Originally posted by leonidas
he came pretty damn close. at least a portion of his power seems to have to do with energy absorbtion. again, i see no reason why he couldn't absorb the energy form of onslaught. and it wasn't full potential nate that he was dealing with -- had it been, he never would have been able to steal his powers in the first place.
Tyrant's energy absorption abilities are limited to life energies - the absorbed Galactus' attacks because it was comprised of life energy. He got weaker whenever Galactus ate a planet because it reduced the amount of life energy available on the universe. That's the extent of his absorption. Onslaught's attacks are psionic, eletromagnetic, hyperspatial in nature, and with reality warping, it becomes limitless. So using the Galactus battle isn't a good guage for determine how he could or would fight Onslaught.
<<A lot of that was CIS, though - bravado made to demonstrate a point. I'm not taking that into consideration for this fight. If Onslaught created the sun inside the Earth's orbit...he would have wiped them out with ease. He didn't because he wanted them to live to "behold his mighty hand"....for whatever reason.>>there you go with that CIS label again . . .
It's true! I use the CIS label all the time! Like in that thread about....no wait, I used it in that debate we had about....no, that's not it...you know something, I NEVER use that CIS label. So I don't know what you're talking about.
seems more logical to say he just didn't know how to use frank's powers adequately enough.
Um....isn't that CIS? And secondly....if you warp reality, all you have to do is WANT it to happen. Franklin created a pocket universe and he doesn't know how to use his own powers. Onslaught could have wished the whole lot of them away to oblivion (or bolivia). But considering that was the last issue of the Onslaught storyline, that wouldn't have been very productive, would it?
and if he did it inside the earth's orbit it seems likely he would have killed himself as well.
Not if you can no longer be physically touched, it's not.
In this fight, we're turning off PIS and CIS.>>and apparently turning on a lot of WHAT IFs and FULL POTENTIALS. nate wasn't full potential when onslaught had his power. what makes you think he could access his full power? certainly nothing from the story. frank himself didn't know how to use his power effectively. again, what makes you think onslaught could do so? nothing in the story aside from that sun demonstration which was pretty meaningless. onslaught spent most of his time shielding himself in that fight. to claim he didn't wipe them all out because of cis doesn't sit well. facts are facts in the fight. he was injured by the heroes, broken by hulk, absorbed by the heroes. tyrant (no where near full power judging by all the power-holding orbs that were around) effortlessly took down a group of high powered cosmics and decimated thanos (much worse than odin did) until thanos used some of tyrant's own power against him and that STILL wasn't enough. ultimately, tyrant even outsmarted thanos!
This shows that you don't grasp the very nature of Onslaught. Onslaught is a gene vampire - he doesn't steal the POWERS of those he absorbs, he imprints their X-gene. He doesn't take the power level they function at, he takes the mutant ability - it doesn't matter if he didn't take Nate when he was at full potential. Nate becoming full potential was a mental obstacle for him, not a physical one. It doesn't matter if Onslaught took Franklin's power when Franklin didn't know how to use it. If he has Franklin's infinite reality warping X-gene, that means he has accees to Franklin's FULL POWER.
I mean, let's think about this logically, Leon. What are you saying is Onslaught's nature? Are you trying to tell me that we should limit Onslaught to what he's already done? Or are you trying to tell me that we should limit Onslaught to the most that any of the characters he imprinted has done? Where is the line drawn? Onslaught created a small sun within earth's orbit. If your "rules" state that Onslaught is limited to what he's already done, does that mean you'd dismiss me saying that Onslaught could create, say, a small moon in earth's orbit? How about a bigger sun? Are you trying to tell me that Onslaught would be incapable of doing either of those things because he didn't choose to do it in a single storyline? Does that make sense to you?
And if you DO accept that, "yes, Onslaught, by virtue of having made a sun near earth's orbit, should logically be able to make a moon there if he wanted, or a sun of varying sizes if he wanted", then where would YOU draw the line? Can Onslaught make two suns come out of his hand? And if so, could he have shot his every opponent with a mini sun and killed them all? Can Onslaught make a sun right inside earth's orbit? If he wanted to kill everybody, he'd just do that. He wouldn't kill himself in the process because his final state was physically immune.
And if he can do that....why can't he, in his final state, just create a red giant and engulf tyrant entirely?
And if he can create a sun...can he create a planet? If he can create a planet, can he create two? Can he throw those planets at tyrant?
And if he took Franklin's powers, could he also make a pocket universe? Why wouldn't he have that potential?
I think it comes down to our fundamental difference in rules of engagement. I believe that if Onslaught has imprinted the X-genes of four mutants, he has total access to everything they can do...and MORE because of his intellect and ruthlessness, the way that Doomsurfer was able to take SS's power to some crazy level.
It sounds more like you want to limit that arbitrarily, and I just don't agree with that. Onslaught was at his most powerful for an issue and a half...of course we aren't going to see everything he could do in 45 pages of super crossover. It's not correct to limit him as such.
Onslaught wishes Tyrant away.