Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
Juggernaught has never beaten Thor, during the only time it was close, Thor was extremely sick.
Not to burst your bubble but Thor only won by BFR.
I doubt seriously, even if he had a full bill of health, that he would be able to damage Juggernaut in any way. Thus no matter what, he would have had to revert to BFR. Thus his being sick is moot. For if he was well and didn't use BFR, he would've lost anyway.
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
Potentially limitless, there a big diffrence from having the wand, and being able to use it. Anyway limitless is a fickle thing in comics. Please dont get into the pointless debate of 'My Infinity is bigger than yours' cos iI can assure you my Philosophy knowledge is far superior to yours.
I doubt that 😉
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
That site isnt entirely accurate, although while i believe that Juggeranught is stronger than the Thing and Iron man, i dont think he's nearly as strong as Thor or the Hulk.
I agree.
Kind of.
Hulk-Base > Juggernaut. No
Hulk-Enraged > Juggernaut Yes. By much, No.
Thor > Juggernaut Yes. By much, No.
Juggernaut used to be depicted as a Class 100. I think that is right. As now, 100 does not mean much anymore, I would say Low-Class 100 for Juggs.
Thor is stronger, and Hulk can get stronger. And, theoretically, Juggs can do more with his power as well, except that he has limited "vision".
But, like you said, his durability is the thing that keeps him dangerous to these guys.
Thor is THE baddass.
Originally posted by Accel
Thor was sick their first fight and Hulk wasn't going all out since he didn't know who he was up against.
Dude, that is just silly.
Hulk as shown almost No Restraint whenever somebody confronts him. Especially during the period, back when he was confronted by Juggernaut is street clothes.
I mean, Hulk just throws down when he feels like it. And, I think he would have had a pretty good idea that this guys was more than human, when he started getting his green butt kicked.
So, aside from the first shot, the surprise argument does not hold water.
If he was surpirsed by anything, it was the fact that somebody was manhandling him for once.
Hulk got kicked around. End of story.
Originally posted by Horrificus
Dude, that is just silly.
Hulk as shown almost No Restraint whenever somebody confronts him. Especially during the period, back when he was confronted by Juggernaut is street clothes.I mean, Hulk just throws down when he feels like it. And, I think he would have had a pretty good idea that this guys was more than human, when he started getting his green butt kicked.
So, aside from the first shot, the surprise argument does not hold water.
If he was surpirsed by anything, it was the fact that somebody was manhandling him for once.
Hulk got kicked around. End of story.
He knew the guy he was fighting was strong, but he had no idea it was the friggen Juggernaut, which was why he underestimated him and held back. He didn't even expect the guy to be able to move him when he braced himself.
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
Its a pitty that its is compliant with his first appearnce none the less. Youre point is mute !
uhhuh...yeah whatever. So a doomsday who can barely hurt superman at first when he stiffened his chest muscles is in compliant on the period where he took on multiple Gl's and mutliple superpowered planets. Or the fact that other versions cannot be KO'ed for a long time considering by physical attacks. Or the fact that he didn't show any sort of adaptation rate nearing his origin and H/P self. Got it.
Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
uhhuh...yeah whatever. So a doomsday who can barely hurt superman at first when he stiffened his chest muscles is in compliant on the period where he took on multiple Gl's and mutliple superpowered planets. Or the fact that other versions cannot be KO'ed for a long time considering by physical attacks. Or the fact that he didn't show any sort of adaptation rate nearing his origin and H/P self. Got it.
Its quite hard to hurt someone who has EVOLVED beyond physical Injury.
Originally posted by h1a8
Not to burst your bubble but Thor only won by BFR.
I doubt seriously, even if he had a full bill of health, that he would be able to damage Juggernaut in any way. Thus no matter what, he would have had to revert to BFR. Thus his being sick is moot. For if he was well and didn't use BFR, he would've lost anyway.
We are talking about not durability, as i have mentioned previously Juggrenaughts durability is far superior. As is Ultrons, who has also mathced Thor, although having FAR inferior strength.
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
We are talking about not durability, as i have mentioned previously Juggrenaughts durability is far superior. As is Ultrons, who has also mathced Thor, although having FAR inferior strength.
Maybe I am misunderstanding you.
Sorry if I am.
I am just thinking that you are giving thor an excuse for having to use BFR before he died. If you were then I was just saying that it didn't matter if he was sick or not. The outcome what have been the same.
It Thor chooses not to use BFR while he is well then he would get beat eventually. But probably not as fast though.
Originally posted by Accel
This was Prof. Hulk, buddy, not Savage. Not all incarnations are mindless brawlers.He knew the guy he was fighting was strong, but he had no idea it was the friggen Juggernaut, which was why he underestimated him and held back. He didn't even expect the guy to be able to move him when he braced himself.
My only point is that it does not matter tha Hulk didn't know he wasthe Juggernaut when Juggs was on his "dress-down" day.
That would give the Hulk an excuse for every time he ever fought somebody new.
And, there have been tons of times Hulk fought a brand new character, and had to go all out, without holding back!
It is not a good enough excuse, and it goes against his history. I could see if you could show that Hulk NEVER fights hard when he doesn't know his oppenent, but that is not the case.
End result: Hulk lost, and lost BIG.
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
Its quite hard to hurt someone who has EVOLVED beyond physical Injury.
DD doesn't evolve past the thing that killed him.
He evolves a resistance to the level of the thing that killed him.
Superman beat him to death in 93.
Sundipped Superman, would probably beat him to death in 01.
Why?? Cuz he's able to deal out much more damage than he did in 93.
IF DD automatically evolved immunity to whatever killed him, he wouldn't have been repeated killed by the gases on Krypton.
He just kept dying and coming back stronger, until he came back immune to the potency of the gas.
Were the gas to become even more potent, he'd surely die all over again.
Thats how DD operates.
Not the once killed by fists, never killed that way again.
Originally posted by Horrificus
My only point is that it does not matter tha Hulk didn't know he wasthe Juggernaut when Juggs was on his "dress-down" day.That would give the Hulk an excuse for every time he ever fought somebody new.
And, there have been tons of times Hulk fought a brand new character, and had to go all out, without holding back!
It is not a good enough excuse, and it goes against his history. I could see if you could show that Hulk NEVER fights hard when he doesn't know his oppenent, but that is not the case.
End result: Hulk lost, and lost BIG.
He thought he was dealing with a stronger-than-normal construction worker. He didn't expect the guy to even be strong enough to move him when he was braced, thus, he underestimated, thus he was holding back.
If this was Savage or Mindless, you might have a point. But it wasn't. And you don't.
Originally posted by UniOmni
DD doesn't evolve past the thing that killed him.He evolves a resistance to the level of the thing that killed him.
Superman beat him to death in 93.
Sundipped Superman, would probably beat him to death in 01.
Why?? Cuz he's able to deal out much more damage than he did in 93.
IF DD automatically evolved immunity to whatever killed him, he wouldn't have been repeated killed by the gases on Krypton.
He just kept dying and coming back stronger, until he came back immune to the potency of the gas.
Were the gas to become even more potent, he'd surely die all over again.Thats how DD operates.
Not the once killed by fists, never killed that way again.
That was before he was DD. He was a baby in his beginning stages with no ability to regenerate under his own power. Notice that they had to clone him from his tissue. He didn't develop the power of regenerating himself to after a certain stage. The final stage is when he is called DD and not before.
You make a good and sensible argument though. But only fail to realize that in the beginning not only was he getting stronger but his evolutionary process was exponentially speeding up. To it got to a point where he would obtain complete immunity over the circumstance that killed him (no matter what the level is). That is why he became totally immune to whatever circumstance killed him after his final stage (as said by D.C.) and that is why he evolved in battle (as supposed to when dead) in H/P. That is why he totally stopped breathing and eating (this defends against all poison gases and foods).
So if you are right (in which this would contradict D.C. narrative) then at least with each blow and hit HP DD recieves he will immediately grow immunity and not be able to die. Otherwise, the omega effect should have got him (since he is not from the source) So either he was already immune or instantly adapted to OE (The latter is more scary). And the mother box wouldn't have implied that the End of Time is the only thing in the universe that can now kill him (implying that he is now beyond death or no longer can be killed).
In conclusion, if DD evolves only to the level of what killed then D.C.s narrative is false and the story is nonsense. But at least this gains him the ability to instantly adapt making him unkillable. Which is worst than not being totally immune in the first place.
Originally posted by Accel
He didn't know the true extent of whi his opponent was, so of course he wasn't going all out, which would translate to "holding back."He thought he was dealing with a stronger-than-normal construction worker. He didn't expect the guy to even be strong enough to move him when he was braced, thus, he underestimated, thus he was holding back.
If this was Savage or Mindless, you might have a point. But it wasn't. And you don't.
If Juggs had beat him with the first blow, you would be correct. But, that isn't what happened.
After the first strike, Hulk knew he had a superhuman on his hands. End of story.
If what you are saying is true, then nobody has ever really lost to Hulk, because nobody knows the true extent of his powers.
Get it? Your arguemnt doesn't work.
If I am in a fight with somebody, and they beat me up. I can't turn around and say that he really didn't win, because I didn't know he was as strong as he is. That is rediculous.
That argument is only valid if Juggernaut beat him with the first shot, BEFORE Hulk knew he was superhuman. After he knew, there were no more excuses.
And, he knew. He kept asking him who he was!
As he was losing.
Originally posted by Horrificus
If Juggs had beat him with the first blow, you would be correct. But, that isn't what happened.
After the first strike, Hulk knew he had a superhuman on his hands. End of story.If what you are saying is true, then nobody has ever really lost to Hulk, because nobody knows the true extent of his powers.
Get it? Your arguemnt doesn't work.If I am in a fight with somebody, and they beat me up. I can't turn around and say that he really didn't win, because I didn't know he was as strong as he is. That is rediculous.
That argument is only valid if Juggernaut beat him with the first shot, BEFORE Hulk knew he was superhuman. After he knew, there were no more excuses.
And, he knew. He kept asking him who he was!
As he was losing.
I never dismissed the fight as being Juggernaut's victory, but Hulk lost mainly due to his own stupidity, which caused him to believe his opponent, while strong, still wasn't on his level physically until it was too late. Hence, he was going easy.