Originally posted by Rols
Can Wolverines claw affect Mr. Fantastic skin? I mean can he cut him? I've always thought that Reed would be Logan's worst nightmare to fight against.
in the classic x-men vs. FF book I THINK it was implied wolvie could cut the bastard.. but in the more recent enemy o the state storyline wolvie tried.. and failed miserably....
Originally posted by jinzinMy father was stabbed numerous times in many places and also in shoulder by a crazy Somalian immigrant in a mall, and he was still awake when paramedics arrived. And I don't try to claim that my father has better damage soak then Thing...and no, he hasn't been stabbed something like three times before with no trouble. He had army training, and people learn to stand some pain there.
see here's the thing (no pun intended)...obviously, Thing has an unbelievably high amount of damage soak and can take punishment at unhear of levels... I mean you only need to see his boubt with Champion to understand something as fundamental as that.. but when wolverine hit him, he bypassed straight through things exterior.. to his interior.. he mangled the insides of the thing where thing isn't used to taking abuse..
THIS at least is consistent with wolverine's claws vs. things skin.. yeah thing hit wolverine away after wolverine slashed at his face, but then he doubled over in pain.. later.. when he was fighting a giant robot he even put on a mask but when the robot hit him in the face he screamed out in pain such that no one had ever heard him do so before...
torture is kind of different, with time you're mind slowly begins to accept pain as it is given, or accept the fact that you ARE in pain.. something akin to this is sprained ankles...
yeah if you already HAVE a sprained ankle but you're aware of it and have some descipline you can easily keep up and walking/running with the right mind set.. but at that moment when you sprain the ankle the shock to your nervous system and your brain are both too instantious for you to do anything but fall over.. same thing applies to this feat...
again.. for it to TRULY be PIS there has to be multiple examples of thing getting scewered up to 3 times in a single sitting without going down.. otherwise PIS is nothing more than a copout here like it usually is...
and capt is right about the nerve cluster part... but that's only if you REALLY want to rationalize what happened...
What does Thing have? That's right, army training. Included with his time in Fantastic Four, where he had such things like:
Sentient dissolving his skin and hurting his insides TWICE, and he didn't faint.
Doctor Doom torturing him with different ways, such as beating him on so much that pieces of his skin were ripped off, and showed the muscles under them...didn't faint.
Doctor Doom also drove multiple pieces of magically enchanted roots through him in many places, inculding shoulder...didn't faint.
It was PIS, plain and simple. Like so many encounters Wolverine has with his fellow heroes...💃
Originally posted by Grimm22
I know, but it would be funny to see him use his claws to cut them 😐Can't wait for Kitty to kick Emma's ass next issue 😄
That's not going to happen, Emma ain't evil!! (Fine I'm in denial, but Joss Whedon is Joss Whedon)
We have Kitty vs Nova, Goth Girl, Sebastian Shaw, Emma and Perfection. It ain't happening.
Originally posted by ExodusCloakEmma isn't evil, she's insane. The "Hellfire Club" represent aspects of her fractured psyche. Her insecurities are embodied by Cassandra Nova's constant belittling of her. Her grief over her many lost students is embodied by Negasonic Teenage Warhead. Her villainous past is represented by Sebastian Shaw. And my prediction is Perfection will look just like Jean Grey - ironically her ideal... and something she can never be for the one she loves. Well imo anyways... I don't want her to be a villain again.
That's not going to happen, Emma ain't evil!! (Fine I'm in denial, but Joss Whedon is Joss Whedon)We have Kitty vs Nova, Goth Girl, Sebastian Shaw, Emma and Perfection. It ain't happening.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Emma isn't evil, she's insane. The "Hellfire Club" represent aspects of her fractured psyche. Her insecurities are embodied by Cassandra Nova's constant belittling of her. Her grief over her many lost students is embodied by Negasonic Teenage Warhead. Her villainous past is represented by Sebastian Shaw. And my prediction is Perfection will look just like Jean Grey - ironically her ideal... and something she can never be for the one she loves. Well imo anyways... I don't want her to be a villain again.
Wow that's really interesting...funny enough I was thinking the same thing about Perfection. Emma has undergone so much change throughout her life to try and perfect herself, yet her envy towards Jean has always prevented her from becoming this person.(Hope they show us her Bug Room).
The only problem I have with that theory is that Jean is dead, and well perfection is apparently a real person...(It can't be Madelyne Pryor? She's suppose to be dead right?). It's someone who is wearing a White Glove.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Does it say that somewhere, cos I don't think any of them are "real" per se. I don't see how they just happen to be available for their chats with Emma or why they'd all randomly be on Genosha just because Danger is going there? I think they're just figments.
Hmm... maybe you're right, I was assuming Cassie was real due to their meeting in Genosha but I guess...Colossus fighting Shaw, Wolverine being a 6 year old girl, Beast Devolving even more, Kitty's ghost form and Scott's zombie coma could all be down to Emma's telepathy? That also seems like something Joss would do...and explain the reason why Emma asked Kitty to join the team. Plus it would explain Val Cooper's remark about Emma losing it and most importantly explain how the Hellfire Club knew each X-Man so well...
Originally posted by capt it up
This was the first time I have ever argued why thing went down. I normally just argue that wolverine can easiliy cut thing. I have never had a reason till now to argue why thing went down from a single hit. If I had been asked that before I would have answered earlier. also I have recently been studying martial arts styles so I kinda have that info in my head at the moment lol.
Okay, just wondering. Seems like that would be pretty important information to get out there early, so people understand why you keep saying Thing goes down. But I get ya.
But like someone pointed out below, Wolvie has no idea about Ben's physiology/anatomy. It's completely different from any human's. For all Wolvie knows, Ben's pressure points could be on his ass or something. So, when you think about it, even Wolvie's superior martial arts skill with pressure points really isn't applicable here.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
My father was stabbed numerous times in many places and also in shoulder by a crazy Somalian immigrant in a mall, and he was still awake when paramedics arrived. And I don't try to claim that my father has better damage soak then Thing...and no, he hasn't been stabbed something like three times before with no trouble. He had army training, and people learn to stand some pain there.What does Thing have? That's right, army training. Included with his time in Fantastic Four, where he had such things like:
Sentient dissolving his skin and hurting his insides TWICE, and he didn't faint.
Doctor Doom torturing him with different ways, such as beating him on so much that pieces of his skin were ripped off, and showed the muscles under them...didn't faint.
Doctor Doom also drove multiple pieces of magically enchanted roots through him in many places, inculding shoulder...didn't faint.
It was PIS, plain and simple. Like so many encounters Wolverine has with his fellow heroes...💃
that was a lot of words to say that thing has never been seen getting scewered on the spot several times in one sitting and not gone down....
nice try but no cigar... it's not PIS there's no standard set...
you're dad got stabbed okay... clean through in a nerve cluster?
Originally posted by jinzin
that was a lot of words to say that thing has never been seen getting scewered on the spot several times in one sitting and not gone down....nice try but no cigar... it's not PIS there's no standard set...
you're dad got stabbed okay... clean through in a nerve cluster?
What, nerve cluster, before I step on a soap box I hope you have an anatomy and physiology thing going on. Otherwise know that nerve clusters are freak'n everywhere on your body.
The stab was PIS with Ben's reaction, torture is more then associating pain with a sprained ankle.
Originally posted by jinzin
that was a lot of words to say that thing has never been seen getting scewered on the spot several times in one sitting and not gone down....nice try but no cigar... it's not PIS there's no standard set...
you're dad got stabbed okay... clean through in a nerve cluster?
Thing doesn't have similar physiology then a human does, so your nerve point is kind of moot. Even his insides are made out of rock, even though softer one. Wolverine has no way knowng where hing's nerves are, seeing as Reed Richards himself has taken time to map his body's anatomy.
Sorry. It's still PIS.
there's a cluster of nerves that connects along the outer rim of your pectoral muscle it runs along a strand of tendons that connect the pec to the shoulder... with the right technique applied if grabbed there you will beceome temporarily paralized from using that arm. there's nerves all over the body sure.. but clusters that cause such paralysis which are tought to well trained martial artists/military/etc etc are less well known... the fact that nerve clusters are everywhere in your body is exactly why arts such as hung gar were created in the firts place.. though it takes generally YEARS to become profecient enough to strike such vital points at a whim.
and again.. his reaction wasn't PIS.. he got ran straight through.. he was a bit shocked/surprised that it happened and he went down.. it didn't stop him from getting back up did it? no.. it didn't it just caused him to fall down in the moment.. like when one sprains their ankle...
as for the torture vs. sprained ankle thing.. i think you missed the point...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Thing doesn't have similar physiology then a human does, so your nerve point is kind of moot. Even his insides are made out of rock, even though softer one. Wolverine has no way knowng where hing's nerves are, seeing as Reed Richards himself has taken time to map his body's anatomy.Sorry. It's still PIS.
okay so your saying since things anatomy is different there's NO nerve clusters there? okay.. but have you taken into account that can swing both ways? what if there are other unknown vitals to you that reside there? ohhhhh but surely that can't be right? it HAS to be PIS since wolverine did it.. pfffft.. 🙄
and again.. yes his insides are differnt.. he still feels pain...
yes his insides are tougher... he still feels pain...
and this IS consistent with when wolverine has penetrated his skin.
Originally posted by jinzin
okay so your saying since things anatomy is different there's NO nerve clusters there? okay.. but have you taken into account that can swing both ways? what if there are other unknown vitals to you that reside there? ohhhhh but surely that can't be right? it HAS to be PIS since wolverine did it.. pfffft.. 🙄and again.. yes his insides are differnt.. he still feels pain...
yes his insides are tougher... he still feels pain...
and this IS consistent with when wolverine has penetrated his skin.
Dude, it dosent matter if wolverine did it or not. 😐
Heck if Namor stabbed ben in the shoulder with a knife or somthing and he fell down it would be PIS then also.
This has nothing to do with the fact that its wolverine, its the fact that being stabbed in the shoulder should not cause Ben to fall down in agonny ❌
Originally posted by jinzin
like being off balance shouldn't cause him to tip over? 😕please, I've seen your credibility where this matter is concerned...
And yet there has been no proof that he was off balance.
That and even if he was off balance Wolveirne kicking him is like getting a marsmellow thrown at you 😐