Capitalism, Socialism or Communism?

Originally posted by Bardock42
No, not at all....lack of ability is a much bigger issue. And the matter of fact is that it is harder for people of the "lower class"...they do have less chances. That's why a little bit of social welfare certainly has to be considered,

I thought you didn’t give a s***? But ok. So do you see poverty and lower classes as people having “less chance”? Does this mean that Capitalism creates inequality?

Originally posted by Atlantis001
Thats what I think. We don´t know how true communism, or socialism will work. What we have today are dictatorships using the name of communism and socialism, but these forms of government are not supposed to work like dictatorships.

That’s just a fact. Neither the USSR, North Korea or Cuba or other so-called Communist states ever were. The problem/challenge with communism/socialism is that it must be international for it to work.

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Originally posted by Atlantis001
Corruption is directly associated with centralization of power, thats where we must work on. Socialism try to work on that, capitalism do the opposite, it exists to centralize power.

Centralized types of government are usually the most corrupt, thats why there where a lot of corruption in the monarchies, and empires of the ancient times. A way to solve that problem to create a more fair government was the division into three administrative powers(legislative, judiciary, and executive), instead of having just one faction with all the power. It was a decentralization of the power that led us to a more fair form of government like the democracy we have today.

Capitalism works centralizing power in the hands of a few people. In other words, capitalism makes things run towards a dictatorship with these few people left with power being the dictators.

I’d have to agree with you there. Since Capitalism is based on profit and money, those who have the most have the most power. This becomes obvious when industrialists and corporative owners can demand “special treatment” from the government, or else they move their business “elsewhere”. This demand is in violation of the democratic “rules of engagement” so to speak.
When a big firm moves it may leave an entire town in financial and unemployed ruins. If it was run co-operatively it would be run and owned by the workers.

Originally posted by The Omega
I thought you didn’t give a s***? But ok. So do you see poverty and lower classes as people having “less chance”? Does this mean that Capitalism creates inequality?

You can't take everything I say serious. Most of it are jokes and/or bullshit. But I hardly lose sleep over some poor kids starving to death, that does not mean that I can't see that since we can we might as well keep them from dying. And it does hardly have anything to do with the economical system I prefer.

And no, Capitalism does not create inequality...the inequality is already there. Or are you seriously saying that everyone in a total anarchist "system" has equal chances? Haha...funny. No you don't.

Autocratic meritocracy.

The vast majority of the human populous are too ignorant or just naturally stupid to be allowed to choose who leads them...

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Autocratic meritocracy.

The vast majority of the human populous are too ignorant or just naturally stupid to be allowed to choose who leads them...

I agree. Education should be more than a priority.

People don´t even know what is better for them, and sometimes the concept of democracy is understood as "everyone should be equal independetly of merit". This way we can have people with no ability and education at all power.

I see my thread has caused a lot of thinking among people! shock 😊

Originally posted by Atlantis001
I agree. Education should be more than a priority.

People don´t even know what is better for them, and sometimes the concept of democracy is understood as "everyone should be equal independetly of merit". This way we can have people with no ability and education at all power.

Everyone tends to believe education all of a sudden makes your society enlightened! Proper application of intelligence/education is useful, education just to educate is fairly wasteful.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Haha, I understand you do not enjoy people calling you on the nonsense you write, but that's just actually not true. If you work hard and have good ideas you have every chance to advance your situation. There are still certain rules in place, it's not a total anarchy just a very slim government. And if you have some skill that will be able to make money you will get money, that just doesn't apply to 95% of the people, well, if you are an idiot and can't add anything productive you don't deserve luxuries people that can have.

So whatever i write tends to have more grounds for an argument, seeing how I actually bothered to read the ideology of Communism and Capitalism.

Originally posted by Soleran
While that may be true to a certain degree, your comment utterly victimizes and sends a message that no matter what you do, you're stuck and its us vs them.

This maybe true for some people, yet I am also constantly amazed when people stop making excuses and playing the victim role that things can change rather quickly with positive financial results.

In order to make money you depend on the upper class to employ you. And its up to THEM the money you are going to get. If you complain against it too much, they can fire you, because there is ALWAYS workforce adn there is ALWAYS someone who is willing to do what you are not.

Social mobility is very difficult in the truly capitalist countries.

A lot of countries in europe have adopted so many socialist ideas - free education, free health care, social welfare, grants for universities, grants for children with worse socio-economic background, free access to everyone to this and that... are ALL socialist ideas.
A truly capitalist country (i could freely say America?) does not have these things, and does not have ''rules'' which are on one level or the other making everyone equal.

Capitalism recognises and thrives on exploitation. Its the very core of capitalism. Certain things just cannot be allowed in order for Capitalism to work.

I'd just like to say this.

When comparing Capitalism and Communism, all you need to look at are countries like PDRK and the Korean Republic. The KR has a many more resources, money, power and technology. Whereas PDRK doesn't.

Another example is USA and China. USA is a horrible country where the mentally unstable don't get jobs because of it, can't get medical treatment because it's too expensive for them, can't get houses because of debt and other money problems. You know what treatment they do have? Go on, guess. Well, as most of you know, there are shops (stores) in USA that sell GUNS! 😱 So do the math, Psycho + Cheap Gun + People making fun of psycho = Dead people. 😐
However, China isn't that good either. Because of it's poor industry (thanks to communism), their economy could collapse any minute, which would make a dramatic decrease in the world's economy. And then millions of people (across the world) could lose their jobs! shock We would also lose our jobs if USA fails, which (again) it could do any minute! So don't go Capitalist or Communist, they are BOTH bad systems. We need to help people, and make sure everyone is doing their part in society. It's the smart choice. Socialism might have it's downfall aswell, but do you really want a system that's doomed for failure faster than you can say "I think we're losing money!". Socialism is better than Capitalism and Communism.

Now you can yell at me for being so wrong. 😄

Originally posted by lord xyz
I'd just like to say this.

When comparing Capitalism and Communism, all you need to look at are countries like PDRK and the Korean Republic. The KR has a many more resources, money, power and technology. Whereas PDRK doesn't.

Another example is USA and China. USA is a horrible country where the mentally unstable don't get jobs because of it, can't get medical treatment because it's too expensive for them, can't get houses because of debt and other money problems. You know what treatment they do have? Go on, guess. Well, as most of you know, there are shops (stores) in USA that sell GUNS! 😱 So do the math, Psycho + Cheap Gun + People making fun of psycho = Dead people. 😐
However, China isn't that good either. Because of it's poor industry (thanks to communism), their economy could collapse any minute, which would make a dramatic decrease in the world's economy. And then millions of people (across the world) could lose their jobs! shock We would also lose our jobs if USA fails, which (again) it could do any minute! So don't go Capitalist or Communist, they are BOTH bad systems. We need to help people, and make sure everyone is doing their part in society. It's the smart choice. Socialism might have it's downfall aswell, but do you really want a system that's doomed for failure faster than you can say "I think we're losing money!". Socialism is better than Capitalism and Communism.

Now you can yell at me for being so wrong. 😄

And where are you getting that 'their economy could collapse any minute' bit from?

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
You have never read Das Capital, so all you know about Capitalism, Communism and Socialism (or don't know) comes from guessing.

So whatever i write tends to have more grounds for an argument, seeing how I actually bothered to read the ideology of Communism and Capitalism.

And of course from people that read it and wrote about it, probably people whop have a better grasp of it than you too....

And what did you read about Capitalism?

Not an easy question to answer... There are so many variations: social democracy, libertarian socialism, parliamentarry socialists, direct/liberal democracy... Most communist states refer to themselves as socialist. According to Marx, capitalism will lead to revolution and ultimately communism. America is a thriving economy, but the inequalities in wealth distribution continue to rise, monoplies, unemployment, etc.... Communism is to ideal, not very realistic. Capitalism isn't going any where, it will continue to thrive... Man is greedy, and will devour this planet, until there is nothing left.

Originally posted by lord xyz
OK, first, Socialism is not Communism.

second, which do you think is best? Capitalism, (making poeple work for their money) Socialism, (helping eachother) Communism, (keeping everyone the same).

Personally I am for Socialism. thumbup

Socialism refers to a broad array of doctrines or political movements that envisage a socio-economic system in which property and the distribution of wealth are subject to social control. [1] As an economic system, socialism is usually associated with state or collective ownership of the means of production. This control, according to socialists, may be either direct, exercised through popular collectives such as workers' councils, or it may be indirect, exercised on behalf of the people by the state.

Communism is a political ideology that seeks to establish a future classless, stateless social organization based upon common ownership of the means of production. It can be classified as a branch of the broader socialist movement. Communism also refers to a variety of political movements which claim the establishment of such a social organization as their ultimate goal.

Now that the definitions are correct everybody can make an informed decision. My vote is for Capitalism because I'm a business owner and under Socialism over half of my earnings would go back to the government as taxes. I like the idea of "survival of the fittest". I've worked hard for what I have and don't like the idea of wealth redistribution.

Capitalism works, communism is a failure, and socialism isn't far behind.