If you don't have the sources, don't start arguing with me. Simple as that. EP2 Visionary is retconned by 3 newer sources. QED.
And you've failed to provide quotes from either of these supposed newer sources. Do so or you have nothing. It's not true just because Nai says it is.
Yes. You "grow out of practice" if you don't use the force for a few years - so much that you have to step into the core beam of the Valley of the Jedi to be able to use the force again. Allright.
As was made clear by the cutscenes in JO, he did that because he wanted to relearn the techniques faster so that he could get his revenge against Desann for supposedly killing Jan Ors.
Kyle cannot cut people off from the Force. QED.
What about giving me one battle of Jedi vs Sith in the time period between 5,000 and 4,000 BBY instead of trying to bullshit your way through ?
You're not going to define my points for me. I will not be forced into a corner by someone who refuses to read.
TOTJ is a martial, expansionary time. Deal with it or STFU.
And you've provided zero knowledge of what you are talking about. So why you're even trying to argue with me ? But just for you:
Except for making you look like an asshat for not knowing the chronology of the Battle of Basilisk despite the fact that you're the one with the New Chronology? Good job.
"Master Yoda went into a battle meditation..."
"and we became his lightsabers."
Sorry. This is not conclusive proof that Yoda knows the battle meditation technique. Why?
1) The narrator seems to be a clonetrooper, not an omniscient third party. Since when did clonetroopers know shit about Force techniques?
2) The rest of his sentence becomes a metaphor, meaning he is not speaking literally. Unless you want to argue that the clonetroopers literally turned into lightsabers, what evidence you have for Yoda knowing the technique is on more-than-shaky ground.
Won't happen since Yoda knows Battle Meditation.
It will happen because what proof you have is a quote from a fallible third party who was making a metaphor.
Yoda still has commanded more battles than Ulic has even seen, has 900 years of experience (including at least 5 actual "wars"😉. Then he has Battle Meditation and a 501st stormtrooper said that he turned a "suicide mission" into a "victory" on his own on Kashyyyk. Ulic gets pwned.
And I'm sure that Yoda has sparred more duelists than Ulic has, but that doesn't mean he's going to beat Ulic in a lightsaber fight. I'm sure Vodo sparred more than Exar has, but Exar didn't seem to think about that when he pwned Vodo.
Irrelevant misdirection. Ulic's an able commander.
Does "Shadowlands" ring a bell ? No ?
Have you noticed that it's still a forest? No?
7+ feet Wookies with superior strength, weapons and experience (considering that they get several centuries old) are still > anything the Krath have to offer especially when getting backup by Battle Meditation. Thanks for trying to play.
Except the battle meditation doesn't exist, the Krath are more than competant in melee on their own, the war droids will rip the wookies apart, and the wookies will be scattered by their own primitive superstitions when Aleema's illusions are unleashed.
Krath win.
Originally posted by IKC
And you've failed to provide quotes from either of these supposed newer sources. Do so or you have nothing. It's not true just because Nai says it is.
Sorry. It's not my fault that you aren't able to get yourself some books. I'm not willing to spent some nice amounts of money to buy all the originals of the books (as I tend to buy the translations) just to give original quotes on a freaking online forum.
You're not going to define my points for me. I will not be forced into a corner by someone who refuses to read.TOTJ is a martial, expansionary time. Deal with it or STFU.
Lmao. Who refuses to read here ? I asked you to give me one major conflict involving Jedi vs Sith fights before the TOTJ time and you gave me exactly zero. I'm not saying that the TOTJ isn't a martial time but it isn't more "martial" than the PT era.
Except for making you look like an asshat for not knowing the chronology of the Battle of Basilisk despite the fact that you're the one with the New Chronology? Good job.
Lmao. You are the one who's making himself looking like an asshat by throwing a battle in that happened in 3,997 BBY when I asked for battles before 4,000 BBY and then come up with such bullshit without knowing anything.
"and we became his lightsabers."Sorry. This is not conclusive proof that Yoda knows the battle meditation technique. Why?
1) The narrator seems to be a clonetrooper, not an omniscient third party. Since when did clonetroopers know shit about Force techniques?
2) The rest of his sentence becomes a metaphor, meaning he is not speaking literally. Unless you want to argue that the clonetroopers literally turned into lightsabers, what evidence you have for Yoda knowing the technique is on more-than-shaky ground.
It will happen because what proof you have is a quote from a fallible third party who was making a metaphor.
And again you're trying to argue with me from a point nonexistant knowledge. The narrator is Quinlan Vos who has actually enough knowledge about the force to recognize Battle Meditation and of course he says "lightsabers" because this is his preferred weapon - tends to happen when you're a Jedi Knight.
So ups. What I have is a direct comment from a trained Jedi Knight. What comes next ? Want to argue that Bastilla knows battle meditation ?
And I'm sure that Yoda has sparred more duelists than Ulic has, but that doesn't mean he's going to beat Ulic in a lightsaber fight. I'm sure Vodo sparred more than Exar has, but Exar didn't seem to think about that when he pwned Vodo.Irrelevant misdirection. Ulic's an able commander.
Oh...So Ulic is a prodigy in commanding battles too. Proof for that ? So far I have only seen him not being able to take Coruscant because rushing in like the hothead he is and - despite of the fact that he had a freaking army of Mandalorians in his back who striked fear to the Galaxy just 20 years later on their own - wasn't able to take over a single planet. What a military genious. So I have proof that Yoda is an able commander and you have nothing to suggest that Ulic even comes close to Yoda in commanding battles. Nice try, IKC.
Except the battle meditation doesn't exist, the Krath are more than competant in melee on their own, the war droids will rip the wookies apart, and the wookies will be scattered by their own primitive superstitions when Aleema's illusions are unleashed.Krath win.
Your TOTJ fanboyism annoys me. Battle Meditation does exist. The Krath are competant melee fighters - WITHOUT actual training in melee combat - compared to 2+ metre tall Wookies with superior strength ? The War droids using melee weapons and BOWS will rip the Wookies with superior technology apart ? And Aleema's illusions which won't work due to Yoda's battle meditation will scare them to death ? Allright.
Sorry. It's not my fault that you aren't able to get yourself some books. I'm not willing to spent some nice amounts of money to buy all the originals of the books (as I tend to buy the translations) just to give original quotes on a freaking online forum.
Then don't expect me to take your word as law. The burden of proof is on you.
Who refuses to read here ? I asked you to give me one major conflict involving Jedi vs Sith fights before the TOTJ time and you gave me exactly zero. I'm not saying that the TOTJ isn't a martial time but it isn't more "martial" than the PT era.
Who refuses to read? Some guy, looked a lot like you. Didn't seem to remember my original point that the TOTJ era was far more martial than the PT and he conveniently ignored Illustrious' point:
Originally posted by Illustrious
Let's put it this way. To argue that a bunch of people using the "diplomat's form" means a more martial era than factionalized Jedi who wear battle armor and reference each other as warriors is just plain stupid.
You are the one who's making himself looking like an asshat by throwing a battle in that happened in 3,997 BBY when I asked for battles before 4,000 BBY and then come up with such bullshit without knowing anything.
Except I threw in the Battle of Basilisk, among others, when you made the idiotic assertion that TOTJ wasn't a martial time period.
You aren't going to define my points for me.
And again you're trying to argue with me from a point nonexistant knowledge. The narrator is Quinlan Vos who has actually enough knowledge about the force to recognize Battle Meditation and of course he says "lightsabers" because this is his preferred weapon - tends to happen when you're a Jedi Knight.So ups. What I have is a direct comment from a trained Jedi Knight. What comes next ? Want to argue that Bastilla knows battle meditation ?
Except the quote is still from a fallible third party making a metaphor. He did not literally become a lightsaber, Nai, and if his single quote is all the proof you have of Yoda using battle meditation, it doesn't speak well for the possibilities of Yoda knowing the ability.
Oh...So Ulic is a prodigy in commanding battles too. Proof for that ? So far I have only seen him not being able to take Coruscant because rushing in like the hothead he is and - despite of the fact that he had a freaking army of Mandalorians in his back who striked fear to the Galaxy just 20 years later on their own - wasn't able to take over a single planet. What a military genious. So I have proof that Yoda is an able commander and you have nothing to suggest that Ulic even comes close to Yoda in commanding battles. Nice try, IKC.
Actually, he wasn't able to take Coruscant because Aleema pulled his ****ing army back, dumbass. Mandalore himself, on reviewing the battle, knew as much. Looks like you made yet another unsupported, bullshit assertion.
Your TOTJ fanboyism annoys me
Your PT-and-beyond fanboyism is blatant.
Battle Meditation does exist.
Because Nai, God of Star Wars, dictates it!
The Krath are competant melee fighters - WITHOUT actual training in melee combat - compared to 2+ metre tall Wookies with superior strength ?
Oh, now the God of Star Wars dictates that the Krath, who pride themselves on fighting with melee weapons, all of a sudden aren't trained in melee combat?
Check and see if your head is screwed on straight. We'll see what all that superior strength is good for when they're lopped into little pieces by Krath blades.
The War droids using melee weapons and BOWS will rip the Wookies with superior technology apart ?
That's why they were using blasters and ranged weapons on the Jedi at Deneba, right? Oh, didn't want to inconvenience you with the truth.
And Aleema's illusions which won't work due to Yoda's battle meditation will scare them to death ? Allright.
Yoda's battle meditation which you've consistently failed to prove exists? Oh, sure.
Ok more like skimmed through it.. On another note I just googled things and both Wikipedia and http://members.shaw.ca/david.p.z.888/star_wars/yoda.html say that Yoda possessed battle meditation, but of course you don't consider those very credible sources.
Originally posted by IKC
Then don't expect me to take your word as law. The burden of proof is on you.
http://www.starwars.com/databank/location/jediarchives/?id=eu
Read the last paragraph. Have a look at the term "Sith Holocrons" and STFU. How many quotes do I have to throw at you before you step out of your "world of constant denial" ?
Who refuses to read? Some guy, looked a lot like you. Didn't seem to remember my original point that the TOTJ era was far more martial than the PT and he conveniently ignored Illustrious' point:Except I threw in the Battle of Basilisk, among others, when you made the idiotic assertion that TOTJ wasn't a martial time period.
You aren't going to define my points for me.
You simply failed to proof that the PT era was more martial. Don't you get it ? Illustrious words won't save you since he's wrong as well. The "diplomats style" became the most used form during Sidious reign meaning it wasn't before TPM.
And the Jedi did were battle armor. Wow. Where's Ulic's battle armor ? Cay's ? Vodo's ? Arca's ? Nomi's ? Is this why one of the guys just wanted to invent Battle Armor during the Great Sith War ?
Except the quote is still from a fallible third party making a metaphor. He did not literally become a lightsaber, Nai, and if his single quote is all the proof you have of Yoda using battle meditation, it doesn't speak well for the possibilities of Yoda knowing the ability.
See answer in the other thread and stop playing "SW according to IKC".
Actually, he wasn't able to take Coruscant because Aleema pulled his ****ing army back, dumbass. Mandalore himself, on reviewing the battle, knew as much. Looks like you made yet another unsupported, bullshit assertion.
That changes his general personality (hothead) and the fact that he never commanded a battle with the exception of his nice try to take over Coruscant how exactly ? It doesn't ? Oh...great. Isn't it ?
Because Nai, God of Star Wars, dictates it!
No because Quinlan Vos dictates it.
Oh, now the God of Star Wars dictates that the Krath, who pride themselves on fighting with melee weapons, all of a sudden aren't trained in melee combat?
Oh no. The "God of Star Wars" has managed to see that Aleema and Satal started the Krath in 3,998 BBY so they had just one / two years of training at max. compared to Wookies who use Vibroblades from their early life on and pocess greaters physical strength. Do you want to guess who would be the better melee combatant ?
Check and see if your head is screwed on straight. We'll see what all that superior strength is good for when they're lopped into little pieces by Krath blades.
See above.
That's why they were using blasters and ranged weapons on the Jedi at Deneba, right? Oh, didn't want to inconvenience you with the truth.
The ranged weapons were the "bows" I mentioned and the blasters were used by the protocol droids and not by the Krath War Droids who used swords and that nice firing assembly. And "inconvenience" ? Are the War Droids resistant to blasterfire now ? No. Do they still pocess only limited cognitive devices making them target the biggest thread on the battle field first ? Yes ? Would be nice to see that droids targeting Yoda while getting wtfpwned by the Wookies in their way.
Yoda's battle meditation which you've consistently failed to prove exists? Oh, sure.
Denial is a great way of debating. Possibly the entire descriptions and paintings of the TOTJ comics is a huge line of exeggarations and therefore we can ignore them. See how stupid that is ?
You simply failed to proof that the PT era was more martial. Don't you get it ? Illustrious words won't save you since he's wrong as well. The "diplomats style" became the most used form during Sidious reign meaning it wasn't before TPM.
WTF? So everyone that was alive before TPM suddenly unlearned their previous lightsaber forms and all switched to Niman.
So everyone at the Battle of Geonosis wasn't alive or wasn't trained before TPM?
So canonically the decline of Makashi wasn't due to the fact that it wasn't as martial nor did it focus on lightsaber-to-lightsaber combat, but because Sidious came along, and decided to change everyone over to Niman. Right? The same Sidious who has to keep his cover and not give away him being a Sith has time to go meddle in the affairs of the Jedi?
The same Jedi that haven't seen a Sith in a millenia keep up the same forms?
We know that most of them in the PT era used Niman, and we know that they were more diplomatic than warlords, considering they were sent on diplomatic missions, they rarely used their lightsabers, they did not recognize a Sith, AND the one form that specializes in lightsaber-to-lightsaber was long IN DECLINE.
But wait, Palpatine comes aboard and suddenly goes "everyone must unlearn their shit and take Niman lessons!" right?
Please.