Sorry, lol, seven. I'm in a hurry. 😛
Still, Illustrious - throwing a damn star at an enemy or doing crap like that is simply too ridiculously overpowered for my likings. If anything, they should be simply a little - or 50 percent - stronger than ROTS Sidious and Yoda - who were the most powerful of either side at the time.
Originally posted by Lord Simus
So hes overpowered because he uses Sith powers.
No, he's overpowered because they threw the rulebook out just for him.
Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Sorry, lol, seven. I'm in a hurry. 😛Still, Illustrious - throwing a damn star at an enemy or doing crap like that is simply too ridiculously overpowered for my likings. If anything, they should be simply a little - or 50 percent - stronger than ROTS Sidious and Yoda - who were the most powerful of either side at the time.
If they were only a "little" stronger than Yoda or Sidious, they wouldn't have been able to do what they did. It's like saying what if Hercules was only a "little" stronger than the average guy, not much of a story to tell.
Originally posted by Illustrious
No, he's overpowered because they threw the rulebook out just for him.If they were only a "little" stronger than Yoda or Sidious, they wouldn't have been able to do what they did. It's like saying what if Hercules was only a "little" stronger than the average guy, not much of a story to tell.
Yeah, um...look. You may not like Sidious -- I thought you liked Yoda, but lol, he was hardly AVERAGE. Neither of them were.
Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Yeah, um...look. You may not like Sidious -- I thought you liked Yoda, but lol, he was hardly AVERAGE. Neither of them were.
It was used metaphorically. These people were designed to fit a role that required titanic ability and powers, why do you think that the Ancient Sith were constantly fighting each other? The moral there is that bad, no matter how powerful, never wins.
NJO Luke is overpowered for a completely different reason, he's got the rulebook thrown out just so he can be uniquely powerful. Yoda and Sidious aren't "average" per se, but they don't have the earth shaking, star crushing power of the ancient Sith for good reason.
I dunno. Like I said, that's WAY too powerful. Sidious and Yoda were above average Sith Lords and Jedi Masters. Sidious is the most powerful Sith of modern times. Yoda was the most powerful Jedi of modern times - until NJO Luke.
I don't like to see people hurl stars at one another. You get into DBZ and Anime crap. People blowing up mountains and instant killing people with the damn Force.
I about ripped my DE comic when I saw what Sidious could do.
Originally posted by Illustrious
It was used metaphorically. These people were designed to fit a role that required titanic ability and powers, why do you think that the Ancient Sith were constantly fighting each other? The moral there is that bad, no matter how powerful, never wins.NJO Luke is overpowered for a completely different reason, he's got the rulebook thrown out just so he can be uniquely powerful. Yoda and Sidious aren't "average" per se, but they don't have the earth shaking, star crushing power of the ancient Sith for good reason.
Exactly. C'mon Illustrious. You mean to tell me that the ability to hurl a star or eat the Force off of a planet does NOT sound a little overpowered to you?
Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Exactly. C'mon Illustrious. You mean to tell me that the ability to hurl a star or eat the Force off of a planet does NOT sound a little overpowered to you?
You mean to tell me that a couple "above average" force users would threaten the galaxy?
Of course they are meant to be legendarily powerful foes. They're not "ridiculously overpowered," they are powered for what the role requires.
Sidious is an exception because he had VERY favorable conditions.
No, and I'll argue that.
Sidious's Force powers and skill with the Dark side were not the real reasons that he took over the galaxy. He used his genius, his skill. He used his strength in the Dark Side to simply shield himself. The rest of his plan was executed through manipulation and an intellect greater than most.
The role required was, YES, a powerful role. But they are overpowered where they don't have any weaknesses. For example. Anakin - before Dooku - seemed to be nearly unbeatable in a fight. He was a force of nature and was very powerful. But he had a weakness. He was easily used and manipulated into becoming arrogant and hotheaded.
His enemies used that.
I can't pinpoint a precise level of weakness on NJO Luke or Revan. Then you have Marka Ragnos who held an iron-clad grip over his Sith Empire, and only relinquished it when he decided to just die.
EVERYONE - Sith Lords and Jedi Masters - needs to have a WEAKNESS.
Sidious's weakness:
- Cowardice
- Arrogance
Anakin's weakness:
- Arrogance
- Temper
Yoda's weakness:
- Arrogance
- Blinded eyes (not anatomically speaking)
Mace's weakness:
- Arrogance
- Blinded eyes (not anatomically speaking)
To me, every single character in the Star Wars universe needs to have a weakness. For example. If you can't outfight Marka, talk about his mom and he breaks down.
Ya get what I mean?
Originally posted by Darth Somebody
No, and I'll argue that.Sidious's Force powers and skill with the Dark side were not the real reasons that he took over the galaxy. He used his genius, his skill. He used his strength in the Dark Side to simply shield himself. The rest of his plan was executed through manipulation and an intellect greater than most.
The role required was, YES, a powerful role. But they are overpowered where they don't have any weaknesses. For example. Anakin - before Dooku - seemed to be nearly unbeatable in a fight. He was a force of nature and was very powerful. But he had a weakness. He was easily used and manipulated into becoming arrogant and hotheaded.
His enemies used that.
I can't pinpoint a precise level of weakness on NJO Luke or Revan. Then you have Marka Ragnos who held an iron-clad grip over his Sith Empire, and only relinquished it when he decided to just die.
EVERYONE - Sith Lords and Jedi Masters - needs to have a WEAKNESS.
Sidious's weakness:
- Cowardice
- ArroganceAnakin's weakness:
- Arrogance
- TemperYoda's weakness:
- Arrogance
- Blinded eyes (not anatomically speaking)Mace's weakness:
- Arrogance
- Blinded eyes (not anatomically speaking)To me, every single character in the Star Wars universe needs to have a weakness. For example. If you can't outfight Marka, talk about his mom and he breaks down.
Ya get what I mean?
Weaknesses are all relative. I'm sure Marka had areas where he was weak, notably his reluctance to attack the Republic and expand the Sith Empire, but nobody was strong or smart enough, to exploit his weakness and dethrone him.
In the same whim that nobody was strong or smart enough to exploit Sidious' weakness until Luke came along.
Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Look. Sidious is my favorite character, but his ability to chuck people from one planet to the next and consume fleets of ships with his own Force powers is RIDICULOUSLY overpowered.Sidious and Yoda -- even though I hate Sidious's style in ROTS -- just seems right for the amount of believable. If you watch these guys, you know that they're both the daddy's (lol) of either side of the Force.
They seemed to express the proper amount of power for paragons of either side of the Force.
List of Ridiculously Overpowered Characters (in no order)
------------------------------------------------------------------
- NJO Luke
- Darth Revan
- Exar Kun
- Marka Ragnos
- DE Sidious
- Ulic
- Darth NihliusThese SIX are some off the top of my head that are WAY too powerful. Anyone who can chuck a DAMN star at their opponent, zap 'em across time and space, or destroy a damn planet is WAY too overpowered.
How is Revan overpowered?
honestly, i hate the NJO, and everything added on after ROTJ pretty much.
oldschool Jedi were good, training from very early childhood, following the light side of the Force, living true to the Code, not overpowered but obviously better than most people.
the whole thing after ROTJ in my opinion gets silly.
luke breaks tradition #1. becomes a Jedi when he's REALLY old (not in years, but compared to when most began training). and it seems all the Jedi he train follow the same path because that's just how it is.
i have to ask this..anakin starts training at what...7? 8? and he gets trained in the light side of the Force, and with the Code, and everything that's actually Jedi-like. and yet he's still too old, and ends up being Darth Vader.
now Luke is about 10 years older, but that's just fine now...and he can become a Jedi Master that does a whole bunch of feats no one's ever heard of? silly.
so now we've created this crazy powerful Jedi-punk that's simply there because no one else is. now he needs an enemy, so let's say this race comes in from no where with a gigantic army...enough of a challenge. oh wait, we made Luke too powerful, let's add to the army and say the Force doesn't affect them, sabers can't immediately damage their armor, and they have so many things better than the New Republic that it's basically screwed.
oh well, NJO Luke needs to be ridicolously(sp?) powerful so he finds away to defeat these guys....yay.
Originally posted by Lord Simus
[QUOTE=4879200]Originally posted by Illustrious
[B]No, he's overpowered because they threw the rulebook out just for him[B]You mean for not following the Jedi Code! The code was dead forgotten for 2 decades by the time ANH came around. So he didn't know you couldn't use the force to attack.
If NJO Luke uses the darkside, he goes against everything he stood for in that throne room in ROTJ, as he cast down his weapon and said "I'll never join the dark side. I'm a jedi, like my father before me."
The idea that Luke would consider using dark side powers (NJO) or that he would join evil even under pretense (DE) totally undermines his character and makes him no longer the hero. Only, he gains the luck and mega powers of a hero that people often live themselves through. Note how he always wins.
and the dead Code thing. surely Obi-wan knew it. wouldn't he have taught Luke that first thing in his training? or Yoda even? Yoda probably could've spent months teaching Luke the Code...did Lucas screw up? or are we assuming something?
if the 2 most powerful remaining Jedi both have time with Luke to train..and don't tell him the Code first off...there's something wrong.
Well, it's here that I give Eu dislikers some ground; post-ROTJ EU (Which is the majority) is poorly written and goes against what the movies were about.
The PT era novels are better, with the exception being perhaps Jedi Trial (Which was like Starship Troopers meets Anakin Skywalker minus any good interaction). They are also more recent, and they blend in better with the movies because they directly compliment them, not build off onto their own.
Eu before the PR era isn't too bad. Sure, the Force users are exotic and have amazing powers, but it's surviveable. At least they stick to the focus of the series, which is good triumphs over evil in the Force.