Jesus Christ

Afterall, the fact remains that you did not answer my simple question.
You only post the passages which I previously posted with Biblical explanations.

The passages you posted like:

"I and My Father are one"
"The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit... these three are one."

etc.. did not answer my question. They didn't even prove your own view in this discussion.

For the sake of argument, here is my question:

Does the Bible say that God is made up of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Yes or No. ... If Yes, where?

If No... end of discussion between you and me.

🙂

No, you are lacking many explanations. It comes down to you avoiding a lot of things. Its clear that you can not support your position sufficiently so.

Quoting things that other people have said is also important in discussions such as these.. of course to emphasize the person's original point of view... for the sake of the argument.

Ex. You argue within this discussion because you believe that Jesus Christ is part of one God, along with the Father and the Holy Spirit. But you said earlier that Jesus is not exactly God (a statement of being not sure). It also appears that you agree that the Trinity doctrine, though the word is not mentioned in the Bible, is also a concept found in the Bible. But the Trinity, in its primary sense, declares that Jesus is God - the sense that you do not basically believe.

For the sake of the argument, you need to be consistent with your views, not with obvious contradictory statements.

You are quoting things that others have said because you personally have no clue what you are talking about. Yes, when I said he is not exactly God, that meant that he himself did not make up all that is God. The man on earth, was a man but from the word. You need to get yourself a dictionary and find out the meaning of contradiction. Clearly right now your understanding is extremely lacking.

I already pointed out to you how logos is used, that jesus has stated he was with the father. Your silly explanation is that it means he was a plan. So then too was the holy spirit a plan? No, your statements are nonsensical.

Jesus can know all things in the sense that the Father, the only true God, can give Him all the wisdom and therefore can know all things. It is also the same as the Father can give Him all the authorities in heaven and in earth to fulfill God's will. That is very basic Biblical sense.

Give me biblical support where it says that. Because I gave you biblical support where it says that the Lord knowest all things.

But the truth remains that Jesus is different from God. According to Him, No one knows when His Second Coming will be, only the Father. The truth therefore remains that Jesus is not God. Now, how can you say that He is part of that one true God when He is not God?

Ive already explained this one.

Afterall, the fact remains that you did not answer my simple question.
You only post the passages which I previously posted with Biblical explanations.

The passages you posted like:

"I and My Father are one"
"The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit... these three are one."

etc.. did not answer my question. They didn't even prove your own view in this discussion.

😆 Denial kid, denial. Those three are one, that is rather self explanitory. Just as it is when Jesus says that he and the father are one.

For the sake of argument, here is my question:

Does the Bible say that God is made up of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Yes or No. ... If Yes, where?

If No... end of discussion between you and me.

😆 It states that those three are one, which is it what I have been saying. Where as you have been saying they arent at all, which is most certainly incorrect as ive shown. Ive already even pointed out where it said Jesus was the true God sitting on his fathers hand. Its presumably the reason why God uses the term us when he is talking about creating and so on. Ive already shown you what Logos means in the context of the bible. Ive already pointed out to you that Jesus created everything and yet you deny it. When I show you biblic scripture, you deny it. That isnt a satisfactory arguing technique.

John 1: 18 No one has ever seen God, but God the one and Only, who is at the Father's side, has made him known.

To answer your question as I have countless times already, yes there is is biblical support and Ive already shown you some but not all.

However, this should end on the basis of you having nothing knowledgeable to add to the discussion.

It says that he was with God before the world was and it was by/through him that all was created. Jesus said that he saw abraham and was BEFORE abraham. Jesus says that he is the alpha and omega. Jesus says that he was with God before the world was.

Never does Jesus say (as you so claim) that he just began in Mary's womb.

In fact, Jesus said after he died that he would go BACK to the father.

Show some biblical support to say that Jesus was not the alpha and omega (As he so says and says that he was with God in the begining, sent from heaven, went back to heaven, was with God before all was).

You should also show some biblical support about Jesus saying that he was the one and only God.

If you havent realized, ill inform you. There is a reason why Jesus was not like the rest of Mankind. The reason is that he was sent FROM heaven. There is a reason why it is through him that you can get eternal life and speak to the father. There is a reason why the father the son and holy spirit are mentioned TOGETHER many a time. There is a reason why Jesus says that he is in the father and the father in him.

Go on.

Its funny that even of the explanations you have tried to give thus far, they are not written in the bible. You have given your own interpretation and in doing so also denied what very words were given countless times.

You argument doesnt even measure up to your request.

In the beginning it says that the spirit hovered over the waters also God said let US make man in our image. It says in scripture that Jesus is the image of the invisible God, and that all things were created for Him visible and invisible. All three were there as one in the beginning.

🙂 Very nice responses, clickclick. Anyway, I understand how you avoid to answer my question, which until now you did not answer.

Where in the Bible does it say that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, are all parts of one true God?

You say you had post some... when in fact you didn't.
To sum it all, you believe that the statement of Jesus saying:

"I and my Father are one"

proves your idea that Jesus is part of one true God. Also the statement:

"The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. These three are one."

My additional question is this:

When Jesus said "I and My Father are one"... did He mean to say they are one of being God? Remember that Jesus only said "I and My Father are one." Now, in what way are thay one? The Bible has the answer... But I already had posted this several times already. Just read the precedingp verses... you'll know why Jesus proclaimed that He and the Father are one. I am sure that it is not about He and the Father as being one God.

For the sake of argument, here it is:

“I and My Father are one”

Note that Christ did not say, “I and my Father are one God.” He did not say that He is the Father Himself. Neither did He say, “I am my Father.” If that is what He meant then they must be one in number. But are they one in number? Certainly not!

As far as number is concerned, Christ and the Father are two. That makes Christ’s judgment or decision true because He is not alone in making it; there are two of them: He and the Father (Jn. 8:16-18, Amplified Bible)
In saying that, “I and my Father are one,” did Christ mean to say He is God? What did Christ mean, therefore, by the phrase “I and my Father are one”? What was the context of Christ’s statement when He said, “I and my Father are one”? The preceding verses have the answer:

“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand” (John 10:27-29, KJV)

Notice that Christ and God have something in common. That is, no one can pluck out of Christ’s and God’s hand the sheep given to Christ. Therefore, Christ and God are one IN TAKING CARE of Christ’s sheep, not one in nature or in being.

It's the Bible which explains. 🙂

Originally posted by clickclick
No, you are lacking many explanations. It comes down to you avoiding a lot of things. Its clear that you can not support your position sufficiently so.

You are quoting things that others have said because you personally have no clue what you are talking about. Yes, when I said he is not exactly God, that meant that he himself did not make up all that is God. The man on earth, was a man but from the word. You need to get yourself a dictionary and find out the meaning of contradiction. Clearly right now your understanding is extremely lacking.

I already pointed out to you how logos is used, that jesus has stated he was with the father. Your silly explanation is that it means he was a plan. So then too was the holy spirit a plan? No, your statements are nonsensical.

You said: Jesus Christ is not exactly God... at first you said you were not sure (actually, if you are not that sure, then what's the use of your argument?). Later on you said that the concept of Trinity is in the Bible, even though the term can not be found in the Bible. That's why I remind you of the concept of the Trinity... which basically contradict your idea. But then just recently you said that the reason why you said Jesus Christ is not exactly God because "he himself did not make up all that is God". Same thing with the Holy Spirit. You didn't mean to say that the Holy Spirit is God because the Holy Spirit is part of God. Another contradiction with the concept of the Trinity. So I suggest, be consistent.

I remember you said, that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are different manifestations... you are not agree with the concept that each is a separate God because you believe that these three are parts of one God. My additional question is this... If these three are parts of one God, then why did Jesus introduced the Father as the only true God in John 17:1-3?

Which are we going to believe?

You said: One God = Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
Or the Bible said: One true God = Father.

🙂

Regarding the "Logos"... I suggested you before that you read my post again. There must be the reason why did Jesus proclaimed He was with the Father. He also declared that before Abraham was born, He was. But, it is not the same as saying that Jesus Christ Himself was there with God in the beginning, right? If the Bible only proclaimed that Jesus Christ Himself was there with God in the beginning and later He became flesh and lived with us as human being, so be it... but there's no such notion in the Bible what was there in the beginning was the "Word"... the "Logos"... the "Verbo"... If it was Jesus Christ Himself, John would explicitly say so. There must be the reason why he used the term "Word". I already have posted it.

Okay, I'll be back for the rest of your posts.
Don't worry. You'll learn why did God used the term "Us" during the creation.

Just one more question, Does the statement: "The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. These three are one." mean to say that these three are parts of one God? Remember that it didn't say "These three are one God". There's a very big difference, my friend. There is.

Be back soon. See you.

🙂

clickclick, there's a reason why we have the number 3 and the number 1 - the two are not the same; 3 cannot become 1. 🤣 You are so illogical in your arguments and on top of that so proud of it - it's hilarious how you make a fool of yourself.

I didnt say three God's make up one God. I said those three parts are all of God.

The hilarious (and nonsensical) idea of god being a trinity is stolen from pagan religions anyway. Why would god need to be made up of three parts? Perhaps an attempt to make the idea of god more easily understandable.....more human?

You said: Jesus Christ is not exactly God... at first you said you were not sure (actually, if you are not that sure, then what's the use of your argument?). Later on you said that the concept of Trinity is in the Bible, even though the term can not be found in the Bible. That's why I remind you of the concept of the Trinity... which basically contradict your idea. But then just recently you said that the reason why you said Jesus Christ is not exactly God because "he himself did not make up all that is God". Same thing with the Holy Spirit. You didn't mean to say that the Holy Spirit is God because the Holy Spirit is part of God. Another contradiction with the concept of the Trinity. So I suggest, be consistent.

No, I didnt say that I was not sure. No need to lie here, I said that he wasnt exactly God. That was the extent of it. Unfortunately as is obvious, you are misrepresenting the things I have said.

Never did I claim that Jesus made up all that was God. Nor did I the holy spirit. That is not in conflict with the concept of the Trinity.

As to "just saying recently". God back and quote me if you wish because I havent changed my tune just the slightest. I made it clear that I was saying he wasnt exactly God back then because he was part of not the totality.

Again, suggesting that I have been anything but consistent is completely false. To suggest that I have contradicted myself is baseless.

I remember you said, that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are different manifestations... you are not agree with the concept that each is a separate God because you believe that these three are parts of one God. My additional question is this... If these three are parts of one God, then why did Jesus introduced the Father as the only true God in John 17:1-3?

Which are we going to believe?

You said: One God = Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
Or the Bible said: One true God = Father.

smile

Regarding the "Logos"... I suggested you before that you read my post again. There must be the reason why did Jesus proclaimed He was with the Father. He also declared that before Abraham was born, He was. But, it is not the same as saying that Jesus Christ Himself was there with God in the beginning, right? If the Bible only proclaimed that Jesus Christ Himself was there with God in the beginning and later He became flesh and lived with us as human being, so be it... but there's no such notion in the Bible what was there in the beginning was the "Word"... the "Logos"... the "Verbo"... If it was Jesus Christ Himself, John would explicitly say so. There must be the reason why he used the term "Word". I already have posted it.

Ive already pointed out to you where it said that Jesus the one and only God was sitting on the fathers right hand.

Jesus is saying that they may know you, the only true god (didnt say what makes up god) and this would be opposed to all the fake Gods. Something that is spoken about numerous times in the bible.

Phil. 2:6-8

Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in the human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death-even death on a cross.

This seems telling enough but should you require more speaking on this passage, I will oblige.

Not only did he say that before Abraham was born he was. He was saying that in response to being asked how he SAW abraham. Jesus even says that he is the alpha and omega. Jesus Christ didnt get that name until he came to earth. That is another thing that is made clear in the bible.

Check.

Phil 2-9 Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under earth, and every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

If you believe that sending the son to earth was a plan, I agree with that. However, if you think he was just a concept until mary, you clearly have denied what the scriptures have taught us.

The hilarious (and nonsensical) idea of god being a trinity is stolen from pagan religions anyway. Why would god need to be made up of three parts? Perhaps an attempt to make the idea of god more easily understandable.....more human?

A trinity is most certainly not more understandable. As to being stolen, you just dont get it. Im not surprised though.

😂 You are so ignorant! It was stolen from pagan roman mythology - also go read up on Mithraism - the origin of the New testament!

You are so ignorant! It was stolen from pagan roman mythology - also go read up on Mithraism - the origin of the New testament!

Again, im sorry that you do not understand this. For one, the concept of the trinity is not without reference in the old testament. Beyond that, there is an obvious reason why a false trinity or trinities would be taught.

Yes, the false trinity of christianity!

Originally posted by clickclick
I didnt say three God's make up one God. I said those three parts are all of God.

Since you believe that the concept of the Trinity is found in the Bible, which is:

The Father is God.
The Son is God.
The Holy Spirit is God.

Since these three are of different "persons", meaning they are different from each other.

To make it clear: The Father is not the Son and the Son is not the Holy Spirit. Logically speaking, we have three distinct persons. Right? - which according to Trinity, each is God.

So if these three are different "persons", and each is God, we will end up with three different Gods.

You know what the problem is? The Trinity itself does not admit that logical point of view. This is what makes the Trinity absurd - in the very sense that it defies reason.

...there is a general agreement among theologians that this dogma is a strict mystery...
... that reason alone ... cannot know it ... cannot positively demonstrate it.
-Edmund J. Fortman
The Triune God: A Historical Study of the Doctrine of the Trinity
p. 289

Now, if you don't believe that each of these three is God, then you probably not believing in the Trinity. So there is no use of holding on a perception that the Trinity is in the Bible.

The doctrine of the Trinity as commonly defined is not found in the Bible. For we assert that there are three persons in one God - a statement not found in Scripture.
Richard W. Chilson
Full Christianity: A Catholic Response to Fundamental Questions
p. 25

🙂

Originally posted by clickclick
No, I didnt say that I was not sure. No need to lie here, I said that he wasnt exactly God. That was the extent of it. Unfortunately as is obvious, you are misrepresenting the things I have said.

Never did I claim that Jesus made up all that was God. Nor did I the holy spirit. That is not in conflict with the concept of the Trinity.

As to "just saying recently". God back and quote me if you wish because I havent changed my tune just the slightest. I made it clear that I was saying he wasnt exactly God back then because he was part of not the totality.

Again, suggesting that I have been anything but consistent is completely false. To suggest that I have contradicted myself is baseless.

Here is my point. If you really rely on the concept of the Trinity, you would perfectly say that Jesus Christ is God. That's what Trinity is - Three Gods in one God.

🙂

Originally posted by clickclick
😆 Denial kid, denial. Those three are one, that is rather self explanitory. Just as it is when Jesus says that he and the father are one.

Originally posted by clickclick
😆 It states that those three are one, which is it what I have been saying. Where as you have been saying they arent at all, which is most certainly incorrect as ive shown.

1 Jn 5:7- 8, (NIV)
7 For there are three that testify:
8 the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.

1 Jn 5:7- 8, (RSV)
7 And the Spirit is the witness, because the Spirit is the truth.
8 There are three witnesses, the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree.

1 Jn 5:7- 8, (ASV)
7 And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is the truth.
8 For there are three who bear witness, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and the three agree in one.

1 Jn 5:7- 8, (NRSV)
7 There are three that testify:
8 the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three agree.

Notice the difference?

As recorded, the authenticity of I John 5;7-8 of the KJV has long been in question.

That statement as underlined above in the KJV is what the bible scholars commonly call the "Johannine Comma". Scholars seriously question the authenticity of the Comma because it is absent in all the ancient Greek manuscripts of the New Testament (New Catholic Encyclopedia, vol. 7, p. 1004).

The Johannin Comma started as a gloss or a commentary, but it eventually found its way into the text itself. The rendition of I John 5:7-8 of the KJV is clearly erroneous and prejudice.

Granting without conceding for the sake of argument that the verse indeed exists and speaks of the "father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost," still there is no mention that these three are one God.

They simply are one in being witness.

The same with the verse "I and My Father are one"... Christ simply means they are one in accord.. one in taking care of the flock.

You want more Bible versions?

1 John 5:7-8 (New American Standard Bible)
7 For there are three that testify:
8 the Spirit and the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.

1 John 5:7-8 (Contemporary English Version)
7 In fact, there are three who tell about it.
8 They are the Spirit, the water, and the blood, and they all agree.

1 John 5:7-8 (New Living Translation)
7 So we have these three witnesses--
8 the Spirit, the water, and the blood--and all three agree.

🙂