Originally posted by Jury
Divinity and Humanity are entirely distinct to each other... and can't be found in one entity.Divinity = God
Humanity = Man
Divinity + Humanity = Absurditygambit12 mon ami
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counsellour, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6
The Christ must be God in flesh. That is one of the criteria of the Christ. Jesus was the fulfillment of this scripture. Jesus was God.
Originally posted by Nellinator
Then you cannot accept Christ as the Messiah."For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counsellour, [B]Mighty God
, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6The Christ must be God in flesh. That is one of the criteria of the Christ. Jesus was the fulfillment of this scripture. Jesus was God. [/B]
So Jesus is also being referred to as the Father there?
He referred to Himself and prayed to Himself everytime He utter "Father..." ?
Originally posted by NellinatorYou really believe all that?
Then you cannot accept Christ as the Messiah."For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counsellour, [B]Mighty God
, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 9:6The Christ must be God in flesh. That is one of the criteria of the Christ. Jesus was the fulfillment of this scripture. Jesus was God. [/B]
*["Oh. Isaiah 9:6. So Jesus is also being referred to as the Father there?
He referred to Himself and prayed to Himself everytime He utter 'Father...'" ?]
***Isaiah 9:6 says the following: "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace." (Isaiah 9:6).
When Isaiah 9:6 says that Jesus' name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, etc.,...it is NOT saying that Jesus is the eternal Father, BUT that he has the "characteristics" of God. In other words, Jesus has all the "attributes" of God, including ETERNALITY.
In the ancient Jewish culture, names had meanings. We can better understand this by noting American Indian names such as "Running wolf" or "Fighting Bear." The same with Jewish names. They had meanings. Isaac, for example, means "laughter." Noah means "rest"
or "peace." So, when Isaiah is speaking of the name of the coming Messiah and says his name will be Mighty God, Eternal Father, etc, it is telling us about the "characteristics" of the Messiah to come in a prophetic manner.
If Jesus' name is "Eternal Father," then why don't we call Jesus "Eternal Father"? For that matter, why don't we call his name "Wonderful counselor," or "Mighty God," or "Prince of Peace"? The text speaks of a name, yet has four things revealed in the name. Again, this shows us that it is the "characteristics" of the THEN-coming Messiah.
The fact that the Messiah would be DIVINE is verified in [Heb. 1:3], when it says, "And He [Jesus] is the radiance of His [God] glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of
His power..." This also explains WHY Jesus said, "...He who has seen Me HAS SEEN the Father," [John 14:8]. It was because Jesus so precisely REPRESENTED God the Father as His prophesied name reveals.
Furthermore, you assert that God's name is really "Jesus." But,
if that is true, and if Jesus is the eternal Father as you claim, then why don't you call Jesus "The Eternal Father" as His name? Does it also mean that the mode that God is in right now is that of the Father since His name is "Eternal Father" implying He is always the Father. If that is
taken literally, then God is the eternal Father, and the true person of the Godhead is the Father, not the Son as you assert.
Your theology is incorrect and improperly describes the true and living
God.
Marchello
Originally posted by Marchello
***Isaiah 9:6 says the following: "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace." (Isaiah 9:6).When Isaiah 9:6 says that Jesus' name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, etc.,...it is NOT saying that Jesus is the eternal Father, BUT that he has the "characteristics" of God. In other words, Jesus has all the "attributes" of God, including ETERNALITY.
In the ancient Jewish culture, names had meanings. We can better understand this by noting American Indian names such as "Running wolf" or "Fighting Bear." The same with Jewish names. They had meanings. Isaac, for example, means "laughter." Noah means "rest"
or "peace." So, when Isaiah is speaking of the name of the coming Messiah and says his name will be Mighty God, Eternal Father, etc, it is telling us about the "characteristics" of the Messiah to come in a prophetic manner.If Jesus' name is "Eternal Father," then why don't we call Jesus "Eternal Father"? For that matter, why don't we call his name "Wonderful counselor," or "Mighty God," or "Prince of Peace"? The text speaks of a name, yet has four things revealed in the name. Again, this shows us that it is the "characteristics" of the THEN-coming Messiah.
Okay. Before we get into Isaiah 9:6 again, I may ask you...
Do you believe that God [the Father] is distinct to Jesus [the Son]? And therefore not of the same person?
This is just to clarify your contention.
Originally posted by Marchello
The fact that the Messiah would be DIVINE is verified in [Heb. 1:3], when it says, "And He [Jesus] is the radiance of His [God] glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of
His power..." This also explains WHY Jesus said, "...He who has seen Me HAS SEEN the Father," [John 14:8]. It was because Jesus so precisely REPRESENTED God the Father as His prophesied name reveals.
Oh. So your contention is clear. The Father and Jesus are distinct to each other. Believing that the Father is God and Jesus is God... this must appear that you believe in TWO distinct Gods. Am I not right?
Originally posted by Marchello
Furthermore, you assert that God's name is really "Jesus." But,
if that is true, and if Jesus is the eternal Father as you claim, then why don't you call Jesus "The Eternal Father" as His name? Does it also mean that the mode that God is in right now is that of the Father since His name is "Eternal Father" implying He is always the Father. If that is
taken literally, then God is the eternal Father, and the true person of the Godhead is the Father, not the Son as you assert.Your theology is incorrect and improperly describes the true and living
God.Marchello
I didn't assert God's name is "Jesus". Can you quote me on that?
I am asking Nellinator if the "Mighty God", and the "Eternal Father" refers to Christ in Isaiah 9:6. Asking this for clarification also.
I'm not making assertions yet.
🙂
Originally posted by Jury
I am asking Nellinator if the "Mighty God", and the "Eternal Father" refers to Christ in Isaiah 9:6. Asking this for clarification also.I'm not making assertions yet.
🙂