The Spirit of Humanity is Compassion

Originally posted by whirlysplat
Or alternatively is Whirly twisting words or providing a counter argument to at least my preconcieved notions on Nietzsche, which I have been reduced to insulting him over.

............................................Why?

Hmm interesting ...that's how you see it?...well ok I guess .....its your style of debating.....it doesn't reallly fit that Topic either though.....

Originally posted by Tex
Compassion, morality, ethics, and conscience are what separate us from other animals and organisms. 🙂

They're uniquely human creations.

I strongly disagree....it is the reasoning that makes us different (if at all) but that just means we have more possibilities and can further plan out our selfishness

Originally posted by whirlysplat
Are they uniquely human creations or uniquely human characteristics?😄 Now we have the true question.

Oh actually put like that...they are huiman creations.....fake so to say....

Originally posted by Bardock42
Hmm interesting ...that's how you see it?...well ok I guess .....its your style of debating.....it doesn't reallly fit that Topic either though.....

I strongly disagree....it is the reasoning that makes us different (if at all) but that just means we have more possibilities and can further plan out our selfishness

A characteristic and a creation are two separate things one is intrinsic the other is existential😄

-Whirly

For Bardock😄

The most perfidious way of harming a cause consists of defending it deliberately with faulty arguments.
Friedrich Nietzsche, The Gay Science, section 191
German philosopher (1844 - 1900)

Originally posted by whirlysplat
For Bardock😄

The most perfidious way of harming a cause consists of defending it deliberately with faulty arguments.
Friedrich Nietzsche, The Gay Science, section 191
German philosopher (1844 - 1900)

Why...just why do you only quote....don't you have own views?......
I don't want to argue with a long Dead philosopher....this is a debate between us two.....furthermore maybe you should take Nietzsches advise.....no wait....you don't have arguements at all.....

Hmmm the only thing that has more potential for human good is human evil. I don't think the "spirit" of humanity is compassion. Fear, necessity... survival drove the first humans together, kept the tribal families unified. From the earliest true civilisations compassion didn't figure largely into it, and morals were very, very different...

As a species we are selfish, prone to foolishness and violence, eager to protect ourselves above all else. On an individual level we have a lot of good stuff, including compassion, but I don't think, sadly, very sadly, it is the "spirit" of our species. In fact in the sense it is used here the concept is relatively new in the long march of history. So yes, people have a potential for good and bad. So I say neutrality is where humanity sits, and good and bad depends on the morals of the time. A good, strong, virtuous Roman was lauded and loved in the Republic, but to us would be a monster. In certain past societies compassion, mercy was a weakness. And even today not a single nation is built on compassion, but it is an important social construct. In a way it's kind of relative.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Why...just why do you only quote....don't you have own views?......
I don't want to argue with a long Dead philosopher....this is a debate between us two.....furthermore maybe you should take Nietzsches advise.....no wait....you don't have arguements at all.....

I do, just ones you find painful to counter.

-Whirly

Originally posted by whirlysplat
I do, just ones you find painful to counter.

-Whirly

Ok....dude just do...please...no one liners...no quotes....come on just show your view and "try" to support it.....I just want to see one of your own thoughts in this thread....please......we argue over more than 6 pages now , but I feel like I have to talk against shirer...and when I am done with that I have to talk against Kant....never against you.....get some debating etiquette.....

I have shown my views, I believe that rather than selfishness making men greedy (your opinion is that the natural state of man is selfish as is Willheims). It is society which makes them selfish. I believe intrinsically if you remove the constructs of the "market" you are so proud of in your post and distribute wealth fairly, you would find the human spirit is not as base as you think. Eventually I believe this will happen that the true compassion of man will show through. I think we have seen signs of it in the west over the last century, when individual deviants do not affect group think. In one way Nietzsche's ideas are right but he attributes the will to power to individuals, I believe the Ubermensch will be a product of an uber understanding. This may take a thousand years or more to achieve, but eventually we will have no market, we will all have food on the table, we will all have the things that make life worthwhile. At this point the true spirit of humanity will show. Nietzsche also got right his ideas on some of the barriers to progression, his view on organised religion and mine fit nicely.
The true nature of man is not sin, it is not greed, these are states forced upon man by lack, the true nature of man is brotherhood.
But this understanding will not come in my lifetime.

Never for as long as historians could trace has there been a day of peace.

Never once has there been a human that did not get mad, or deep down hated somebody or wanted them to get the hell away from them. All humans are proud of what they achieve because it makes them feel special. Why do you think Communism fails, if you think about it its the best system ever. However when you realise what it does it sucks. It makes people equal, we can not deal with equality. Perfection is beyond our reach. We do not even really understand the concept.

Do you think you can be happy sharing everything you have, and with everybody having exactly the same. Nothing will be special anymore. You won't be happy you'll feel normal. Thats not enough. Thats not a perfect world.

Originally posted by Fishy
Never for as long as historians could trace has there been a day of peace.

Never once has there been a human that did not get mad, or deep down hated somebody or wanted them to get the hell away from them. All humans are proud of what they achieve because it makes them feel special. Why do you think Communism fails, if you think about it its the best system ever. However when you realise what it does it sucks. It makes people equal, we can not deal with equality. Perfection is beyond our reach. We do not even really understand the concept.

Do you think you can be happy sharing everything you have, and with everybody having exactly the same. Nothing will be special anymore. You won't be happy you'll feel normal. Thats not enough. Thats not a perfect world.

read my post you misunderstand. Without bring rude I said nothing about sharing😄 No, higher ideals replace the base ideas of the market.
Your rebuttle is a rant and addresses none of the points I made as I tried to explain to you ages ago you are arguing you interpretation of my question. Which is not the same as the question. I suspect this is a product of the "group think" you belong to. 😄

"distribute wealth fairly"

"we will have no market, we will all have food on the table, we will all have the things that make life worthwhile"

"The true nature of man is not sin, it is not greed, these are states forced upon man by lack, the true nature of man is brotherhood."

If not claiming what I said we could not achieve then what were you claiming? Because from this I get that you want everybody to be happy equality, the lack of war and all that crap that will never ever happen.

sooo many pages to read...compassion...i'm not sure on that...the spirit of humanity is...ummmSorrow...that's what i think anyway....cause you figure....anger...has sorrow....happpiness has sorrow once you lose it....revenge has sorrow, hatred has sorrow... i guess it's the way you look at it....

Originally posted by Fishy
"distribute wealth fairly"

"we will have no market, we will all have food on the table, we will all have the things that make life worthwhile"

"The true nature of man is not sin, it is not greed, these are states forced upon man by lack, the true nature of man is brotherhood."

If not claiming what I said we could not achieve then what were you claiming? Because from this I get that you want everybody to be happy equality, the lack of war and all that crap that will never ever happen.

Probably the best example of what humans should aspire to and a perfect example of what I blieve the true nature of man is.

Imagine there's no heaven,
It's easy if you try,
No hell below us,
Above us only sky,
Imagine all the people
living for today...

Imagine there's no countries,
It isnt hard to do,
Nothing to kill or die for,
No religion too,
Imagine all the people
living life in peace...

Imagine no possesions,
I wonder if you can,
No need for greed or hunger,
A brotherhood of man,
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world...

You may say Im a dreamer,
but Im not the only one,
I hope some day you'll join us,
And the world will live as one.

John Lennon

Its a good song...and it might be an Utopia...sure...but it will still happen(if it will happen at all) humans will still be selfish....it just won't mean anything anymore...

I believe our true nature is above the greed placed on it by insufficiency. You see what happens when people have enough. They will compete but in different ways like academics generally compete or purely for the challenge like Davinci. Purpose is still present.

People will always do what they want...DaVinci paint, construct whatever...Rockefeller earn money.....BAch play music.....and they will compete...if they want that....because society might have implanted them that being the best is important...o0r maybe its their nature...but they will do it cause they want....

Example: I like to do so called "good" things....but I don't like when people know it (makes me feel bad) but if I do something good (to some extend, small things) and no one knows that is a great feeling for me...so I do it...sometimes ...when I want to...but I do it for me...not for anyone else....least for the person that gets something out of it.

Originally posted by Deano
if you want a better world, then respect our own right to be unique and to express that uniqueness; let us respect the right of others to express their
uniqueness, free from ridicule or condemnation; and let us never seek to impose what we believe on anyone else. That simple philosophy will transform your life and life on this planet.
dont sit back and watch the agents control and manipulate the world for there own selfish needs.

We have stopped thinking for ourselves and given our minds (power) away. Therefore we follow the one in front in the most extraordinarily robotic fashion. And we are consumed by fear in every fibre of our being. Once our fear responses are activated, we rush to conform even if we are aware enough to realise that what we are being asked to think, do, and say, is a nonsense. These weapons, the baa, baa, and the fear, allow an
astonishingly few people to mould and direct the world in their own
perverted image, a process that is leading, unless we wake up and grow
up, towards a world government, army, central bank and currency, and
a microchipped population: in short, the total global control of every
man woman and child.
While it may appear at first to be incredibly difficult for a relative
handful of people to control the lives of nearly six billion, it is in fact
comparatively easy, once you have control of education and the media
- the sources of the “information” and mantra messages which bombard
the conscious and subconscious mind from cradle to grave. These
messages are not designed to inform, but to direct and condition, to
divide and rule.
generation allows its sense
of self to be conditioned by older generations, parents, teachers and
media people. They don’t question why. This sponge mentality and the
desire to impose one’s thoughts and beliefs on others has created an
amazingly effective vehicle for the Elite to control the direction of the
world. It is what I have called the Hassle-Free Zone. Every dogma,
belief-system, culture, and society has a Hassle-Free Zone. It works
like this: you set limits of acceptable thought, view and behaviour and
anyone who steps outside of those very narrow limits is immediately
either ridiculed as “mad” or condemned as “bad”. In my case both!
Some people stay within the Hassle-Free Zone because they are
persuaded that this desperately constricted view is indeed how life
should be lived. But there are very significant numbers of other people
who realise how ridiculous the limits of the Zone are, but the fear of
facing ridicule or condemnation ensures that they keep their mouths
shut and their heads down. As they say in Japan, the nail that stands
out from the rest is the first one to be hit. Here again we have the
Hassle-Free Zone policed by those twin weapons, the baa, baa (those
who accept the limitation of conditioned thought and view as their
reality) and the fear (those who think differently, but are frightened to
say so). This means that great swathes of humanity are living a lie and
denying what they really believe and what they really want to do with
their lives. They don the mask. Stand in a crowded street and watch all
those people walking by. You are not looking at the real, infinite them.
You are looking at the mask they project to the world.
If you want to be free, stop living a lie. Stop denying yourself. You
are a unique aspect of all that exists, the sum total of all your unique
experiences since you first became cC)nscious an infinity ago. That is
a reason to be joyous. There is no aspect of consciousness in all creation
that is like you. You are special, as everyone is equally special. But
instead of being joyous and proud of that specialness, we have allowed
our uniqueness to become something to fear. Oh my God!
Because we fear being ourselves, we are uncomfortable when anyone
around us decides to evacuate the Hassle-Free Zone and express their
uniqueness. Their dash for mental and emotional freedom makes a
statement about us and our own mental and emotional prison. People
don’t like that and they react accordingly. “He’s mad” or “She’s bad”
comes the reflex action, standard issue cry from the herd when it is
faced with someone determined to be themselves and not a
programmed clone. And do you know what people are really saying
when they shout “mad” or “bad”? They are really saying “different”.
Think about the consequences for your life and the planet that result
from this frar of being YOU. If we give our minds away to others and
allow them to tell us what to think and do, and if we concede our
uniqueness to the fear of being different, we give control of this world
to a tiny Elite who use their power and manipulation to dictate the
limits of the Hassle-Free Zone.
Until we respect our own, and everyone’s, right to be different, to
make our own choices, and create our own conscious realities free from
imposition and pressure to conform, we will remain in a prison of our
own making. We will continue to be both the policeman and the
prisoner. And a handful of people with a deeply unpleasant agenda will
continue to run the world. The choice, as always, is ours. We can accept
the prison or we can walk out to freedom. And freedom is but a thought
away.

simple as that

Wow, a big massive copy and paste from Marihemp.

Congratulations on being able to work C&P. 😐

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Wow, a big massive [b]copy and paste from Marihemp.

Congratulations on being able to work C&P. 😐 [/B]

Is there some sarcasm I sense?

.....anyways good example again...why did she do that? to see Deano cry...possibly....just for the hell of saying something....could be......to entertain herself....most likely....but I can tell you what she didn't do it for...for any other person here there or anyhwere...she just did it for herself.....like everyone does......

and why did Deano post it....to educate his fellow earthmen...NO (except its his own goal to do though...but then he would do it to fuilfill his goal)......for the sadistical notion that people might actually read the BS....yes could be.......to see jis own sig...most likely...also selfish....

I know those are not the best examples but that's it with every action of a human being...it has ultimately selfish otives...whixh isn't bad...its just human nature...