Police Cook Nine Iraqis in Sealed Metal Box Under Scorching Sun

Originally posted by jaden101
did this "insurrgent" go around killing children in market places?...did he hang 10 year olds for talking to English soldiers?...

I dont know ; did he ?

Meet me half way here ; are you talking about that terrorist attack in Iraq that kiled 1 soldier and a group of kids in the street. ?

If so that was the work of a terrorist not an insurgent. A Terrorist chooses civilian targets and individuals deprived of defense; an insurgent opts for military targets. I beg to differ on this cause Bush had said that there would never be negotians with terrorists.

Recently, there have been talks in Iraq between US officials and Tribe leaders to quell the insurgency and find a peacful means to put an end to all this blood. Blood being spilt cause they cannot walk the streets freely. They cannot sleep cause foreign military comes banging on their doors in the middle of the night. Arrests by foriegn military in the middle of the night.

What the news doesnt tell you is that a few tribes are sheltering terrorists, while other tribes want these terrorists as well as US and UK forces OUT

These Insurgents are fighting on two fronts.

Putting terrorits and insurgents on the same side would mean that Bush is contradicting himself.

Originally posted by GCG
I dont know ; did he ?

Meet me half way here ; are you talking about that terrorist attack in Iraq that kiled 1 soldier and a group of kids in the street. ?

If so that was the work of a terrorist not an insurgent. A Terrorist chooses civilian targets and individuals deprived of defense; an insurgent opts for military targets. I beg to differ on this cause Bush had said that there would never be negotians with terrorists.

Recently, there have been talks in Iraq between US officials and Tribe leaders to quell the insurgency and find a peacful means to put an end to all this blood. Blood being spilt cause they cannot walk the streets freely. They cannot sleep cause foreign military comes banging on their doors in the middle of the night. Arrests by foriegn military in the middle of the night.

What the news doesnt tell you is that a few tribes are sheltering terrorists, while other tribes want these terrorists as well as US and UK forces OUT

Putting terrorits and insurgents on the same side would mean that Bush is contradicting himself.

im talking about what a personal friend of mine witnessed with his own eyes when he was in Basra...a young boy approached him to say hello...he gave the boy some water...they finished their patrol and when they came back down the same street the boy was hanging from by his neck from a street light...executed by these so called "insurrgents"

the fact remains that as it stands...if all foreign forces were to leave...the people who have the military power to get control of iraq are still the former regime and their supporters...we need to either try to get them to engage in the political system in iraq...kill them ourselves....or train enough iraqi police and soldiers to stop the dictatorship from returning its minority rule

we seem to be trying to do all three...

How does your friend in Basra know it was an insurgent ?

Dont get me wrong its easy for me to comment like this from the comfort of my seat but it could have been some psycho/iraqi without having to do with the Insurgency.

But yeah , ive got to agree with those 3 things, and training them seems to be the hardest thing to do.

They need to be trained, but knowing how long its going to take them to learn , then foriegn forces are going to take more time in Iraq, so the Insurgency will continue.

Kill them yourselves would mean starting a new sheet but Unfortunatly, its not an option the rest of the world is willing to accept.

So going ahead with the new political system in Iraq would be the best way forward, but due to the Oil reserves under each sector of Iraqi desert, the tribal clashes will increase.

How does your friend in Basra know it was an insurgent ?

so you think it was just a normal everyday murder of a child...in a busy street....mmmm

not to mention that it happened very early in the war...before the outside terrorists had amassed in iraq

No ; what im saying is that you cannot stigmatise these detainees on the basis of an individual act that happened in 2003.

Well I haven't been here for a while, but I see the old blame game is alive and well. I always wondered about one thing-for all the atrocities that Amnesty International and all these other agencies highlight, have they EVER, ONCE, said anything about Al Qaeda beheading Nick Berg or the Taliban slicing Daniel Pearl's throat, along with all those lovely videos they send of the events (where you could hear Nick berg screaming as his head was slowly sawed off with a commando knife?)

I guess that's OK right? And you guys are worried about 6 Al Qaeda in a ****in' box? Shit, at least the detainess at Gitmo still have THEIR heads on their shoulders (and 3 meals a day as well as access to that book they use to legitimize their murder sprees.) But somehow someone will throw "Christianity" up and say it's no better,in an effort to detract from the truth about these cold blooded killers and the responsibility they have to ultimately take for their actions (which others seem to globally defend in some ambiguous way.)

Originally posted by GCG
So going ahead with the new political system in Iraq would be the best way forward, but due to the Oil reserves under each sector of Iraqi desert, the tribal clashes will increase.

Very good point. I'm suprised noone thought of this earlier. This will also be a breeding ground for economically induced conflicts no matter what happens. The possibility is there. Noone's willing to share (or would they?) This aspect of the new govt. should get very interesting.

This ambiguity has set safety within societies in the western world.

Whats so ambiguous with implementing the democratic system that most western countries have adopted ?

Should it change ?

Originally posted by GCG
This ambiguity has set safety within societies in the western world.

Whats so ambiguous with implementing the democratic system that most western countries have adopted ?

Should it change ?

Well, w\regard to ambiguity, I speak of the way people take a dual edge to this situation, and mostly of the way that I have heard people speak with a double edged blade about 9-11 and the way Al Qaeda is killing people in Iraq. I hear stuff like "well, it DOES suck, BUT...you asked for it" or "9-11 was bad BUT...it's a nice downpayment on all the innocents you help to kill in Palestine every day."

What I mean, is that sometimes people say one thing and mean another. By no means is this new in the world, it's just that w\regared to 9-11 and Iraq, I wish people would in some parts of Europe and the world abroad would just stop BS'ing and tell us to our faces, how much they hate America and want us to die because of their own seemingly latent desire to see America get it up the ass.

Hope that helps to clear it up a bit.

BTW-I'm not saying anyone HERE hates America as a total package w\o regard for distinction between people and politicians. I'm just saying I HAVE encountered it before. Just wanted to let you know that. peace 🙂

Originally posted by GCG
No ; what im saying is that you cannot stigmatise these detainees on the basis of an individual act that happened in 2003.

why not...people seem a helluva quick to do it the other way round....a couple of idiots in the US and UK armies abuse prisoners and suddenly everyone in the army are evil torturing bastards apparently

and some sick idiots of Iraqi nationality blows people up and suddenly every Iraqy is a ruthless terrorist

Originally posted by jaden101
why not...people seem a helluva quick to do it the other way round....a couple of idiots in the US and UK armies abuse prisoners and suddenly everyone in the army are evil torturing bastards apparently

so once again you fall under the mentallity that if they commit an evil, we have the right to commit that evil. well, maybe that would be the case, but then we lose the moral high ground....you know...the one and only remaining justification for our occupation....to spread freedom and end such acts of evil [/half sarcasm]

so you suggest we should come around full circle in our hypocrisy and adopt the very same policy which we claimed (after all lies exposed) was the reason we invaded in the first place. why dont we just start gassing the lot of them? "SADDAM!!!!! YOU CANT BRUTALISE YOUR PEOPLE LIKE THAT!!!!! now step aside and we'll show you how its done you bleedheart pussy" yeah dude, that makes alot of sense.

Originally posted by PVS
so once again you fall under the mentallity that if they commit an evil, we have the right to commit that evil. well, maybe that would be the case, but then we lose the moral high ground....you know...the one and only remaining justification for our occupation....to spread freedom and end such acts of evil [/half sarcasm]

so you suggest we should come around full circle in our hypocrisy and adopt the very same policy which we claimed (after all lies exposed) was the reason we invaded in the first place. why dont we just start gassing the lot of them? "SADDAM!!!!! YOU CANT BRUTALISE YOUR PEOPLE LIKE THAT!!!!! now step aside and we'll show you how its done you bleedheart pussy" yeah dude, that makes alot of sense.

i wasn't justifying anything at all and have in fact condemed the actions of the troops at abu ghraib several times..

once again to read what you want to read and try and twist peoples words...you should really give up on that cause you don't do it very well

what i was commenting on seeing as you obviously missed the point again is the media's constant condeming of the allied soldiers as being brutal and heavy handed yet at the same time saying that any killings commited by iraqi's are isolated and don't represent anyone but themselves

so once again PVS...stop making things up and grow up

forgive me if i cant decipher your constant backpedaling and double talk. 😬

Originally posted by jaden101
why not...people seem a helluva quick to do it the other way round....a couple of idiots in the US and UK armies abuse prisoners and suddenly everyone in the army are evil torturing bastards apparently

.....and thats not true.

Nothing is perfect

People who think that its right to condemn a whole nation on the basis of some individuals' profits and selfishness are not in a rational mind frame.

Originally posted by jaden101
why not...people seem a helluva quick to do it the other way round....a couple of idiots in the US and UK armies abuse prisoners and suddenly everyone in the army are evil torturing bastards apparently

Yeah really. I get sick of hearing this shit too, Jaden101.

At least the Guantanamo detainees and most of the guys at Abu Gharaib STILL have their heads on their shoulders....if we were THEIR prisoners I'm sure we'd be killed and the videos would be sent home to our parents to add to the trauma..so much for playing 'fair.' But that's ok, it's still (and never was) enough to make people see, so we're still ****ed no matter what we do...ya just gotta' love it.

Originally posted by PVS
forgive me if i cant decipher your constant backpedaling and double talk. 😬

forgive me if i dont think you actually have an opinion of your own but merely try and reword what others say in some misguided attempt at making people look like evil racists

Originally posted by GCG
.....and thats not true.

Nothing is perfect

People who think that its right to condemn a whole nation on the basis of some individuals' profits and selfishness are not in a rational mind frame.

but in fact it is true because the overall, Bush hating media will do anything to put down the efforts of the allied troops by both NOT reporting any of the good things they contiually do but also focus on the acts of stupidity by a tiny fraction of allied troops and then try and put the spin on a "culture of abuse" etc etc

Originally posted by PVS
forgive me if i cant decipher your constant backpedaling and double talk. 😬