i agree with you he was a very good qb. i guess i just kinda unloaded on you unfairly because i have had to sit all week and listen to every pundit on tv talk about what a wonderful qb he was. it just irritated the hell out of me. and my apologies to you because i ran off a little on you when i should not have. you were not saying that he was the greatest you were simply stating that he was a good qb. my apologies.
Sorry, I was actually writing to the other dude, chris something or other....I didnt even see your post while it was being written at the same time.
I got that record from the analysts on NBC. I dont know if they were right, but they said a bunch of times
But did Montana win all those games when he was QB?
Because what they said was that Aikman was the QB during all those wins, so what could of happened was that Montana was injured while the 49ers won some games.
well it said in his bio from a stats website was that he started like anywhere from 13 to 16 games a year during that span. aikman was the same way. here is the website:
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/MontJo01.htm
he had two seasons where he played only 6 or 8 games but other than that he got them all. just about.
still my bad i was still out of line and a bit rude.
Originally posted by Smasandian
Oh shut up.I never said he was the best. I said he was very good QB.
First, any QB that comes out in his rookie year isnt going to have great numbers, especially playing for a team that won 1 game. Look at Peyton Manning, he's numbers suck, but now he's considered the best.
Second, the reason behind your arguement is that he had two other players to make him better during that 6 year span of being good.
Then you said, 1997 to 2000 he sucked, well, hate to bring tell you, but oh wait, Irvin played till 1999, and oh wait, Emmitt Smith was still playing also. It was the defence, bad coaching and ego's that destroyed the Cowboys.Third,
1998, 11 Games, 59.4%, 2330 Yards, 12 TDs, 5 INTs, 88.5 Rating.
1999, 14 Games, 59.5%, 2964 Yards, 17 TDs, 12 INTS, 81.1 Rating
2000, 11 Games, 59.5%, 1632 Yards, 7 TDS, 14 INTS, 64.3 RatingThe guy had 3 bad years, first two years with an absoulate shit team, and then the last year of his career with an absoulate shit team, but wait, during those "bad" years you mentioned from 1997 to 1999, he was actually pretty good, with absolute shit teams. I think your forgot to mention how many games he played in those last years because the stats look alot worst in an regular 16 week season.
Lastly, I dont care how bad your stats are (which in the case, the stats were pretty damn good), winning 90 games in a decade, and three Superbowls as the leader of the team is a pretty damn big accomplishment. What would happen if you replaced Aikman with a guy like Aaron Brooks, or a guy like Jeff Garcia, or a guy like Mark Brunell? Would those guys win championships with the Dallas Cowboys?
Wow you just owned yourself so your willing to throw out his first two years cause they were shit teams THATS my point BUD without that allstar cast he was a shit QB who was a product of that system just like his last three years when they actually had to rely on him WINNING games he could not so half his career he was shit.
My favorite part on your meaningless rant is this:
and then the last year of his career with an absoulate shit team, but wait, during those "bad" years you mentioned from 1997 to 1999, he was actually pretty good, with absolute shit teams.. LMAO you posted his numbers remember:
1998, 11 Games, 59.4%, 2330 Yards, 12 TDs, 5 INTs, 88.5 Rating.
1999, 14 Games, 59.5%, 2964 Yards, 17 TDs, 12 INTS, 81.1 Rating
2000, 11 Games, 59.5%, 1632 Yards, 7 TDS, 14 INTS, 64.3 Rating
Yeah those are great numbers. 😂
CINCINNATI
What many people don't realize is that they have had an elite receiving corps for more years that just last year. In the past it was Warrick, Johnson, Housch, Farmer, and some other dude, and the only problem they had was getting people the ball on a consistent basis.
What is the difference between the Arizona Cardinals and Cincinnati Bengals? After MANY years of embarrassing themselves and being the team that "this is going to be their year" year in and year out, Cincy finally did something about it with Carson Palmer at the helms. The only thing is, can they keep it up this year with Indy, New England, Pittsburgh twice, and Carolina on their schedule?
Kudos to the Bungles for scheduling Indy on their preseason schedule, too. NFL teams get to schedule their last preseason game, and they chose Indianapolis, a team they play in the regular season. Most teams do it to save miles, but there's a good reason the Steelers and Browns will not sniff each other in August. Advantage: Dungy and Indy.
Everybody knows the offense, so let's explore something that's always been a disaster for them in recent years: Defense. They've got a couple of UGA punks names Pollack and Thurman who are supposed "stars on the rise." Thurman is overhyped, takes cheap shots, and overpursues - as evident on his misdirection on Willie Parker on his 38-yard gallop to the end zone that should have been a 3-yard gain. I'll take O'Neal any day of the week, but to hell with the rest of that unit. They suck.
Speaking of suckage, I guess the ice from 1990 finally thawed out, for there were actually Bengals "fans" last year! Oh, yeah, they were all over the place. I guess it was perfect timing that the Packers were in a down year and it was super-convenient to get on the Bengals wagon. Goooooo......um, let me read the index card of the team we're supposed to cheer for this year...Packers? No. Titans? Uh-uh. Oh, yeah...Bung-hollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllles!
Marvin Lewis is a very good coach with a nasty habit of poor sportsmanship. Here's a note, Marv: Don't forget the club that gave you the stepping stone for your position, and try to work on your skills attacking the opposing QB with your mouth and defending yours like he's the only one in the league that matters. In other words, go f*ck yourself.
Prediction: 0-16
CINCINNATI
What many people don't realize is that they have had an elite receiving corps for more years than just last year. In the past it was Warrick, Johnson, Housch, Farmer, and some other dude, and the only problem they had was getting people the ball on a consistent basis.
What is the difference between the Arizona Cardinals and Cincinnati Bengals? After MANY years of embarrassing themselves and being the team that "this is going to be their year" year in and year out, Cincy finally did something about it with Carson Palmer at the helms. The only thing is, can they keep it up this year with Indy, New England, Pittsburgh twice, and Carolina on their schedule?
Kudos to the Bungles for scheduling Indy on their preseason schedule, too. NFL teams get to schedule their last preseason game, and they chose Indianapolis, a team they play in the regular season. Most teams do it to save miles, but there's a good reason the Steelers and Browns will not sniff each other in August. Advantage: Dungy and Indy.
Everybody knows the offense, so let's explore something that's always been a disaster for them in recent years: Defense. They've got a couple of UGA punks names Pollack and Thurman who are supposed "stars on the rise." Thurman is overhyped, takes cheap shots, and overpursues - as evident on his misdirection on Willie Parker on his 38-yard gallop to the end zone that should have been a 3-yard gain. I'll take O'Neal any day of the week, but to hell with the rest of that unit. They suck.
Speaking of suckage, I guess the ice from 1990 finally thawed out, for there were actually Bengals "fans" last year! Oh, yeah, they were all over the place. I guess it was perfect timing that the Packers were in a down year and it was super-convenient to get on the Bengals wagon. Goooooo......um, let me read the index card of the team we're supposed to cheer for this year...Packers? No. Titans? Uh-uh. Oh, yeah...Bung-hollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllles!
Marvin Lewis is a very good coach with a nasty habit of poor sportsmanship. Here's a note, Marv: Don't forget the clubs that gave you the stepping stone for your position, and try to work on your skills attacking the opposing QB with your mouth and defending yours like he's the only one in the league that matters. In other words, go f*ck yourself.
Prediction: 0-16
Originally posted by chris_64256
Wow you just owned yourself so your willing to throw out his first two years cause they were shit teams THATS my point BUD without that allstar cast he was a shit QB who was a product of that system just like his last three years when they actually had to rely on him WINNING games he could not so half his career he was shit.My favorite part on your meaningless rant is this:
and then the last year of his career with an absoulate shit team, but wait, during those "bad" years you mentioned from 1997 to 1999, he was actually pretty good, with absolute shit teams.. LMAO you posted his numbers remember:
1998, 11 Games, 59.4%, 2330 Yards, 12 TDs, 5 INTs, 88.5 Rating.
1999, 14 Games, 59.5%, 2964 Yards, 17 TDs, 12 INTS, 81.1 Rating
2000, 11 Games, 59.5%, 1632 Yards, 7 TDS, 14 INTS, 64.3 Rating
Yeah those are great numbers. 😂
Those numbers are good dude, what do you want? Marino numbers?Keyword, Games...they guy only played 11 games in two season, and one 14 games.
In a full season, 3389 yards, with probably another 10 tds and 5 ints. Those are good numbers. 3387 yards, with another 4 tds and 2 INts again, good numbers
Your not getting it. Aikman is a good QB in any system. He puts up good numbers, not great like Marino, or Manning, but good. I never ever said he was the best, or that he was the man, but to think that Aikman only won those games and those superbowls because of Smith and Irvin? thats bullshit. The only year that Aikman was not with his other two was 2000, and 1990,.. all the other time, he was with those guys, and they won and lost together.
Cinnicinti (I dont think Botunkus likes them very much)
Strengths: Offense is good. Hopefully Palmer can get back into rythem. Johnson will have another good year.
Weaknesses: Well, defense. They got Sam Adams (it will get drunk, youll be ****ing fat chicks in no time, oh wait wrong beer) O'Neal is an interception king and they have Anthony Wright backup to Palmer. I dont know what else to say, I dont see these guys much
Prediction: 6-10 They do face to Browns twice, and Oakland once.
Originally posted by Smasandian
Those numbers are good dude, what do you want? Marino numbers?Keyword, Games...they guy only played 11 games in two season, and one 14 games.
In a full season, 3389 yards, with probably another 10 tds and 5 ints. Those are good numbers. 3387 yards, with another 4 tds and 2 INts again, good numbersYour not getting it. Aikman is a good QB in any system. He puts up good numbers, not great like Marino, or Manning, but good. I never ever said he was the best, or that he was the man, but to think that Aikman only won those games and those superbowls because of Smith and Irvin? thats bullshit. The only year that Aikman was not with his other two was 2000, and 1990,.. all the other time, he was with those guys, and they won and lost together.
All moot points I bring facts and stats if we are going by your Mindset then The NFL should give Larry johnson the single season rushing title because what he did in 9 games in full season last year me might have broken it Well might have dont mean shit in the real world.
Just to bring a little light to yor darkenss of what he was surounded by for those three years:
Charles haley- 5 time pro bowler 100 career sacks made the prow bowl 92 94 95 with cowboys 7.5 10.5 12.5 sacks..
nate newton Guard 8 time pro bowler
Jay novacek 5 time pro bowler 1990 to 1995
Emmitt smith enough said
Jimmy smith might have heard of him come up with dallas in 1992 862 receptions 12,000 yards
Mark stepnoski center 5 time pro bowler
Darren woodson safety enough said
Ken norton linebacker enough said
Leon lett DT
Russel maryland DT
Daryl Johnston FB
Michael Irvin WR enough said
Allan harper WR one of the best slot receivers ever from 1991 to 95 with the cowboys had sick YPC of 19.7 who made famous of ducking on the goal post.
Steve Beuerlein as there 2 string quaterback
Larry brown CB made the pro bowl in 94 and 95
John jett Punter one of the most reliable punters
brock marion safety enough said
darrin smith lb
kevin smith CB two time pro bowler
erik williams Tackle
pick up a guy named Larry allen future hall of famer in 1994
and in 95 they picked up a guy named Deion sanders might have heard of him..
I could go on and on my point is with this system and this is some of the talent they had in that three year strecth Steve beuerlein could have one three Rings... Troy was a good quaterback thats about it with this kind of talent they should have on 4 or 5...
Stats count when YOU say that he had shit stats in a season and thats the reason why he isnt an good QB. But if you go by game, those stats are pretty damn good.
I guess we can take away Tom Brady's Superbowl rings, how about every other QB's rings. In this day in age, you need an QB who doesnt throw interceptions during key times, and throws the one pass to get a first down in playoffs. Heck, with your reasoning, lets take away Big Ben's Superbowl ring.
Stats aren't everything. Brady's clutch as hell, but will never put up Marino/Manning numbers. But he smart and poised, probably more than those two. He's probably better in that respect, but how much does the fault lie with the entire team? You can't just pin it on the QB.
And sweet players can be on sh*t teams. No rings doesn't necessarily mean anything. Archie Manning was one of the best QBs of his day, but played with the Saints his entire career, who sucked universally (other than Manning). I don't think you can count that against him.
To me, the rings don't mean as much...especially with QBs. Teams win championships. Organizations win championships. Not individual players and/or quarterbacks.
Originally posted by Smasandian
Stats count when YOU say that he had shit stats in a season and thats the reason why he isnt an good QB. But if you go by game, those stats are pretty damn good.I guess we can take away Tom Brady's Superbowl rings, how about every other QB's rings. In this day in age, you need an QB who doesnt throw interceptions during key times, and throws the one pass to get a first down in playoffs. Heck, with your reasoning, lets take away Big Ben's Superbowl ring.
Those are shit stats I'm saying before that system of pro bowl player after probowl player he was shit when they lost most of if not all that talent through free agency after there run he went right back to shit I have proven that over and over again. HE WAS A SYSTEM QUATERBACK I'm saying before and after all that fantasy talent left it showed what he was and stats are a barometer of a quaterback he was shit for half his career.
Once again you throw out a meaningless rant Ben rothlisberger is a system quaterback Tom brady is a championship quaterback who belongs in the hall after hes done completely unshakable clutch and has carried his team to 3 rings with not that great of talent on the offensive side of the ball.
Ben rothlisberger and troy ailman are about the same rothlisberger come into a Loaded team from offensive to defense all they ask of him is to hand off and try not to throw to many pics kinda like aikman
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Stats aren't everything. Brady's clutch as hell, but will never put up Marino/Manning numbers. But he smart and poised, probably more than those two. He's probably better in that respect, but how much does the fault lie with the entire team? You can't just pin it on the QB.And sweet players can be on sh*t teams. No rings doesn't necessarily mean anything. Archie Manning was one of the best QBs of his day, but played with the Saints his entire career, who sucked universally (other than Manning). I don't think you can count that against him.
To me, the rings don't mean as much...especially with QBs. Teams win championships. Organizations win championships. Not individual players and/or quarterbacks.
Brady numbers: http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/187741
122 TD to 66 int thats Fantastic 62% completion and led the league last year in 20 yards plus completions with 59 with 4,110 yards 4 straight years of over 3,500 yards and 23 + touchdowns he puts up elite numbers..
Originally posted by chris_64256
All moot points I bring facts and stats if we are going by your Mindset then The NFL should give Larry johnson the single season rushing title because what he did in 9 games in full season last year me might have broken it Well might have dont mean shit in the real world.Just to bring a little light to yor darkenss of what he was surounded by for those three years:
Charles haley- 5 time pro bowler 100 career sacks made the prow bowl 92 94 95 with cowboys 7.5 10.5 12.5 sacks..
nate newton Guard 8 time pro bowler
Jay novacek 5 time pro bowler 1990 to 1995
Emmitt smith enough said
Jimmy smith might have heard of him come up with dallas in 1992 862 receptions 12,000 yards
Mark stepnoski center 5 time pro bowler
Darren woodson safety enough said
Ken norton linebacker enough said
Leon lett DT
Russel maryland DT
Daryl Johnston FB
Michael Irvin WR enough said
Allan harper WR one of the best slot receivers ever from 1991 to 95 with the cowboys had sick YPC of 19.7 who made famous of ducking on the goal post.
Steve Beuerlein as there 2 string quaterback
Larry brown CB made the pro bowl in 94 and 95
John jett Punter one of the most reliable punters
brock marion safety enough said
darrin smith lb
kevin smith CB two time pro bowler
erik williams Tackle
pick up a guy named Larry allen future hall of famer in 1994
and in 95 they picked up a guy named Deion sanders might have heard of him..
I could go on and on my point is with this system and this is some of the talent they had in that three year strecth Steve beuerlein could have one three Rings... Troy was a good quaterback thats about it with this kind of talent they should have on 4 or 5...
I love how you side stepped this post Smasandian.
Originally posted by chris_64256
Those are shit stats I'm saying before that system of pro bowl player after probowl player he was shit when they lost most of if not all that talent through free agency after there run he went right back to shit I have proven that over and over again. HE WAS A SYSTEM QUATERBACK I'm saying before and after all that fantasy talent left it showed what he was and stats are a barometer of a quaterback he was shit for half his career.Once again you throw out a meaningless rant Ben rothlisberger is a system quaterback Tom brady is a championship quaterback who belongs in the hall after hes done completely unshakable clutch and has carried his team to 3 rings with not that great of talent on the offensive side of the ball.
Ben rothlisberger and troy ailman are about the same rothlisberger come into a Loaded team from offensive to defense all they ask of him is to hand off and try not to throw to many pics kinda like aikman
Would you put Bledsoe in the Hall Of Fame?
Also, I love how you dont notice that I dont need to write a full length post about everything you say. All I said about those players is that its bullshit to think that somebody can win 3 superbowls and 90 games in a decade by his team, and dont tell me its because everybody else was soo good, the QB didnt matter. Everybody knows that if you have a good QB, a team will do good.
As I said before, I dont call Aikman the best, or the top 10, all I'm saying is that he was very good QB who had a tendency to win games, and to think that the QB didnt do anything during the whole decade is bullshit.
Originally posted by Smasandian
Dont forget Chris Henry!!!!Is this your most hated team Botunkus>?
No. That would be Cleveland. And I still hate the Oilers.
Oh, about this argument about system quarterbacks, what should a QB do who comes in with good players and good coaches...quit? We already covered this topic a few weeks ago. Bottom line: Outside of the rare few like Barry Sanders and Earl Campbell, most great players had good players and coaches around them, and it ain't their fault. Walter Payton, Emmitt Smith, Terry Bradshaw, Art Monk, Lester Hayes, Joe Montana, Marshall Faulk, Peyton Manning, I could type this list for days if I had to.
Call me crazy, but managing a team with a running game and avoiding mistakes wins football games. Bottom line. Otherwise, we'd all think Aaron Brooks was a great QB.
Next:
TENNESSEE
Two words: Extreme Makeover. First off, let me say that in the late '90's there were no two QB's I hated (for the Steelers) to face more than Mark Brunell and Steve McNair. Now that those two guys have left, it's a bit bittersweet because for so long every time you faced the Titans, you had to get by McNair. I cannot tell you how many times he led fourth-quarter game-winning drives against the Steelers. More than John Elway ever did, that's for damn sure.
Dyson, Mason, Wycheck, George, McNair, Rolle - all gone. Now it's the Lendale White and Vince Young era. This is strictly a rebuilding year...though I will say that they did themselves well by adding two solid free agents with Rings in Chris Hope and David Givens.
I dunno. This is a hard team to forecast. I assume Volek will QB for at least a few games before Young gets thrown to the dogs. Despite their Extreme Makeover, I think they might surprise a few people this year, and for reasons other than having Vince Young.
Prediction: 7-9