The Exile, Darth Revan , Darth Malak vs ROTS Anakin, NJO luke, Yoda

sometimes you just have to realize there are contradictions in the star wars saga. they say that yoda is the most powerful in one book, but then have windu defeat Sideous first....

and I have no quarms with the NJO luke being more powerful then the movie luke. I just am not willing to say he is more powerful then Sadow, Kun, or Revan. I would say probably after realizing that we were talking about the NEW JEDI ORDER Luke (make urself more clear)
that he would be able to bet malak and the exile

and since the ending of the story of Revan is Not Canon since there are two possible endings, I would Say that the entire dialogue dealing with weather the light side or dark side is more powerful in that part of the game is not stable information.

I would not be so quick to say anyone is the most powerful, although I am pretty sure that luke would take Malak while the Exile fought anakin and Revan killed Yoda. then Revan would take out anakin while Luke would kill malak and then they would have a Epic battle in which both of them would perish.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
sometimes you just have to realize there are contradictions in the star wars saga. they say that yoda is the most powerful in one book, but then have windu defeat Sideous first....

and I have no quarms with the NJO luke being more powerful then the movie luke. I just am not willing to say he is more powerful then Sadow, Kun, or Revan. I would say probably after realizing that we were talking about the NEW JEDI ORDER Luke (make urself more clear)

Sadow has shown nothing on Luke's level. Kun is a very strong opponent as is Revan but the feats you mentioned as well as some others put in him higher than Kun and Revan at their peaks in power.

and since the ending of the story of Revan is Not Canon since there are two possible endings, I would Say that the entire dialogue dealing with weather the light side or dark side is more powerful in that part of the game is not stable information.

The lightside story of Revan is canon which is where Malak states that Revan is more powerful now (as a lightsider) than he ever was as the dark lord. The darkside story and anything in it (unless the same exact thing happens or is stated in the lightside) is not canon.

I would not be so quick to say anyone is the most powerful, although I am pretty sure that luke would take Malak while the Exile fought anakin and Revan killed Yoda. then Revan would take out anakin while Luke would kill malak and then they would have a Epic battle in which both of them would perish.

Luke could take any of the three opponents one on one. ROTS novel puts Yoda above Revan though a battle between the 2 would be a tough fight. The exile is simply can't take Anakin "in teh zone"
In the end in would be like this

Luke takes Revan
Yoda takes Malak
Anakin takes the exile.

vapaad is the use of such speed that it looks like your lightsaber is in more then one place at once it is also charactaristic of using your emotions to add power to your attacks. didnt see that at the emperor fight. I didnt see any point shatter except for the glass if that counts. I also dont base my statistics on who wins or loses or what a third person naratorr says, as in Rots novel.

If the battle is already lost, it is because your mind counts it as lost. IF fate makes you lose, it is because you have angered the gods.
--ancient samurai proverb.

In order to win the battle, you must already have counted yourself as lost.
ancient samurai Proverb

yes, I still keep my stance that there are a few contradictions in the star wars saga. as for your comment that the darkside way of kotor is not canon, Kotor II refers to the darkside when Bastila says that Korriban Rebelled under his rule and he gave up and disapeared. as for your stubbornness on the fact that everyone in the galactic civil war is more powerful then the ancient sith, Exar Kun was a lightside jedi until he entered the tomb of nagga sadow. I dont know much about kun but i know he is one of my fav sith. didnt his spirit come back and haunt the NJO?

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
vapaad is the use of such speed that it looks like your lightsaber is in more then one place at once it is also charactaristic of using your emotions to add power to your attacks. didnt see that at the emperor fight. I didnt see any point shatter except for the glass if that counts. I also dont base my statistics on who wins or loses or what a third person naratorr says, as in Rots novel.

Shatterpoint basically allows you to see your opponents weaknesses. Wookieepedia's description of shatter point is fairly good description of it. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Shatterpoint If you want to know more about there is a sw book called "shatterpoint" And if you want to debate here I think I should tell you that we do use quotes from the novels(likke from the rots novel which is canon), canon sources, as well as the outcome of the battle to support our basis. Like if I said that jacen killed mara jade then you could say he was losing most of the battle and had to use a trick to win or something similar to that. Essentially we follow star wars canon strictly and fanboyism(which im not saying you are) is not really tolerated to well.

vapaad is the use of such speed that it looks like your lightsaber is in more then one place at once it is also charactaristic of using your emotions to add power to your attacks. didnt see that at the emperor fight. I didnt see any point shatter except for the glass if that counts. I also dont base my statistics on who wins or loses or what a third person naratorr says, as in Rots novel.

If the battle is already lost, it is because your mind counts it as lost. IF fate makes you lose, it is because you have angered the gods.
--ancient samurai proverb.

In order to win the battle, you must already have counted yourself as lost.
ancient samurai Proverb

That's a a really good quote however it does not take into account the force and destiny which is described alot in star wars. Ex. "the will of the force"

naga sadow then haunted and coached kun till he became one of the most powerful. Exar kun was so powerful he came back from the dead, the same can be said of Sadow. These things never happened for the people you rant and rave about.

and exar kun overthrough the republic and was finally killed in a giant battle that imploded yavin and made it a gas planet. thats what I remember about Kun.

also there is a direct quote that the jedi were modeled much after the japanese epics which starred samurai. the japanese word for hero, as in the hero of our story is Jadai.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
yes, I still keep my stance that there are a few contradictions in the star wars saga. as for your comment that the darkside way of kotor is not canon, Kotor II refers to the darkside when Bastila says that Korriban Rebelled under his rule and he gave up and disapeared. NJO?

That only happens on korriban if you tell atton on the paragus that Revan became a tihb once more. However being that the lightside ending of kotor 1 is canon than any game play cutscenes or statements from characters that talk about this is not canon as well furthermore the lightside female ending of kotor 2 is canon.

as for your stubbornness on the fact that everyone in the galactic civil war is more powerful then the ancient sith, Exar Kun was a lightside jedi until he entered the tomb of nagga sadow. I dont know much about kun but i know he is one of my fav sith. didnt his spirit come back and haunt the

Kun is easily in my top 3 if not my favorite character as well. And he came back in the Jedi academy series which happens before NJO And his spirit is very strong and he knew techniques that are extremly deadly such as ebony ( or black) black lightning and thats not mentioning his saber skill or his other force techniques or the amultet blasts for that matter.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
naga sadow then haunted and coached kun till he became one of the most powerful. Exar kun was so powerful he came back from the dead, the same can be said of Sadow. These things never happened for the people you rant and rave about.

and exar kun overthrough the republic and was finally killed in a giant battle that imploded yavin and made it a gas planet. thats what I remember about Kun.

Actually that was Freedon Nadd who learned from Sadow and killed him about 400 years prior to Kun's rise. And then it was nadd who guided kun before kun turned on him.

He was on the yavin 4 moon that we see in a New hope (the temples the rebels use were either his or sadows) and where the new jedi academy is originally. And then when the jedi attacked he seperated his spirit from his body and sidious to came back to the dead sort of speak from in De his spirit escapes the death star explosion and eventually goes into a younger clone body.

And Sidious had access to many holocrons and in regards to sidious and the ancient sith-in the DE comics(empire's end) one of the sith spirits says "He gave up everything to the Dark Side long ago. He has become the greatest who ever lived. He is the strongest who ever lived....I say we give him what he wishes." For one, than he has shown to be a very powerful force user his lightning is very deadly and can kill in an instant if he wants.

that was the name. i confused sadow for nadd. and how do you know that Kun couldnt kill in a second with his lightning in a second? (he can probably) How do you know sadow cant kill with his lightning in a second? and how do you know nadd cant kill with his lightning in a second?

In the kotor games wich as you say are canon, even on the lightside, force storm kills any average person such as the beggars on taris, (yes once i hacked so i was a jedi on taris) :0 and refugees and beggars and wookies and all those peoples that you have the option of ticking off for darkside points in one cast. also, in Star Wars Battlefront II, the emperor's lightning never kills in one cast. he never uses this insta kill on any jedi therefore making it limited to just the force sensetive.

and once again who cares what the characters say? what about the naration and what george lucas says
anyway i g2g thanks for the good arguement, even thou I was right 😄

and once again who cares what the characters say? what about the naration and what george lucas says
anyway i g2g thanks for the good arguement, even thou I was right

Oh, yes. You clearly demonstrated the depth of your knowledge and the authenticity of your arguments... 🙄

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
[B]that was the name. i confused sadow for nadd. and how do you know that Kun couldnt kill in a second with his lightning in a second? (he can probably)
He might be able but he has never shown it to be instant. He did fry Gantoris who was a student of Luke's from the inside out.

How do you know sadow cant kill with his lightning in a second? and how do you know nadd cant kill with his lightning in a second?

These two have never shown to be able to wield the attack or stated to even know it for starters.Sadow hasn't shown much in terms of combat all to say he can contend with people the likes of Revan,Mace,Luke, yoda etc. Nadd has done impressive feats as a spirit and I think he is one of the most powerful ever but I would need to see what he can do alive. While Sidious's lightning has shown to kill very quickly and against for users.

[QUOTE]In the kotor games wich as you say are canon, even on the lightside, force storm kills any average person such as the beggars on taris, (yes once i hacked so i was a jedi on taris) :0 and refugees and beggars and wookies and all those peoples that you have the option of ticking off for darkside points in one cast. also, in Star Wars Battlefront II, the emperor's lightning never kills in one cast. he never uses this insta kill on any jedi therefore making it limited to just the force sensetive.

Originally posted by Count Kent
Revan can probably achieve this alone. His true light mastery would likely enable him to suppress the force from Yoda and Anakin in about a few seconds. He then would have a pretty good match with Luke, but eventually destroy him.

I agree! My Revan has Uber skill, he could take yoda and anakin. then all three sith could give luke a serious beatdown. 💃

ok btw, im back just for a parting comment;

when u use characters and reference's from video games, everyone is going to say reference from their characters. If we were having a Legend Of Zelda Debate, I would defenitely say That the four sword Ownz Vaati.... But some noob who died against the final boss mob of the minish cap might say that vaati is way more powerful.

If i were to say that legolas is better then the wringwraiths because i kicked their @$$s in Rotk some noob could easily say that he isnt because they died.

I dont think any video game material is cannon, weather you played on the dark side, or the light. I really think that revan was made to be a refreshing blast of darkness instead of another "Star Wars Redemption"

pluss there is the fun side of killing all your team mates in like 3 seconds.

No question here, my revan could beat everyones, (at least the one where i hacked the game to make him the legendary dark lord everyone says he his MUAHAHAHA) My Sideous could beat anyones (pick a game where you can play sideous... i only know of one) my yoda could beat anyones, my mace could beat anyones my anakin could beat anyones.

the only people I refuse to play are luke (frikkin noob with a bunny rabbit's face) and Obi Wan (frikken noob who couldnt do what needed to be done when he had anakin on his knees)

so dont get fed up when you try and make a thread and have a debate over weather vid game characters are more powerful then the movie characters, cause everyone who has ever played the video game will root for the video game character on the basis that their video game character is the most powerful. OF COURSE IF UR A GAMER YOUR CHARACTER WILL KICK OBI WAN in revenge of the sith, I did....

I kind of jumped into this not reading the luke (njo) thing.... I was thinking luke from rturn of the jedi.... I would have to reconsider this if I could see luke in action for myself, but everything i have witnessed about luke njo is hearsay, and the demo of JKIII jedi academy.

Originally posted by Gideon
It is because you're new. He is the most powerful Jedi in history, and one of the most powerful Force users ever.

Lol.

Does this have anything to do with this:

Originally posted by Gideon in The Battle Bar #2
I'll admit that my opinion on the versus forum and the power of the combatants has undergone some considerable modification after reading more of Publius's material.

Well-spotted, Nebaris, and yes it does.

Publius's methodology requires that an enlightened debater take into account everything, all peoples, places, and situations, none of them are ignored due to the author's hubris or unwillingness to accept certain facts. For example, though it can be ascertained that Publius enjoys the character of Palpatine above most -- if not all -- he is also one of the most staunch and avid supporters of the idea that Mace Windu defeated him in combat, not because of manipulation or circumstance, but rather actual skill. He also takes into account that characters such as Marka Ragnos, Exar Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma, Kyp Durron, Gezetherion (sp?), Darth Vader, Jerec, Yoda, Mace Windu, etc. all rival the Galactic Emperor in terms of raw power, despite his "more overt displays of the Force being peerless". He makes room for the idea that Skywalker now equals or surpasses the Galactic Emperor in terms of combat prowess. It's similar to Advent's own respectable methodology. She doesn't blindly ignore statements by the omniscient narrator that Anoon Bondara's skills were "second to none" in the Jedi Order, or write them off, because he was defeated handily by Darth Maul. She attempts (and succeeds) to make room for it in the scope of canon. So, yes, my opinions on power hierarchies have changed.

Originally posted by Lord Knightfa11
ok btw, im back just for a parting comment;

when u use characters and reference's from video games, everyone is going to say reference from their characters. If we were having a Legend Of Zelda Debate, I would defenitely say That the four sword Ownz Vaati.... But some noob who died against the final boss mob of the minish cap might say that vaati is way more powerful.

Difference is that the star wars universe is bigger than most if not all video game universes. The video game characters can and are mentioned in books and comics as well. Revan and Malak appear in the star wars knights of the old republic comics and Revan makes somewhat of a cameo via his holocron to Darth Bane. So yes they all exist in the same EU. Personal versions of the characters are not canon.Battles that take place are (ex star forge and darth bandon) canon but the details of the battles are unknown.

I dont think any video game material is cannon, weather you played on the dark side, or the light. I really think that revan was made to be a refreshing blast of darkness instead of another "Star Wars Redemption"

so dont get fed up when you try and make a thread and have a debate over weather vid game characters are more powerful then the movie characters, cause everyone who has ever played the video game will root for the video game character on the basis that their video game character is the most powerful. OF COURSE IF UR A GAMER YOUR CHARACTER WILL KICK OBI WAN in revenge of the sith, I did...

Originally posted by Gideon
Well-spotted, Nebaris, and yes it does.

Publius's methodology requires that an enlightened debater take into account everything, all peoples, places, and situations, none of them are ignored due to the author's hubris or unwillingness to accept certain facts. For example, though it can be ascertained that Publius enjoys the character of Palpatine above most -- if not all -- he is also one of the most staunch and avid supporters of the idea that Mace Windu defeated him in combat, not because of manipulation or circumstance, but rather actual skill. He also takes into account that characters such as Marka Ragnos, Exar Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma, Kyp Durron, Gezetherion (sp?), Darth Vader, Jerec, Yoda, Mace Windu, etc. all rival the Galactic Emperor in terms of raw power, despite his "more overt displays of the Force being peerless". He makes room for the idea that Skywalker now equals or surpasses the Galactic Emperor in terms of combat prowess. It's similar to Advent's own respectable methodology. She doesn't blindly ignore statements by the omniscient narrator that Anoon Bondara's skills were "second to none" in the Jedi Order, or write them off, because he was defeated handily by Darth Maul. She attempts (and succeeds) to make room for it in the scope of canon. So, yes, my opinions on power hierarchies have changed.

What about darth bane? Doesn't he rival palpatine in power too seeing that since Ro2 he is pretty strong.

Originally posted by Gideon
Well-spotted, Nebaris, and yes it does.

Publius's methodology requires that an enlightened debater take into account everything, all peoples, places, and situations, none of them are ignored due to the author's hubris or unwillingness to accept certain facts. For example, though it can be ascertained that Publius enjoys the character of Palpatine above most -- if not all -- he is also one of the most staunch and avid supporters of the idea that Mace Windu defeated him in combat, not because of manipulation or circumstance, but rather actual skill. He also takes into account that characters such as Marka Ragnos, Exar Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma, Kyp Durron, Gezetherion (sp?), Darth Vader, Jerec, Yoda, Mace Windu, etc. all rival the Galactic Emperor in terms of raw power, despite his "more overt displays of the Force being peerless". He makes room for the idea that Skywalker now equals or surpasses the Galactic Emperor in terms of combat prowess. It's similar to Advent's own respectable methodology. She doesn't blindly ignore statements by the omniscient narrator that Anoon Bondara's skills were "second to none" in the Jedi Order, or write them off, because he was defeated handily by Darth Maul. She attempts (and succeeds) to make room for it in the scope of canon. So, yes, my opinions on power hierarchies have changed.

I want to read all of this. Where is it all?

Darth Sexy, the statements authored by Publius have been made on numerous threads on SD.net. I'll look for them tomorrow.

So your saying those you mentioned. kun,vader and so on rival palpatine in terms of raw power?

What about darth bane? Doesn't he rival palpatine in power too seeing that since Ro2 he is pretty strong.

That's about right.