Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The circumstance in which the money was earned would ruin it for me. I'd rather give out of my own pocket with money I earned fairly and honestly. It's nothing to do with ego.They're measurable areas.
EG: There are 4 octave ranges, this is basically how high you can hit notes. People in general have a single octave range. Trained singers have maybe 2, 3 at best. 4 is uncanny talent and not many people have it. Females are the ones that usually possess this but males have been known to also, such as Jeff Buckley.
This is why it's provable. You can't sit there and say "I think Kelly Clarkson is as talented a vocalist as Jeff Buckley" because it's a fact she isn't.
-AC
So to save your ego you will rather give 2 dollars from your pocket than the possible billion...think about it, that billion dollars if not taken by you will be taken by some one else and might use it for their selfish needs, instead of you taking it and using it to help those in need.
measurable in those areas but who decides what score in each category it is in ?
two teachers worked hard all there life same school and everything..grades a test on a essay on "do you agree or disagree on this subject" write your opinion and your grade will be based off that...teacher gives kid and a then the kid takes the same test and giuve it to the other one and that teacher gives him/her a c
who has the right to measure 😖hifty:
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It doesn't cause me loss of sleep knowing these shows exist, as I said in my first post, they have a purpose.If the discussion comes up however, then there is no justifiable argument for these shows.
-AC
in certain places, they eat rats on a stick 😖hifty:
is it wrong 😖hifty:
sorry just felt like saying rats on a stick 😐
The evil German Bardock just mentioned something funny to me, with which I can only agree.
This thread, with its many impassioned defences, counters, ignorance of posts, idiocy, insight (mostly mine), drama, and personal insults, is currently fighting it out with such threads as-
'Dont you just love the Feeling of a shirt thats just been Ironed...';
'Omg!'; and,
'Anyone notice girls have boobs?'
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
So to save your ego you will rather give 2 dollars from your pocket than the possible billion...think about it, that billion dollars if not taken by you will be taken by some one else and might use it for their selfish needs, instead of you taking it and using it to help those in need.
It's not about ego, let it go Garfield. I don't give a shit what someone else is gonna do with it. My point was, if I wanted to give a billion to charity, I'd earn it my own way and fairly.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
measurable in those areas but who decides what score in each category it is in ?
It's not a matter of score, nor does who created them, have any relevance here. They exist, factually, as singing techniques and gauges.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
two teachers worked hard all there life same school and everything..grades a test on a essay on "do you agree or disagree on this subject" write your opinion and your grade will be based off that...teacher gives kid and a then the kid takes the same test and giuve it to the other one and that teacher gives him/her a cwho has the right to measure 😖hifty:
Your first scenario was irrelevant and flawed because it deals with subjectivity not factuality.
It's not a matter of right. It's a matter of there being ways to judge, so people will judge. That's all there is to it. One singer is more talented than another singer judging by the criteria for singers that has existed forever (well not forever, but you see the point). It's like asking "Who has the right to say that two ones equal two?"
You seem to be trying to play Devil's Advocate and it's not going too well.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
It's not about ego, let it go Garfield. I don't give a shit what someone else is gonna do with it. My point was, if I wanted to give a billion to charity, I'd earn it my own way and fairly.It's not a matter of score, nor does who created them, have any relevance here. They exist, factually, as singing techniques and gauges.
Your first scenario was irrelevant and flawed because it deals with subjectivity not factuality.
It's not a matter of right. It's a matter of there being ways to judge, so people will judge. That's all there is to it. One singer is more talented than another singer judging by the criteria for singers that has existed forever (well not forever, but you see the point). It's like asking "Who has the right to say that two ones equal two?"
You seem to be trying to play Devil's Advocate and it's not going too well.
-AC
So you rather only look out for you because you since no one else matters..the world revolvs around you ?
hmm, you don't give a "shit" on what some one else does with the money even if it's for evil or himself rather than you give the whole billion for a good cause because you feel you didn't earned it ? ok say you didn't earn it(they are giving you a billion to enter and do what ever(you don't have to win) so why nbot just give all of it away(if you don't keep nothing then the point ?
ok....let me translate that. Ok the guy says that you will get a billion dollars to enter and compete(you are a talented artist though) but if you feel that you don't earn it, you could still enter, take the money and donate it all for charity ? or give it to the guy named selfish bob that will use the money for himself and hisself only...Knowing this!!! then will you enter ?
The point is, no one could measure anything because it's all opinion...some one could enjoy crap music(what you will say it's crap) or some one could not enjoy it...other could enjoy(what you call good or people so called measured) and other will say it's crap...Opinion. To each his own.
Ok so if someone is not good at anything as a kid and worked 30 years practicing to sing and are decent,doe sthat give them no right to make it ?
or someone practice for 30 years and very good but doesn't have the money to progress and really needs it to support a family so they join american idol,(does that make them not talented and degrading themselves ?0
ok the post above is kind of jumbled but try to translate it because I didn't really read it over but i thionk you will get the over all point.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
So you rather only look out for you because you since no one else matters..the world revolvs around you ?hmm, you don't give a "shit" on what some one else does with the money even if it's for evil or himself rather than you give the whole billion for a good cause because you feel you didn't earned it ? ok say you didn't earn it(they are giving you a billion to enter and do what ever(you don't have to win) so why nbot just give all of it away(if you don't keep nothing then the point ?
ok....let me translate that. Ok the guy says that you will get a billion dollars to enter and compete(you are a talented artist though) but if you feel that you don't earn it, you could still enter, take the money and donate it all for charity ? or give it to the guy named selfish bob that will use the money for himself and hisself only...Knowing this!!! then will you enter ?
I don't understand how any of this is at all relevant. You can come up with all the fantasy scenarios you want and whether you choose to accept it, my answer is the same.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
The point is, no one could measure anything because it's all opinion...some one could enjoy crap music(what you will say it's crap) or some one could not enjoy it...other could enjoy(what you call good or people so called measured) and other will say it's crap...Opinion. To each his own.
Yes, that's what I've said this whole time. Have you not been paying attention to anything I've said? MUSIC is subjective, TALENT is not. It's only opinion if you are discussing what you prefer. You can't prefer talent. You can't say "I prefer Kelly Clarkson's talent to Jeff Buckley's, therefore she's the better vocalist." She's not, factually. If you prefer her MUSIC, then that's fine, opinion. You can't say she's a better singer in terms of ability, because she has no talented singing ability. She has what any trained singer could have. Ability is measureable, talent is measurable. Preference isn't.
You've confused yourself so much that you posted an essay and only two parts are relevant.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
Ok so if someone is not good at anything as a kid and worked 30 years practicing to sing and are decent,doe sthat give them no right to make it ?
What the hell are you talking about now? You have gone off in some other direction, man. You're having your own debate now.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
or someone practice for 30 years and very good but doesn't have the money to progress and really needs it to support a family so they join american idol,(does that make them not talented and degrading themselves ?0
Hahahaha, what is this? Make up a scenario day? I'm not discussing the possibly tragic family scenarios of American Idol. I'm saying that nobody who goes on there has any integrity or real talent, because they don't.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
ok the post above is kind of jumbled but try to translate it because I didn't really read it over but i thionk you will get the over all point.
Not only was it jumbled and nonsensical, but it had near zero to do with anything. Either make it relevant, make a credible point or there's no point continuing.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't understand how any of this is at all relevant. You can come up with all the fantasy scenarios you want and whether you choose to accept it, my answer is the same.Yes, that's what I've said this whole time. Have you not been paying attention to anything I've said? MUSIC is subjective, TALENT is not. It's only opinion if you are discussing what you prefer. You can't prefer talent. You can't say "I prefer Kelly Clarkson's talent to Jeff Buckley's, therefore she's the better vocalist." She's not, factually. If you prefer her MUSIC, then that's fine, opinion. You can't say she's a better singer in terms of ability, because she has no talented singing ability. She has what any trained singer could have. Ability is measureable, talent is measurable. Preference isn't.
You've confused yourself so much that you posted an essay and only two parts are relevant.
What the hell are you talking about now? You have gone off in some other direction, man. You're having your own debate now.
Hahahaha, what is this? Make up a scenario day? I'm not discussing the possibly tragic family scenarios of American Idol. I'm saying that nobody who goes on there has any integrity or real talent, because they don't.
Not only was it jumbled and nonsensical, but it had near zero to do with anything. Either make it relevant, make a credible point or there's no point continuing.
-AC
tro the thins you didn't answer and said something else well you are the master of scapegoating
as for integrity or real talent,
I just gave you a scenario of that on why some would be on idol and you didn't answer. so no one on the show is talented ?
No you didn't answer the measuring thing..because who decides whats good talent and not what the perfer
you said none because it's measured
ok whats it measured by
vocal and everything you listed before
verygood but who has the right to judge those areas ?
people that worked in the field and is experienced
ok fine but when they judge it on vocal, range and what not is still the persons own opinion because not everyone will give you the same answer, so you can not say who is talented or not because to judge is an opinion of what that particular person's standards(may not be perfer or like) but to there standards. So some people on american idol could be talented..just becaus ethey are on the show, does not mean none are talented and the people are idiot.
sure there is a fine line between carp and what is generally ok but who are you to say that everyone on idol are not talented and never worked for it ? did you go and follow all of them around to see if they worked hard or not ?
"Not only was it jumbled and nonsensical, but it had near zero to do with anything. Either make it relevant, make a credible point or there's no point continuing."
translation " I can't answer it so i will scapegoat" 😖hifty:
It's like the question why, you can not answer it like that because it will go on forever.
Originally posted by Lanahow would you judge it ? 😖hifty: is there a tool from the hardware store that measures it 😖hifty: or does opinion of some ones standards from there experience have something to do with it 😖hifty:
You're just not understanding...anyone with any knowledge of music knows scales and octaves. Based on that, it is very simply to judge how wide someone's range is.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
tro the thins you didn't answer and said something else well you are the master of scapegoating
No, I'm just not willing to get bogged down in a debate whereby you are trying pathetically to play Devil's Advocate and continue to ask me questions relating to "If you had a billion pounds". The answer to your question is no, regardless of whatever pointless scenario you wanna create.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
as for integrity or real talent,I just gave you a scenario of that on why some would be on idol and you didn't answer. so no one on the show is talented ?
You started talking about some guy's family. How were your questions even relevant?
You were asking if it's right for one person to practice for 30 years and then go on American Idol, or someone exactly the same but with no money to further their careers? What does that even mean? It has nothing to do with anything.
If you go on American Idol for any reason, then you are a money hungry whore who is willing to use their ability (good or not) to earn money despite being demeaned and puppeted. No debate.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
No you didn't answer the measuring thing..because who decides whats good talent and not what the perferyou said none because it's measured
What the hell man? Try at least typing properly. None of this is coherent. Are you asking me who decides? It doesn't matter who decides. What matters is that these parameters exist and are held up as technical ratings. Nobody really knows who, what or why the world was created, but it was created either way. Just like those measurable scales. Who created them is inconsequential.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
ok whats it measured by
vocal and everything you listed before
Go and read it again, I'm not catering to you any further because I'm getting the impression you're quite not all there.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
verygood but who has the right to judge those areas ?people that worked in the field and is experienced
If the criteria for judging is there, anyone who understands the better or worse, can judge.
This has gone so far off because of you, it's ridiculous.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
ok fine but when they judge it on vocal, range and what not is still the persons own opinion because not everyone will give you the same answer, so you can not say who is talented or not because to judge is an opinion of what that particular person's standards(may not be perfer or like) but to there standards. So some people on american idol could be talented..just becaus ethey are on the show, does not mean none are talented and the people are idiot.
No, you're missing the point for Christ's sake. If it's FACTUAL that someone is TECHNICALLY better at something than someone else, then that's it. You can't disagree. You can't say that Jeff Buckley isn't an incredible singer with regards to technique, because it's provable that he is.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
sure there is a fine line between carp and what is generally ok but who are you to say that everyone on idol are not talented and never worked for it ? did you go and follow all of them around to see if they worked hard or not ?
No but it's quite obvious by the definition of the programme itself.
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
translation " I can't answer it so i will scapegoat"It's like the question why, you can not answer it like that because it will go on forever.
No, translation: You're an unintelligible, uninformed person who is quite clearly incapable of forming any kind of post that is coherent and not painful to read.
You don't get it by now and you never will.
-AC
No, I been got it when Lana explained it but I was trying to make a different point. Also that you have to insult,discredit, say something like "You're an unintelligible, uninformed person" (or 50% of the stuff you said"😉 like it was a fact because I disagree with some of the stuff you said that, to try and get your point accross. Thats all 🙂
( Have you ever admitted that you were wrong in anything or area in your life 😖hifty: or would you debate it until you die ?)
Don't answer really 😂
Before you said people on american idol are not talented and don't work hard as if you followed them all around and heard everyone that auditioned...over 10,000 people auditioned and I am 100% sure there are atleast a decent amount of talented people.
*looks around* there comes Ac with an Axe 😖hifty:
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
how would you judge it ? 😖hifty: is there a tool from the hardware store that measures it 😖hifty: or does opinion of some ones standards from there experience have something to do with it 😖hifty:
It's not an opinion on anything. There are a certain number of notes in an octave (eight, to be exact). This is fact. If someone can sing all the notes in an octave, then it's within their range. If they can sing all the notes in two octaves, than that's their range. And etc.
Originally posted by LanaOhhh, ok thank you for explaining it.
It's not an opinion on anything. There are a certain number of notes in an octave (eight, to be exact). This is fact. If someone can sing all the notes in an octave, then it's within their range. If they can sing all the notes in two octaves, than that's their range. And etc.