How so? You have sneaking, persuading and fighting...
Exar is great in fighting and good in the others, but he's not as good as Revan if in sneaking or persuading if you ask me. Yes his awesome powers would inspire fear, but it wouldn't do that in a gamblers hide out. And the ground wouldn't shake as he walked either. The thing he'd be best at without any doubt is the fight against Ulic he would own there. In the rest he would be second or last. But thats just my oppinion.
Anyways we need a new challenge between Revan and Exar to decide a winner and the one that goes onto the next round.
Well, it's not just the ground shaking. He's done great things without intimidating use of the Force.
Such as Ossus, I belive, when he persuaded Knights to join him. I don't recall him ever shaking the ground then, or using some Force-induced fear tactics. He persuaded full-fledged Knights to join him using only his wits and guile. You give him less credit than he deserves in that department. He may come second, or last, in the "sneaking" task, but I believe he pulls into first in the "fighting" and "persuading" tasks.
i don't see where Revan gets all these pursuading points here. Yoda..yes, he's oldest, wise, most likely has lots of experience here, and the Force with him will finish this pretty quick.
but Revan "has a tactical mind". ok, so he can lead huge armies into battle and crush his opponent with overwhelming strategy...why does that help him pursuade people? besides some Sith intimidation with the Force and such...and perhaps a quicker mind, i don't think he'll pass Yoda...nor Exar Kun.
Originally posted by BlackVortex
i don't see where Revan gets all these pursuading points here. Yoda..yes, he's oldest, wise, most likely has lots of experience here, and the Force with him will finish this pretty quick.but Revan "has a tactical mind". ok, so he can lead huge armies into battle and crush his opponent with overwhelming strategy...why does that help him pursuade people? besides some Sith intimidation with the Force and such...and perhaps a quicker mind, i don't think he'll pass Yoda...nor Exar Kun.
Revan does have the more nimble mind from what I'm seeing. He was an excellent orator, able to muster up the whole of the jedi forces that left for the Mandalorian Wars. He was well-respected for his dedication to knowledge and keen intellect, and strong personal charisma, even moreso in this latter department than the charismatic Exile. The point is, the burden of proof is on the supporters of Exar Kun in the gambler's den trial, and I have seen far more evidence of Revan being methodical, intelligent, and persuasive than Exar Kun.
And when comparing Yoda and Revan... Yoda is wise, don't get me wrong. But I believe he was too brooding, willing to meditate until the answer arrived to him, as opposed to being more clever and hands-on like Revan. He was too willing to trust in the Force and not willing enough to rely on his own observations. Remember, Yoda had a Sith lord not unlike Revan and Exar Kun (If anything, someone far weaker) right under his nose. And for this, I dock him some intuition points as well as some time in this challenge.
Exar Kun also manuevered an army, hid under the noses of the Jedi while recruiting members of their order to the dark side. His mind sure as hell isn't shabby, and as we've seen, he's very intimidating as well as very persuasive. While we may have more instances of Revan being more methodical, intelligent, and persuasive, we have instances where Kun demonstrates it to a degree that even Revan rarely does.
As for Revan being less brooding than Yoda, definitely. There's little doubt that Yoda is probably the most patient little bugger in the entire SW Universe. I mean, the guy lives to be nearly 900 years old.
ok..Revan may be pursuasive..but Exar Kun left the Jedi, and recruited lots of Jedi to his cause, and even got them to kill their master's. that would take a lot of convincing and pursuasiveness.
so i think Revan and Exar are going to be pretty close on pursuading others..but then Exar comes out with the intimidation factor and ability it seems, to always get what he wants.
i think Exar pulls this off, and Revan goes. thought it would be pretty close.
Revan convinced hundreds of Jedi too, but far more important he convinced normal humans. You can't make those people fall to the Dark Side you have to have something that will make them want to join you. Revan got a third of the Republic fleet to just that. To turn against everything they loved the thing they lost countless of friends for, the thing they wanted to sacrifise their live for. Revan turned them away from that and actually turned them against that, I find that far more impressive then all those Jedi he turend.
Also you have to remember intimidation is nice, but if it will make you stick out especially in a place like that, and he can't use the force in anyway. Revan might use it without being noticed Exar Kun could not.
Originally posted by Darth Faunus
You didn't answer it yet; Exar Kun snuck through an entire Jedi complex undetected as a Sith Lord, bringing Jedi to his cause. A charismatic and impressive mannerism helped keep his identity inder wraps. I doubt he'll have trouble hiding it here, with drunk fools of gamblers.
Exactly, you can easily mislead non-force users, people like that can easily be disorientated and strung around, just look at any tyrannical regime.
It's much harder to convince Jedi, who have been taught since their original training to avoid the Dark Side like their plague and to give up all selfish desires to give in to the Dark Side, give up the lives they have lived, slay their masters, and join his cause to fight the Republic they have been allied with.
Jedi can convinced by showing them the Dark Side that won't work on humans..
Now yeah Exar snuck around, but how are you going to do that in a bar. Normally if something happens somewere in a bar the rest will notice. Especially when there are only 24 people, you tend to notice the others a lot. In a place were people are gambling people are paying atttention thats for sure. Apparantly the place has enough big players to be worthy of cheating, so the people are sure as hell going to look around. Check out other players, Exar Kun and Yoda would both stand out far more then Revan would. Exar Kun would use intimidation and persuasion Revan would not.
When people are scared they talk, but before they are scared they don't, they try to avoid you get away from you. In a larger place Exar would be more succesful, but Revan is described as to have a natural charisma, somebody people want to follow. Want to listen to, he's probably like somebody who you think is your best friend when you just see him for the first time, you are more willing to do things for people like that then for those that are threathening you.
Seriously I'm not saying Exar is bad, but this is what Revan is famous for, what he does with his free time. He's going to be great in it.
Originally posted by Fishy
Jedi can convinced by showing them the Dark Side that won't work on humans..Now yeah Exar snuck around, but how are you going to do that in a bar. Normally if something happens somewere in a bar the rest will notice. Especially when there are only 24 people, you tend to notice the others a lot. In a place were people are gambling people are paying atttention thats for sure. Apparantly the place has enough big players to be worthy of cheating, so the people are sure as hell going to look around. Check out other players, Exar Kun and Yoda would both stand out far more then Revan would. Exar Kun would use intimidation and persuasion Revan would not.
When people are scared they talk, but before they are scared they don't, they try to avoid you get away from you. In a larger place Exar would be more succesful, but Revan is described as to have a natural charisma, somebody people want to follow. Want to listen to, he's probably like somebody who you think is your best friend when you just see him for the first time, you are more willing to do things for people like that then for those that are threathening you.
Seriously I'm not saying Exar is bad, but this is what Revan is famous for, what he does with his free time. He's going to be great in it.
Um. . . among eight-foot tall Whipids and cat-sized pesks, I doubt that Yoda and Exar are going to be treated much differently. . .
Revan may well be able to "befriend" others, but I don't think that even the most clever, kindest wordplay can outdo well-done intimidation and interrogation. This is a dirty bar. People see seeming friendliness as a weakness, a place to take the advantage. They are much more responsive to fear-inducing and intimidating tactics, especially seeing as how it's hard to scare someone who goes to a SW bar. . .
And you have to remember, many of the Jedi wanted to help, feeling the Jedi Council was incompetent and letting countless people be slaughtered. Revan didn't intially get Jedi to join the Dark Side, he got them to help him fight. Then he slowly turned them, letting them experience the rush of battle, and the horror of war.