Originally posted by Nephthys
The fact that they murder, torture and rape people?
His question was what you have against the mentally ill and your answer is because they "murder, torture, and rape" people?
You have to be joking. A fraction of the mentally ill "murder, torture, and rape" people so you have something against an entire group of individuals based on what some of them rarely do? A hasty generalization, if there ever was one.
Originally posted by psmith81992
He was probably referring to those mentally ill who rape, murder, and torture people. Point is, there aren't any really good arguments to be made against the death penalty and any argument that starts with "Who are you to...." is a failed argument.
I think the fact that our justice system is far from perfect is a good one. Which is why I support it in theory but am skeptical of the actual results of trials unless obvious as hell and clearly seen due to the fact that innocent people do end up with life, and if we had a more efficient death penalty I'm sure some would be put to death.
As well as some murders not necessarily deserving death imo, obviously serial killers but in some situations the cause of killing someone are more understandable/murky and should be punished differently.
I think the fact that our justice system is far from perfect is a good one. Which is why I support it in theory but am skeptical of the actual results of trials unless obvious as hell and clearly seen due to the fact that innocent people do end up with life, and if we had a more efficient death penalty I'm sure some would be put to death.
s well as some murders not necessarily deserving death imo, obviously serial killers but in some situations the cause of killing someone are more understandable/murky and should be punished differently.
Originally posted by psmith81992
It's far from perfect. The # of innocent people being sent away or even put to death is so incredibly small, this can't be a good enough argument against the death penalty. If anything, they should make the death penalty a lot more swift. No more of this 10 year nonsense.
Being put to death is small because of how long it takes, being sent to jail is alot more common and while not the majority any amount is too much for me.
The death penalty has a lot of red tape, even when all doubt is gone, that's why it takes so long. I don't want to say it's a deterrent because there's no way to prove that but try putting a 1 year cap between conviction and death, and see how the murder rate falls.
Originally posted by psmith81992
But...Using that logic, if someone innocent is put in jail and then killed in jail...Would you do away with the criminal justice system?The death penalty has a lot of red tape, even when all doubt is gone, that's why it takes so long. I don't want to say it's a deterrent because there's no way to prove that but try putting a 1 year cap between conviction and death, and see how the murder rate falls.
As I said I'm fine with the death penalty in theory but I don't have enough faith in our justice system, though admittedly it is getting better.
And an example in my opinion of a more murky murder situation imo is say killing a violent gangbanger. Let's say you assault and kill him, not in self defense but you attacking him over something him and his crew did before. A very real situation that happens to innocent people, and you do something about it. Do you deserve death for trying to protect yourself and family from more violence?
I think our prisons are stupid as is, but I'm not going to blame society for a prisoner killing an innocent man. It's their fault for sending him but that means that they should work harder to ensure it doesn't happen. The difference to me is that when you execute an innocent man the state became the one who did the murder, we endorses flat out murdering a man. Which too me is unacceptable. A prisoner killing an innocent is horrible and tragic but this is being directly responsible vs indirectly responsible.
A very real situation that happens to innocent people, and you do something about it. Do you deserve death for trying to protect yourself and family from more violence?
Originally posted by psmith81992
On one hand, the % of this happening is so miniscule it's not worth discussing. On the other hand, you said even 1 life is too much for you so we'll have to disagree. Would you support the death penalty if there were no innocent people being put to death?I don't consider that first degree murder, or capital murder. I consider that an imminent threat and that could be construed as self defense.
Yes I would support the death penalty in certain cases if there was no chance of an innocent person being put to death. Though still only in certain situations.
Self defense Even if you went and assaulted him, with intent to kill while he didn't direct attack you? I mean i agree but I'm not sure that would fly despite him being a proven threat due to you acting as a vigilante to do it.
Self defense Even if you went and assaulted him, with intent to kill while he didn't direct attack you? I mean i agree but I'm not sure that would fly despite him being a proven threat due to you acting as a vigilante to do it.