demolished very quickly in their fights, as Hulk has huge advantages in strength, durability and stamina. Instead, he always gave him a good fight, although he usually lost. I'm not saying this b'cos i'm a Thing fanboy, as the Hulk is my favourite character